Couple Questions about Ham

[mmckenna]

True, however the Baofang's are not type accepted for MURS. MURS requires no more than 2 watts, and that means that a 5 watt radio turned down to 1 watt isn't legal. Also, I'm pretty sure MURS radios can't be programmable for anything else.

But, like was said, who's going to know…. 1500 miles at 65-70mph, using a 1 watt radio is going to put you out of range of most people in short order. However, if rules are out the window, then Marine VHF would be a solution. Not a legal one, but a solution none the less.

 

[k6cpo]

I can't believe there are people here advocating that the OP actually do something illegal. It's this kind of attitude that led to the Citizens Band being the wasteland that it is.

Since you're getting pushback from the other drivers about external antennas, I'd abandon the idea of radios and stick with cell phones. Of course, you might have trouble with coverage depending on where your trip takes you and you'd have to observe hand-free laws.

 

[mmckenna]

I can't believe there are people here advocating that the OP actually do something illegal. It's this kind of attitude that led to the Citizens Band being the wasteland that it is.

A disturbingly large portion of the population seem to have the attitude that it's "only illegal if you get caught", or worse "everyone else does it, therefore it's OK".

 

[FrozenPhoenix]

Hi all,

I convinced the rest of the group to use external antennas. I have been looking at antennas and noticed they list certain frequency ranges. However the Baofeng has more frequency ranges than these antennas. I heard something about the radio getting fried if one was to go outside these ranges; is this true? If the antenna is for 430mhz-450mhz, would using it outside these frequencies cause any damage to the radio? Would I still have the increased range of the external antenna?

Thanks

 

[mmckenna]

Hi all,

I convinced the rest of the group to use external antennas. I have been looking at antennas and noticed they list certain frequency ranges. However the Baofeng has more frequency ranges than these antennas. I heard something about the radio getting fried if one was to go outside these ranges; is this true? If the antenna is for 430mhz-450mhz, would using it outside these frequencies cause any damage to the radio? Would I still have the increased range of the external antenna?

Thanks

Yes, it could. Antennas are tuned elements, and they work best on a certain frequency (or frequencies for multi-band antennas). Usually being a bit outside the design isn't going to be catastrophic, but there really isn't any point in doing that.

What you need to do is figure out what frequency you are going to use, and choose an antenna based on that. Stick to that frequency.
You could try a dual band antenna to give you access to portions of the VHF and UHF bands, but you are not going to find an antenna that will cover the full range of that radio.

What you could do is to choose a basic quarter wave antenna. Quarter wave antennas are very broad banded. One tuned for a portion of the VHF band would safely cover a lot of spectrum. If you choose a higher gain antenna, you will loose some of that bandwidth.

I've put basic 1/4 wave VHF antennas on antenna analyzers and they are useable from well below the 2 meter amateur band well up into the 170MHz band with acceptable SWR/Return loss.

So, get a magnetic mount base with an NMO mount and the right connector to match the one on your radio. Get a 1/4 wave antenna that is designed for the frequency/band you want to use.

 

[Ed_Seedhouse]

Hi all,

I convinced the rest of the group to use external antennas. I have been looking at antennas and noticed they list certain frequency ranges. However the Baofeng has more frequency ranges than these antennas. I heard something about the radio getting fried if one was to go outside these ranges; is this true? If the antenna is for 430mhz-450mhz, would using it outside these frequencies cause any damage to the radio? Would I still have the increased range of the external antenna?

Magnet mount antennas for the two meter band are cheap and many can be found for sale on the internet. As long as your car has a metal roof they will be fine if sold for the band you wish to use. For a bit more you can get a dual band antenna for two meters and 70 centimeters. If your car doesn't have a metal roof things will be a bit more complicated.

Using an antenna to transmit outside it's intended bandwidth will usually cause the transmitter to cut back it's power output so the range will be reduced. Also what power does go out will be partially wasted because of the impedance mismatch.

For pure reception this doesn't matter much if at all, but once you start transmitting you have to make sure your antenna is designed for the frequencies you are using.

 

[ericingersoll]

I wouldn't advise to operate illegal, that being said, while I understand why one would see operating on MURS freq's with a Wouxon or Baofang as being "illegal", I don't understand how. Motorola sells FRS/GMRS radios, which would be "illegal" for a non-licensed GMRS user to use, that being said, there are HF radios capable of transmitting on CB freq's, and dual bands capable of transmitting on p.s. freq's. So a statement saying its not legal or authorized to use MURS freq's on a Baofang or Wouxon or whatever seems backwards. As long as you don't violate the power and antenna restriction in place, what is the difference? Just like on ham, certain bands have certain power restrictions, but just because a radio is illegally being used because it CAN operate out of the restricted areas, that"s retarded. How is that advising someone to operate illegally? If he operates the radio on MURS freq's above the one watt setting, thats illegal, but if he operates with one watt, external antenna, proper bandwidth, what rule or law is being violated?

 

[ericingersoll]

A disturbingly large portion of the population seem to have the attitude that it's "only illegal if you get caught", or worse "everyone else does it, therefore it's OK".

i don't believe operating MURS on a chinese dual bander at one watt, proper bandwidth, ext. antenna would be illegal, and would not advise if it were.

 

[ericingersoll]

Hi all,

I convinced the rest of the group to use external antennas. I have been looking at antennas and noticed they list certain frequency ranges. However the Baofeng has more frequency ranges than these antennas. I heard something about the radio getting fried if one was to go outside these ranges; is this true? If the antenna is for 430mhz-450mhz, would using it outside these frequencies cause any damage to the radio? Would I still have the increased range of the external antenna?

Thanks

I just checked the FCC website regarding the MURS freq's. They are listed under part 95, and mention nothing about types of transmitter, just that you CANNOT exceed 2 watts and there are bandwidth restrictions, but you CAN use external antenna which will extend your coverage area dramatically, even at 1 watt. You CAN use a high gain mobile antenna (a little more $), which again will help with coverage, however, a stainless whip cut to the appropriate length (use an antenna calculator on google) will work fine for what you guys want to do. Good Luck and Happy Trails. BTW, get your license, you seem to be interested in radio enough, and there are SOOOO many op modes once you get even your tech. I am trying the sattelites now, but I got into antenna building, moonbounce and the usual repeater use, etc. Its a great hobby! You will not run out of things to try and do, that I guarantee!

 

[FrozenPhoenix]

Thanks mmckenna and Ed_Seedhouse for the antenna advice. I decided to go with a dual band antenna: Amazon.com: Tram 1185 Amateur Dual-Band Magnet Antenna: GPS & Navigation

 

[FrozenPhoenix]

ericingersoll, I think the use of this baofeng on Murs is not legal? Correct me if I am wrong.

Even if it were allowed, the antenna i got (link in above post), is for 144-149mhz, and MURS is 151.. Wouldn't this damage my radio?

 

[AK9R]

You can look up your radio in the FCC Equipment Authorization Database. If your radio has FCC certification, it will have a label on marked "FCC ID". If your radio doesn't have that label or a search of the database doesn't indicate that it's certificated for Part 95, it's not legal to use the radio on MURS or GMRS or FRS. Period. End of story. What you do with that information is up to you.

 

[zz0468]

Even if it were allowed, the antenna i got (link in above post), is for 144-149mhz, and MURS is 151.. Wouldn't this damage my radio?

It's very unlikely to damage your radio.

Stories of radio damage from using the wrong antenna are highly exaggerated. Yeah, it happens. But using an antenna that's slightly out of band on a low powered portable radio is not the instant kiss of death for the transmitter.

 

[Ed_Seedhouse]

Even if it were allowed, the antenna i got (link in above post), is for 144-149mhz, and MURS is 151.. Wouldn't this damage my radio?

Unless you are using an extremely cheap radio probably not. Modern transceivers usually have a "foldback" circuit that throttles the output power if the Standing Wave Ratio goes above around 1.5. So you would put out less power but it's unlikely anything really bad would happen.

Also 151 mhz is less than 5% above 144 mhz so the impedance mismatch would likely be quite small. Chances are you'd never notice the mismatch.

But it still wouldn't be legal to use a Ham Band Handheld on that frequency.

 

[Ghstwolf62]

A great antenna for amateur and outside of that band use is one designed to give the best of both.

Its by Comet and is called the Comet CA-2x4SR

Covers VHF and UHF. I believe the "SR" stands for "Search and Rescue" but may be mistaken.

 

[Seven-Delta-FortyOne]

I'm not sure what the group decided to do, but you got antennas for the amateur bands. Are all of the members in your group going to study and take the test, and pass it, before the road trip?

Bottom line, A handheld inside a vehicle is not going to give more than about 1/2 mile, no matter if it is 27MHZ, or 462MHZ, or anywhere in between.

If you decide to mount external antennas, which it seems you have, there are now a great deal of options, not just the ham bands.

Unlicensed: CB, probably your best choice
MURS

Licensed: Amateur
GMRS

Not Legal Under Any Circumstances: Marine Band




Delta

 

[milkman21218]

Why not just tune the antenna to murs? Clip 1/4" to 1/2" off the bottom of the whip it should work.

 

[FrozenPhoenix]

I took my test and have told the others to do so.

About MURS and GMRS, I am not sure if its a good idea to use those frequencies if its illegal.

 

[zz0468]

I took my test and have told the others to do so.

Very good! I assume you passed.

About MURS and GMRS, I am not sure if its a good idea to use those frequencies if its illegal.

Why don't you read the rules and determine for yourself what's legal. There are people all over the country using MURS and GMRS for what you want, perfectly legally. Both are covered under Part 95.

 

[Seven-Delta-FortyOne]

I took my test and have told the others to do so.

About MURS and GMRS, I am not sure if its a good idea to use those frequencies if its illegal.

:blink:

What do you mean?

MURS is license free.

GMRS is an $85 license, no test.




And CB has been used for over half a century for exactly what you're doing, and doing it well. No license required.

Sorry to keep beating the CB drum, I just think it has a use, and with the proliferation of cell-phones, it's little used these days.








Delta