• To anyone looking to acquire commercial radio programming software:

    Please do not make requests for copies of radio programming software which is sold (or was sold) by the manufacturer for any monetary value. All requests will be deleted and a forum infraction issued. Making a request such as this is attempting to engage in software piracy and this forum cannot be involved or associated with this activity. The same goes for any private transaction via Private Message. Even if you attempt to engage in this activity in PM's we will still enforce the forum rules. Your PM's are not private and the administration has the right to read them if there's a hint to criminal activity.

    If you are having trouble legally obtaining software please state so. We do not want any hurt feelings when your vague post is mistaken for a free request. It is YOUR responsibility to properly word your request.

    To obtain Motorola software see the Sticky in the Motorola forum.

    The various other vendors often permit their dealers to sell the software online (i.e., Kenwood). Please use Google or some other search engine to find a dealer that sells the software. Typically each series or individual radio requires its own software package. Often the Kenwood software is less than $100 so don't be a cheapskate; just purchase it.

    For M/A Com/Harris/GE, etc: there are two software packages that program all current and past radios. One package is for conventional programming and the other for trunked programming. The trunked package is in upwards of $2,500. The conventional package is more reasonable though is still several hundred dollars. The benefit is you do not need multiple versions for each radio (unlike Motorola).

    This is a large and very visible forum. We cannot jeopardize the ability to provide the RadioReference services by allowing this activity to occur. Please respect this.

Conventional Repeater Offset for TK-980?

Status
Not open for further replies.

DeoVindice

P25 Underground
Joined
Sep 27, 2019
Messages
453
Location
Gadsden Purchase
I'm working on reprogramming some old TK-980s for my employer, in an attempt to fix the most boneheaded radio system I've ever seen (800 MHz system with a repeater located behind a hill in a corner of the property, in hilly terrain, no talkaround). My main goal is to program in a talkaround so personnel away from the repeater can communicate. The repeater is completely inaccessible from much of the site and cell service is unavailable, so reliable communication just isn't possible. This has become a life safety issue and management is unwilling to pay our radio shop to reprogram the newer radios (9180s and NX-420s), so the pile of 980s and 930s I found covered in dust in a back corner of the parts room is basically my only hope.

Management does not know the frequencies used, but a coworker with a scanner determined the frequencies in use to be 860.5625 repeater input and 815.5625 repeater output. KPG-49D only allows TK-980s to be programmed as trunking models, and there is no RX/TX frequency programming field, only "FCC Channel". How do I go about programming in a repeater offset?
 

N5XPM

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
211
Location
Texas
I'm working on reprogramming some old TK-980s for my employer, in an attempt to fix the most boneheaded radio system I've ever seen (800 MHz system with a repeater located behind a hill in a corner of the property, in hilly terrain, no talkaround). My main goal is to program in a talkaround so personnel away from the repeater can communicate. The repeater is completely inaccessible from much of the site and cell service is unavailable, so reliable communication just isn't possible. This has become a life safety issue and management is unwilling to pay our radio shop to reprogram the newer radios (9180s and NX-420s), so the pile of 980s and 930s I found covered in dust in a back corner of the parts room is basically my only hope.

Management does not know the frequencies used, but a coworker with a scanner determined the frequencies in use to be 860.5625 repeater input and 815.5625 repeater output. KPG-49D only allows TK-980s to be programmed as trunking models, and there is no RX/TX frequency programming field, only "FCC Channel". How do I go about programming in a repeater offset?


TK 980 does have conventional capability. ( TK-980 | Land Mobile Radio | Communications | KENWOOD China ). FCC license information would be really helpful here to get it right. If you have the frequency, but not the CTCSS (if conventional) you will become frustrated.
 

mmckenna

I ♥ Ø
Joined
Jul 27, 2005
Messages
23,618
Location
Hiding in a coffee shop.
Pulling up that frequency pair on the FCC site for New Mexico only shows 2 SMR licenses. You ain't an SMR. If the system was installed by a shop for your company, then you'll need to talk to them. Talk around on these types of systems can cause issues. You don't want to set it up incorrectly.

I'd not trust someone with a scanner on this. With rebanding and everything else, you'd really want to make sure you were getting the correct info before programming any radios.

If you don't feel comfortable posting details on line, feel free to PM me and I'll see what I can do to assist.
 

N5XPM

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
211
Location
Texas
I performed an FCC search on 815.5625 and 860.5625 in New Mexico (if that is where the location is).
Normally the 800 Mhz systems transmit on the higher frequency (860.5625)
860.5625 is licensed to Nextel, and is in either the "guard" or expansion band (forget which).
Hard to find a repeater to work "backwards" like that in the 800 Mhz bands.
Lets just say I wouldn't program a radio to talk on that frequency and would want to research the correct frequency more carefully.
 

DeoVindice

P25 Underground
Joined
Sep 27, 2019
Messages
453
Location
Gadsden Purchase
Pulling up that frequency pair on the FCC site for New Mexico only shows 2 SMR licenses. You ain't an SMR. If the system was installed by a shop for your company, then you'll need to talk to them. Talk around on these types of systems can cause issues. You don't want to set it up incorrectly.

I'd not trust someone with a scanner on this. With rebanding and everything else, you'd really want to make sure you were getting the correct info before programming any radios.

If you don't feel comfortable posting details on line, feel free to PM me and I'll see what I can do to assist.

The frequency is licensed to Specialty Communications (WNIB982); they sell the company radios to use on rented frequencies. Regarding the scanner, I'll verify the repeater output frequency and already know the CTCSS tones. Company management really has no interest in going through the radio shop because of programming fees; this company is planning to shut one of its two sites in the area and is trying to cut costs severely.

What ticks me off severely is that my employer has licensed a few UHF frequencies as well, but doesn't appear to utilize them. They'd be much happier with a conventional UHF system, but I'd probably have to fund that myself which isn't happening. The other alternative is CB for communications in the pit; I'm not opposed to that if I can scrounge enough functional transceivers.

You can check the Talkaround box under Group Data edit to go direct simplex, and umm, I'd really be checking on that license.

Thank you. Between a horrendous glare headache and having just worked 11+ hours, I wasn't at my mental best last night! What's confusing me is that KPG-49D doesn't appear to allow programming a separate RX and TX frequency on a conventional system. I'm quite familiar with programming Kenwood conventional radios; this 800MHz stuff is new to me, as is trunking.
 

ecps92

Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2002
Messages
14,360
Location
Taxachusetts
So you are going to modify radios to/from what the Owner [Licensee] has authorized you to have.

Not a smart move, the Radio Shop owns the license and you should look toward the UHF option as they is what you are licensed for

Touching / modifying someone elses product is similar to borrowing someones car without permission and getting it painted

The frequency is licensed to Specialty Communications (WNIB982); they sell the company radios to use on rented frequencies. Regarding the scanner, I'll verify the repeater output frequency and already know the CTCSS tones. Company management really has no interest in going through the radio shop because of programming fees; this company is planning to shut one of its two sites in the area and is trying to cut costs severely.

What ticks me off severely is that my employer has licensed a few UHF frequencies as well, but doesn't appear to utilize them. They'd be much happier with a conventional UHF system, but I'd probably have to fund that myself which isn't happening. The other alternative is CB for communications in the pit; I'm not opposed to that if I can scrounge enough functional transceivers.



Thank you. Between a horrendous glare headache and having just worked 11+ hours, I wasn't at my mental best last night! What's confusing me is that KPG-49D doesn't appear to allow programming a separate RX and TX frequency on a conventional system. I'm quite familiar with programming Kenwood conventional radios; this 800MHz stuff is new to me, as is trunking.
 

DeoVindice

P25 Underground
Joined
Sep 27, 2019
Messages
453
Location
Gadsden Purchase
So you are going to modify radios to/from what the Owner [Licensee] has authorized you to have.

Not a smart move, the Radio Shop owns the license and you should look toward the UHF option as they is what you are licensed for

Touching / modifying someone elses product is similar to borrowing someones car without permission and getting it painted

Yeah, between that and the fact that I cannot figure out programming a trunking-capable radio, I'm just going to drop the whole issue.

There is absolutely no way that they will consider going to UHF. If having the shop reprogram a radio for $25 is too much, buying new radios is out of the question even if a properly-designed system will improve performance. It's very disappointing, because radios are a life safety issue when operating in proximity to mobile equipment.
 

kc4jgc

Member
Joined
Mar 7, 2004
Messages
1,546
Location
Virginia Beach, VA
Just like corporate bean counters who want to accomplish something but have no means to accomplish the goal. Blows the mind that they apparently PAID to have assigned freqs but have no desire to use them? I agree with you: advise you can't help them due to unreasonable restrictions imposed.
 

DeoVindice

P25 Underground
Joined
Sep 27, 2019
Messages
453
Location
Gadsden Purchase
If I were a betting fellow the reason the BOSS does not want the RADIO SHOP involved is he knows they will want money for repeater use and does not want to pay for that either.

The repeater is an older Motorola unit located on-site (our other site uses a MASTR II). The shop does own numerous repeaters located on a ridge, but our radios do not utilize them.

Unsure whose idea it was to use an 800MHz system...the company has licenses for 100 mobile radios at 100W ERP on two separate UHF repeater pairs covering both sites I work on. Building a great, or at least serviceable system, would be straightforward if they just used those licenses, and the propagation characteristics would be a better fit as well.
 

N5XPM

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2011
Messages
211
Location
Texas
From a licensing perspective, talk around is not licensed, so it shouldn’t be programmed or used. Buying some used TK 880s instead and using the UHF licenses instead should payout in 6 months or so per radio by avoiding the repeater fees.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top