Digital Radio on Amatuer Radio

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n4voxgill

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The February, 2005 issue of QST magazine arrived today. The inside front cover is a full page ad for Icom hand held transceivers. The ICU82 is for UHF and the IC-V82 is for VHF. Both have an optinal digital board that will permit digital voice and data operation.

Really unique capability. Check it out.

It is not APCO25 compatible.
 

INDY72

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LOL greattttttttt now they have a version of ProVoice for HAM LOL.... that would kill monitoring ARES/SkyWarn if used for those purposes....

But that would also mean that every HAM on the net would need one, and as most HAM's are NOT rich.... this is a long way from being a nationwide phenom.... no offense is meant to any HAMS, as I am still planning on becomming one if I ever get the money and time.
 

n4voxgill

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It is not provoice. It can work on any repeater and talk to any other ham with or without a digital radio. In fact to gain most of the unique advantages of the digital radio you will work simplex not thru an analog repeater. If you and your friends get one of these you can set it up so you know who is calling on digital by name, you can send text messages that will enhance skywarn or other uses. You can block out a didgital user you don't want to talk to. I suggest that you read up on what all it will do. It will do anything an analog handheld will do, plus a whole lot more.

It is a real step up beyond APRS that is becoming a real standard for enhanced support for public service.
 

INDY72

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Thats where it gets sticky.. if its "becomming the standard for public service.. and its not compatable with APCO standards.. " You get the picture....

Since its unscannable,.. thats why I liken it to provoice.. or I could even say.. greatttttttt VSELP or iDen for HAM.... and how does one hear it on an analog rig if your on digital?

See its all about interop.. If everyone cant talk to each other HAM, or PS.... you get the picture?

Its all the same old sob story... I got a better system than you.. I am digital therefore I can tune you out...

Isnt HAM about hobbyist working together????? Or is HAM degenerating into I am better than you cause I have more money and since your broke,.. you SOL????

As I siad, I am not trying to flame HAM's but when I see this type of thing,.. unless someone can explain how its helping EVERYONE that is HAM ...
 

n4voxgill

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Voice is nice, and these units can interoperate with any other ham radio. But there are times when you can do better with non-voice, i.e. digital modes for location, pre-set messages that allow for faster communications. There is no elite, it is using technology to be more efficient and/or to experiment with new. APRS works a lot better than two tin cans and a string.
 

INDY72

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OK so there is no digital voice? Just data.... Now that I can understand....

and who wants to hear data blowing your speakers on a scanner?
Thanks, see I can learn a lil more every day.
 

CCHLLM

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Judging from the steaming, smelly stink you get for just mentioning putting CTCSS on a ham repeater, I can only imagine what will come out of this "new fangled" digital technology. Of course, I suppose there is some comfort in the knowledge that my old 5 kHz analog stuff will still be the going thing until it just quits from its own antiqueness.
 

Voyager

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n4voxgill said:
The February, 2005 issue of QST magazine arrived today. The inside front cover is a full page ad for Icom hand held transceivers. The ICU82 is for UHF and the IC-V82 is for VHF. Both have an optinal digital board that will permit digital voice and data operation.

Really unique capability. Check it out.

It is not APCO25 compatible.

Well, for it to be legal in the ham bands, it must use a format 'readily available to the public'. So, where is the format? Where can I DL a decoder?

Joe M.
 

loumaag

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Voyager said:
Well, for it to be legal in the ham bands, it must use a format 'readily available to the public'. So, where is the format? Where can I DL a decoder?
Open standard, AMBE.
 

STiMULi

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milf said:
Thats where it gets sticky.. if its "becomming the standard for public service.. and its not compatable with APCO standards.. " You get the picture....

Since its unscannable,.. thats why I liken it to provoice.. or I could even say.. greatttttttt VSELP or iDen for HAM.... and how does one hear it on an analog rig if your on digital?

See its all about interop.. If everyone cant talk to each other HAM, or PS.... you get the picture?

Its all the same old sob story... I got a better system than you.. I am digital therefore I can tune you out...

Isnt HAM about hobbyist working together????? Or is HAM degenerating into I am better than you cause I have more money and since your broke,.. you SOL????

As I siad, I am not trying to flame HAM's but when I see this type of thing,.. unless someone can explain how its helping EVERYONE that is HAM ...

Without flame I say these things...

I think that you are taking this in the most negative manner possible.

CTCSS is not ignore
niether is Digital.

It is just a mode capable of restricting your radio from presenting audio you choose not to hear.

As far as who has the most money it has always been like that.

Other exclusionary devices are:

You are not old enough.
You still have one of THOSE radios.
You don't know code?
This is a private repeater.
2m/440 is boring
APRS is a waste of a frequency and equipment

And so on...

It is up to us to adopt, adapt and learn and teach. Digital will gain popularity and will go up in price and will eventually come down in price.

Will it save Ham radio?? Maybe...

It will take lots of cash, interest and effort on the part of all hams to make the best use of it for our hobby and public service
 

brandon

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Few years ago in SLC, I heard lots of digital comms on a 2M simplex frequency. Sounded like P25... of course this was before the digital scanners were available so I have no idea whether they were hams or not.
 

nd5y

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milf said:
OK so there is no digital voice? Just data.... Now that I can understand.....

The way I understand it they can be digital data or voice.
The 2m HT and mobile radio are 11 kHz bandwidth
4.8 kb GMSK and the 1.2 GHz radio can run at that rate or 100 kHz bandwidth 128 kb.
The 2m mobile radio is just a standard FM radio with an optional
digital board and they all are capable of FM. The guy told me they have to be
manually switched btween analog & digital modes.
I haven't looked into it that much but Icom says D-STAR is an open standard
so I'm sure they would provide the techincal specifications if somebody requested them.

I haven't figured out if this is the same digital format that Alinco uses on a few of their radios.
 

loumaag

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It is apparent that this topic (amateur digital radio) is being reacted to in the manner all subjects dealing with ham radio, in a knee-jerk fashion. Everyone, who has an interest in ham radio, has an opinion. The advertisement mentioned by Gill seems to have generated some misunderstanding. I didn’t see this hue and cry raised when AOR introduced the ARD9800 for sale over a year ago, and it can be used on any radio. The ICOM D-STAR is certainly not a new topic, development on this began in 1998 and of course continues.

This type of reaction is seen every time a new mode or new technology is introduced to ham radio. Indeed, any change in the status quo is seen as something that is introducing the downfall of ham radio. Let’s review some milestones in amateur radio, all of which were supposed to bring a death knell to the hobby. Lets see, lowering the code speed required for HF privileges to 5 WPM, no-code technician licenses, incentive licensing, SSB (indeed voice of any kind!), RTTY (or really any of the so called digital modes now popular), etc. Each and every time some new facet to the hobby is brought to the forefront, someone is there to cry “It’ll be the end of the world!”

Every person involved in ham radio has an opinion, every mode its proponents and opponents, my opinion on some matters is different from yours, maybe on some things we may agree. The introduction of digital voice on the ham bands is no different than the introduction of any mode. Sure there will be people who monitor the digital signal and won’t be able to understand it, so what? There are plenty of things on the ham band’s I can hear but can’t understand, 25 WPM CW (indeed anything over about 10 wpm does me in :lol: ), ATV, SSTV, until recently PSK. Digital voice will either catch on or it won’t. If it catches on, in 25 years everyone will look at analog signals much the way most people look on AM; a curiosity, but a waste of spectrum.

There are already several digital repeaters on the air around the US, most using old APCO-25 equipment and hence can be monitored by the current digital scanners. Is the introduction of a consumer grade 2 meter, handheld, D-STAR capable radio a reason to cry out the end of monitoring 2 meters? No, milf take a deep breath, just as repeater control operators turn off PL tones during times of emergency to allow all the ancient radios to access repeaters, people are not going to use digital voice for Skywarn anytime in the near future. Gill, you need to take a deep breath also, digital voice will not work on any repeater, indeed almost no repeater will pass the signal. If for no other reason (and there are others), you can’t pass a CTCSS tone on a digital signal, so there isn’t going to be access to the input. Joe, just because you can’t download a decoder doesn’t mean it isn’t available to the general public; you can’t download a SSB decoder, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t available. Scott, whereas I agree with you that a lot of negativity has been involved in the thread and that with enough interest this might be beneficial in the Public Service aspect of the hobby, I don’t think anyone suggests that digital voice will save amateur radio. :wink:
 

SCPD

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Alinco was the first ham radio manufacturer I noticed to have digital capability. I don't recall the model number(s) from memory but they had HT's and mobile rigs that could do digital with the optional digital plug-in board. They debuted about three(?) years ago. The Alinco brand radios had to be manually switched from FM to digital. While in FM mode you could not decode digital and vice versa.

Once again my memory fails me but I think it's a V.32 standard(?). The open protocol and is meant for amateur radio operators to explore new modes of communication. The open protocol, to the best of my knowledge, is only available in the amateur radio market. As long as you have an amateur radio with digital capability you can monitor it.
 

K5MAR

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frootydawg said:
Alinco was the first ham radio manufacturer I noticed to have digital capability. I don't recall the model number(s) from memory but they had HT's and mobile rigs that could do digital with the optional digital plug-in board. They debuted about three(?) years ago.

That would be the DR-135/235/435 mobiles and the DJ-195/196/296/496/596 handhelds. I have the 135 and the 596, but have not tried the digital boards. AFAIK, the digital mode used is not the same as the one Icom uses.

Mark S.
 

STiMULi

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loumaag said:
I don’t think anyone suggests that digital voice will save amateur radio. :wink:

I think it will lead us closer to the saviour...

Software defined radio.

SDR will change the way we think about anything radio
 

loumaag

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STiMULi said:
SDR will change the way we think about anything radio
I will concede that point. SDR will be a dramatic departure from tickling a crystal with a cat's whisker. :)
 

HabboX

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D-Star format is an open standard that was developed by Icom at the request of the JARL. Although Icom developed it, the format is available to any manufacturer that wants to use it. D-Star utilizes a AMBE 2020 vocoder, I think may have been developed by DVSI.

"But that would also mean that every HAM on the net would need one, and as most HAM's are NOT rich.... this is a long way from being a nationwide phenom...."

I own an Icom IC-2200H with the UT-118 module which makes my 2-meter radio capable of transmitting digital voice and/or data. I purchased it for less than the price of a new digital capable radio scanner! I am not rich.

A normal 2-meter FM repeater will not work with D-Star digital voice. However, a third party is rumored to be developing a D-Star compatible repeater controller so there should be digital repeaters in the near future. 1.2 GHz D-Star repeaters are now available for around $7000, which also includes high-speed data that is not available on VHF frequencies (due to bandwidth restictions).

D-Star is not compatible with Alinco's digital voice format. Alinco also doesn't have a digital output, so building a digital repeater for an Alinco radio would be a task suited to only the most advanced and experienced builder.

I guess if you want to "scan" D-Star, then you could buy your own D-Star compatible radio.

More info at http://members.cox.net/ic-2200h/
 
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