Crossband Repeat Question

[srpawski]

Sorry if this is a stupid question.

I am in the process of setting up a SHTF box with a Kenwood TM-V71A on which I plan to use the crossband repeat function. I understand that the radio is set to announce my call sign every 10 minutes to meet FCC regs for repeaters. My question is which frequency does it announce on? If I am planning to use it to crossband into the local MCARES/ARES repeater, and that is the frequency that it is set on, will it announce also on that frequency, or is there a different one that I can program it to announce on to meet the regulations?

 

[N4LX]

Sorry if this is a stupid question.

I am in the process of setting up a SHTF box with a Kenwood TM-V71A on which I plan to use the crossband repeat function. I understand that the radio is set to announce my call sign every 10 minutes to meet FCC regs for repeaters. My question is which frequency does it announce on? If I am planning to use it to crossband into the local MCARES/ARES repeater, and that is the frequency that it is set on, will it announce also on that frequency, or is there a different one that I can program it to announce on to meet the regulations?

It will ID on the cross and output/transmit frequency of your radio. If the radio transmis on the repeater input frequency then your ID will be heard on the repeater's output. The radio's automatic ID function is not strictly necessary; your radio will only transmit when it receives your input signa so if you're identifying properly on the cross and input frequency that ID will satisfy the ID requirement for the cross and output as well.

 

[nd5y]

From what I have seen they ID on both bands, but I don't own one and I don't know if you can set it for one way repeat or to only ID on one band.

https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/retrie...rue&n=pt47.5.97&r=PART&ty=HTML#se47.5.97_1119 97.119 says a station must ID on all transmit frequencies. The type of station makes no difference.

 

[srpawski]

So really if it does in fact ID on the local repeater it really isn't that big of a deal. It's more of a potential annoyance to those monitoring it since they would have to hear not only the true repeater's ID, but mine.

I am awhile and a few hundred dollars away from getting this thing going yet but it was something that popped into my mind. Thank you all once again for your help.

 

[wrath]

Many repeater owners will request you don't enable the ID when you cross into them , also the radio will ID in CW unless you buy the optional voice module.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

 

[N4LX]

To help illustrate, let's assume the 2-meter repeater you wish to crossband into transmits (output) on 146.820 and receives (input) on 146.220; and you wish to use 445.775 as your crossband frequency. Because your radio is transmitting on 146.220 and 445.775, you are responsible for ID'ing on those frequencies. Let's say you're using an HT to crossband. When you identify using the HT on 445.775, the crossband repeater retransmits that ID on 146.220, satisfying your ID requirement for both bands on which you are operating a transmitter (the 2-meter repeater also repeats the ID on 146.820). Therefore, if you are the only one using your crossband repeater and you remember to identify yourself regularly, the automatic ID feature of the radio is unnecessary. Since the 2-meter repeater will repeater everything it receives on 146.220, the automatic ID would also be repeated on 146.820, which may be frowned upon.

Several years ago a local ham set up his new radio to crosswind into a repeater using the automatic ID function, which sent his call in CW through the repeater every 10 minutes for the better part of a weekend before correcting the issue. Needless to say, I don't believe he made any new friends that weekend. All this to say, the automatic ID function should probably be avoided when crossbanding into a repeater, certainly not without prior authorization from the control operator and then only if the ID is transmitted when the crossbanding radio itself has transmitted within the previous 10 minutes.

 

[hill]

The main issue is when retransmitting the repeater to your crossband frequency you need to id on it if receiving the repeater on it without transmitting for over ten minutes

 

[prcguy]

In general, it a bad idea to cross band to a repeater. Most repeater owners really frown on this and if something locks up in your remote and jams the main repeater for any length of time you will not be very popular. Plus some repeaters have a long hang time and during nets your remote may not unkey for most of the net for you to respond.

I cross band all the time from a UHF to 2m simplex frequency and I'm usually at the same location as the cross band to address any problems that may turn up. Some older Alinco and maybe other rigs allowed you to remotely turn the cross band repeat on and off, which solves a lot of problems but I'm not aware of any current radios with that remote control feature.
prcguy

 

[mrweather]

The V71A has remote control capability as well, including turning the x-band on/off, adjusting the output frequency, etc.

See page 85-86 of the owner's manual.

 

[MTS2000des]

In general, it a bad idea to cross band to a repeater. Most repeater owners really frown on this and if something locks up in your remote and jams the main repeater for any length of time you will not be very popular.

and it's always a good idea to ask a repeater owner/trustee/control operator if they want users to use cross-band/remote bases to access their system. Remember too, that the call sign of the repeater linked it is being re-transmitted over the remote base/cross band frequency. In case the repeater owner receives complaints, he can direct them to the appropriate source. Even if your remote base/cross-band IDs (which it should), it's just common courtesy to ASK before linking your "system" into someones network.

 

[hill]

Also not a good idea to crossband into repeater during busy times and nets, since ham radios aren 't designed to transmit continuously. In this area most of the nets don't really allow the repeater much time to drop and your radio will be transmitting the repeater output to your uhf link frequency all time and will heat up very quickly even on low power.

 

[N4GIX]

...and NEVER mistakenly cross-band two repeaters! Oops!

 

[jonwienke]

Also not a good idea to crossband into repeater during busy times and nets, since ham radios aren 't designed to transmit continuously.

That's not an issue if you are just trying to extend your HT range to get into a repeater. You crossband between the HT freq and the repeater input freq, and the only traffic going through the crossband is from your HT.

 

[prcguy]

I occasionally use a cross band repeater as a one way extender where I'm monitoring the output of the target repeater and only use the cross band to get a hand held into a distant repeater. I usually do this while camping and I'm within 100yrds of the cross band and monitoring the main repeater for any problems. It also allows you to use very low power transmit on the hand held extending its battery life.
prcguy

That's not an issue if you are just trying to extend your HT range to get into a repeater. You crossband between the HT freq and the repeater input freq, and the only traffic going through the crossband is from your HT.

 

[mrweather]

That's not an issue if you are just trying to extend your HT range to get into a repeater. You crossband between the HT freq and the repeater input freq, and the only traffic going through the crossband is from your HT.

A great option if you have a dual-band/dual-receive handheld.

 

[srpawski]

Thanks for the feedback all. I guess I didn't realize all of the stipulations to take into account when cross banding.

I am only using it when I am in range of monitoring it. I may put my go box in the dining room sunroom and sit in the living room to transmit on it, or put it just outside the back door so I will be near it to monitor it for any problems. It looks like, or at least I will assume, that my HT that I will be using is a TH-F6A dual band so I should be able to remote it on and off with DTMF tones. If so, thats a pretty sweet bonus I didn't even know existed.

Also, is it necessary when you ID while cross banding to announce that you are cross banding? Not sure if there is an FCC regulation on this or not.

 

[srpawski]

Yeah, I have a TH-F6A as my HT I plan to use with this setup. I also have 3 TH-K20As for simple 2 meter.

 

[N4GIX]

I occasionally use a cross band repeater as a one way extender where I'm monitoring the output of the target repeater and only use the cross band to get a hand held into a distant repeater.

I cross-band my local club's 2m repeater during our weekly net because it takes place during my dinner hour! This way I can use my UHF HT while in the kitchen fixing and eating dinner...

 

[wrath]

Just bear in mind when crossbanding DTMF control codes are only legal on UHF

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

 

[Thunderknight]

Just bear in mind when crossbanding DTMF control codes are only legal on UHF

Why? Can you cite which rule in part 97 says that? As far as I know, it's 2m and higher.