Digital voice on GMRS

[12dbsinad]

No. It'll work. FCC has already granted an experimental license to a GMRS group to try DMR. It works fine.
Some just disagree. Rather strongly, as you've noticed.

If it "works fine", the FCC would have allowed it, but they didn't and they stated their reasons. They said it would be a cluster (followed by a nice little word). Of course DMR will work, I don't thing anyone really needs to test it. I believe it's a mere 1 experimental license. The people who don't like the idea are just agreeing with the FCC.

There, mmckenna, I just emptied my jug of gas onto the fire, should get things kickstarted back to normal. Oh my eyebrows!

 

[mmckenna]

There, mmckenna, I just emptied my jug of gas onto the fire, should get things kickstarted back to normal. Oh my eyebrows!

You might need some cream for that.

 

[RFI-EMI-GUY]

I doubt the FCC has ever turned down an experimental license in any two way service. If it is in the broadcast service, it would be scrutinized more closely. The issuance of any license by the FCC does not imply they have approved or recommend the technology.

 

[RFI-EMI-GUY]

I'm going to report this thread simply because it's giving me anxiety but yet I cannot look away.

Slow Train wrecks and rolling Dumpster Fires are hard to stop looking at.

 

[DeoVindice]

Last WORD.....

So Cal and preferably P25 since I have a dual mode Quantar on GMRS right now in analog only mode.

Hmm...mixed-mode with transmit steering could be interesting on GMRS as an interoperability measure. My business radios are capable of it but I've not had cause to test it.

If that repeater was going to be in my neck of the woods I'd definitely make use of it but user density here is probably too low to justify it. I haven't heard any other users on the SWCRS machines closest to me.

 

[alcahuete]

It’s funny.

We close a thread and we get complaints about violating someone’s first amendment rights and how we are censoring discussion.

We don’t close a thread because a member reports it for the following reason “Entire thread is a dead topic...” and we get chastised because somehow this thread breaks our rules and we should have closed it because he said so.

Sometimes you just can’t win.

Maybe because we don't just close a thread because one person reports it??? You could just ignore the thread and move on, but that's no fun I guess.

Thanks for your work, moderators!



As far as the experimental licenses, I have heard of the one in question. I wonder why more haven't been attempted? Is it a matter of people just not knowing, or is it a matter of applications being denied? I would think that in the entire country, there would be more than one.

Also, I wonder if the repeaters have to be Part 95 certified, or if that is also covered under the Part 95 experimental license? I know Kenwood makes a couple DMR repeaters, but I'm not sure if they are actually Part 95 certified or not. That would almost certainly leave most (if not all) P25 repeaters out of the question for using P25 on GMRS.

 

[12dbsinad]

Thanks for your work, moderators!



As far as the experimental licenses, I have heard of the one in question. I wonder why more haven't been attempted? Is it a matter of people just not knowing, or is it a matter of applications being denied? I would think that in the entire country, there would be more than one.

Also, I wonder if the repeaters have to be Part 95 certified, or if that is also covered under the Part 95 experimental license? I know Kenwood makes a couple DMR repeaters, but I'm not sure if they are actually Part 95 certified or not. That would almost certainly leave most (if not all) P25 repeaters out of the question for using P25 on GMRS.

I don't know of really any DMR or P25 repeater certified for part 95.

Then again, I would say probably 90 percent of existing GMRS analog repeaters aren't part 95 certified. This is why this part 95 crap gets in the way sometimes because you typically need to use commercial equipment when dealing with repeaters as choices are limited for 95 stuff.

 

[prcguy]

I suspect many Motorola digital repeaters are type accepted for part 95 in analog mode. I remember a project where we used an old Motorola Radius VHF radio as a marine shore station and then discovered it was not type accepted for part 80. After a couple of phone calls to Motorola and a short amount of time they got it FCC type accepted for part 80 marine use. I think Motorola gets their stuff certified for as many uses as possible.

I don't know of really any DMR or P25 repeater certified for part 95.

Then again, I would say probably 90 percent of existing GMRS analog repeaters aren't part 95 certified. This is why this part 95 crap gets in the way sometimes because you typically need to use commercial equipment when dealing with repeaters as choices are limited for 95 stuff.

 

[12dbsinad]

I suspect many Motorola digital repeaters are type accepted for part 95 in analog mode. I remember a project where we used an old Motorola Radius VHF radio as a marine shore station and then discovered it was not type accepted for part 80. After a couple of phone calls to Motorola and a short amount of time they got it FCC type accepted for part 80 marine use. I think Motorola gets their stuff certified for as many uses as possible.

It's possible, maybe someone with more knowledge of Motorola digital repeaters can chime in. I let the Motorola boat sail a long time ago so I'm not in the loop with those crooks anymore but I haven't heard of any.

 

[prcguy]

Quantars not type accepted specifically for Part 95, this is from the manual: FCC Designation (FCC Rule Parts 22, 74, 80, 90) Not sure if the Part 90 makes it legal for GMRS or not.

It's possible, maybe someone with more knowledge of Motorola digital repeaters can chime in. I let the Motorola boat sail a long time ago so I'm not in the loop with those crooks anymore but I haven't heard of any.

 

[mmckenna]

I know Kenwood makes a couple DMR repeaters, but I'm not sure if they are actually Part 95 certified or not. That would almost certainly leave most (if not all) P25 repeaters out of the question for using P25 on GMRS.

I ran the FCC ID's on a couple of the Kenwood repeaters.

The two UHF band split DMR repeaters, TKR-D810, do not have Part 95 on either bandsplit.
Same with the two UHF band split NXDN repeaters, NXR-810.

But….
The NXR-800 NXDN repeater (450MHz to 480MHz model) has Part 95 on Narrow and Wide analog as well as 6.25KHz and 12.5KHz NXDN.

FCC - OET EAS Form 731 Grant of Equipment Authorization

 

[mmckenna]

As far as the experimental licenses, I have heard of the one in question. I wonder why more haven't been attempted? Is it a matter of people just not knowing, or is it a matter of applications being denied? I would think that in the entire country, there would be more than one.

I think the hold up for most is the amount of detail that the FCC would require. If you look at the experimental license (linked to on the first page) you can read through all the documents and see their justifications for the experimental license. For all the smoke and cursing that went on earlier, it probably would have been useful for people to actually read it. They specifically talked about results of previous testing regarding how digital and analog were able to coexist. But I doubt that those that have already made up their minds would accept any of it.

Also, I wonder if the repeaters have to be Part 95 certified, or if that is also covered under the Part 95 experimental license? I know Kenwood makes a couple DMR repeaters, but I'm not sure if they are actually Part 95 certified or not. That would almost certainly leave most (if not all) P25 repeaters out of the question for using P25 on GMRS.

The experimental license covered this. They are using a Motorola SLR5700 (FCC ID: ABZ99FT4096) which does not have Part 95. They did a comparison of the Part 95 requirements to what the repeater was rated at, and the repeater exceeded the requirements. The FCC seemed to be OK with that.

In other words, the applicants did their homework.

It also shows them running 100 watts out of the repeater...

 

[mmckenna]

duplicate...

 

[jeepsandradios]

15 pages of this makes me laugh. There are guys all over running digital on GMRS. Those of us who wish to be legal don't do it but a lot of folks don't really care. When I was in NY I came across a lot of dmr and p25 simplex on GMRS channels. When radios are cheap and anyone does what they want its bound to happen. Really no different than the hunters on ham channels and the local DPW using Marine.

If we continue to educate and tell folks to follow the rules thats all that can be done. If the FCC changes the rules great I'll be the first to flip my Quantars all over to P25.

 

[Mike_G_D]

Keep this up, and I'll change it to spark gap transmitters only.

Spark gap! The ORIGINAL Spread Spectrum! Yeah!