control channels questions.

[Mikeg5513]

Where I work at, we use an 800mhz Edacs trunk system. I used to have the correct control channels programmed into my pro-95 and everything was fine until.....

...About a month ago my company switched to new frequencies. I brought my frequency counter to work the other day, and keyed up the MIC on my base station several times. I obtained 9 different frequencies. If I remember correctly there should be 10??

Here is my question. Those 9 frequencies should be the ones I program into my scanner correct?
I looked on the database here on RR and its not updated to the new system, only the old list of control channels are listed.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Mike

 

[GTR8000]

The trouble with EDACS systems is that you need to know the exact LCN order, not just the frequencies or control channels. Every frequency must be entered in the correct channel order for the system to track properly with a scanner.

Are you referring to this system?

Parma Trunking System, Parma, Ohio - Scanner Frequencies

That system was rebanded a few months ago. The new frequencies are exactly 15 MHz lower than the old frequencies, so they are now in the 851-853 range instead of the 866-868 range. Here are the new frequencies:

851.4625
851.7375
852.1000
852.4000
852.6750
853.1500
853.4625
853.8750
853.9375
853.6250

ULS Application - PubSafty/SpecEmer/PubSaftyNtlPlan,806-817/851-862MHz,Trunked - 0004896211 - PARMA, CITY OF - Frequency Summary

ULS License - PubSafty/SpecEmer/PubSaftyNtlPlan,806-817/851-862MHz,Trunked License - WNQL533 - PARMA, CITY OF - Frequencies Summary

You still need to figure out what the LCN order is. It's possible that you got lucky and they assigned them in numerical order, which means you simply start with 851.4625 as LCN 01 and go from there until you get to 853.6250 as LCN 10.

 

[GTR8000]

Upon further review, it looks like they may've switched from EDACS to P25. If that's the case, you will need a digital scanner to monitor it.

Parma (Project 25) Trunking System, Parma, Ohio - Scanner Frequencies

http://forums.radioreference.com/oh...30671-parma-cuyahoga-county-project-25-a.html

 

[Mikeg5513]

No, thats not the system I am trying to scan. I am trying to scan the Arcelormittal system. I just edited my post because I noticed I was missing a frequency.

 

[GTR8000]

Ah okay, gotcha.

Looks like they changed frequencies also.

ULS Application - Business/Industrial/Land Trans, 809-824/854-869 MHz, Trunked - 0004904832 - ArcelorMittal Cleveland Inc. - Frequency Summary

861.3375
861.5875
862.1625
862.2125
862.4125
862.4375
862.6125
862.6375
862.6625
862.6875

Everything else I said about EDACS still applies. You need to figure out the correct LCN order for each frequency.

 

[Mikeg5513]

Thanks for pulling those frequencies up for me.. however they are not the same ones I got when using my frequency counter.

I know on the old system the LCN was in numerical order. Im only assuming the new system is the same way.

 

[GTR8000]

If you found frequencies in the 816-817 MHz range, then those are the mobile/control station frequencies, not the repeater outputs. The list of 861-862 frequencies I posted above should be the correct ones. If the frequencies you found were in the 816-817 range, add 45 MHz to each one and see if they match the list I posted.

The frequency counter method can be a little inexact. Since their license was just modified in the past couple of months, it stands to reason that is the correct list of frequencies they are now using.

 

[Mikeg5513]

I did indeed find 9 freqs in the 816-817 range. When I add 45 mhz, they come really close. I added the list of ten you supplied into my scanner in numerical order. I am receiving some transmissions, but I know its not trunking. I think when I go back to work on Wednesday, I'm going to have to ask the radio guy for the correct order of control channels.

 

[DickH]

... the correct order of control channels.

Just a clarification. Only ONE of the freqs. is the active control channel. The control channel is the freq. used to send data to and from the radios. The other freqs. are the VOICE channels.

 

[GTR8000]

Dick is right, only one of those frequencies will be the active control channel at any given time. But, that's irrelevant, because you still need to know the proper order of EVERY frequency in the system. All 10 of them, otherwise you won't be able to properly track the system.

Ask the radio guy what frequency corresponds to what LCN. Then you can submit the updated info to the database, once you're sure the system is scanning properly.

 

[RoninJoliet]

If you know anyone in your area with a Uniden HP-1 scanner and the "extreme upgrade" he can put those freqys in and it will arrange them in proper order....

 

[DickH]

C'mon guys, it's not ORDER. LCN is Logical Channel N U M B E R. In some systems the freqs. are in order (like 1,2,3,4 etc.) but in many systems there is no ORDER to the channels the freqs. are in. It could be 1, 7, 8, 12, 15 .... In fact, I've seen one start in channel 14.

 

[GTR8000]

Are you really still on this crusade? Give it a rest already. It's very simple, Dick: The LCN's must be entered in the proper ORDER in the scanner. What part of that is so difficult for you to comprehend?

 

[Thayne]

Are you really still on this crusade? Give it a rest already. It's very simple, Dick: The LCN's must be entered in the proper ORDER in the scanner. What part of that is so difficult for you to comprehend?

Well, at least it can be said you are BOTH right--which is more than anyone can say about politicians

 

[Mikeg5513]

If you know anyone in your area with a Uniden HP-1 scanner and the "extreme upgrade" he can put those freqys in and it will arrange them in proper order....

Thanks for the heads up on the scanner model. Unfortunately, no I don't know any one.

 

[RoninJoliet]

Well, if its a small system and u have alot of scanners u can pgm in a freqy in each one and as they talk hope it goes in succession, i did that here when my county (Will Co Ill) got two new channels to make (8), and they did invert the last two which were not like usual "low to "high....

 

[ecps92]

Isn't 1-7-8-12-15 still in a numerical order? ie: Sequentially increasing.

C'mon guys, it's not ORDER. LCN is Logical Channel N U M B E R. In some systems the freqs. are in order (like 1,2,3,4 etc.) but in many systems there is no ORDER to the channels the freqs. are in. It could be 1, 7, 8, 12, 15 .... In fact, I've seen one start in channel 14.

 

[dave3825]

I remember having to have the first freq spot empty. I just opened my win95 and loaded an edacs system, and looking at the freqs, the first slot is indeed 0.000 followed by 14 866-868 freqs. So it looks like the first lcn slot stays empty.


Quoted on page 23 in the link below.
For the scanner to correctly switch to an active
frequency, you must program the frequencies in LCN order, starting
with Memory 01, not 00
http://tinyurl.com/7fvusjw

Then there's this thread that explains the same thing.
http://forums.radioreference.com/ha...63-programming-edacs-pro-95-a.html#post271069

 

[DickH]

Isn't 1-7-8-12-15 still in a numerical order? ie: Sequentially increasing.

No, that's numerical DIS-order.