Dps Mdt

[STiMULi]

I had the privilege of being pulled over on Saturday through Oracle (note the Avatar ) for excessive speed. Lucky for me (again x5) I was not cited for speeding. I did get a chance to discuss radio access with the officer and how he uses it.

He told me that he did not inform dispatch via radio (voice) of his intentions of pulling me over or my information gathered and had instead used ONLY the MDT. I asked him about the range and access of his MDT and he said that it works in most areas and is very reliable, even more reliable than his 2 way.

Do the MDTs use a cell based connection to communicate?

Anyone have more information or have I missed something in the AZ Scannists Bible (SWFD)?

 

[datainmotion]

In the US, most departments MDTs (or Mobile Data Terminals) use one of the following to connect to CAD/RMS:

3rd party cellular (i.e. - Cingular, Verizon, Sprint, T-Mobile, AllTel, etc.) with integrated, PC Card or external modems
Exisiting RF Infrastructure (i.e. - EDACS, Astro, etc.) with external modems
Standalone RF Networks (i.e. - MDS http://www.microwavedata.com/ ) with external modems
Agency owned/operated WiFi (although many times this just supplements a 3rd party cellular connection)

In your area as well as Phoenix Metro, I would guess most agencies use 3rd party cellular.

And when did you become a DBAdmin?:roll:

 

[STiMULi]

And when did you become a DBAdmin?:roll:

Yesterday. I offered, I asked and now it is my fault


Thanks for the info. I figured as such about the cellular. It was just that that particular area does not seem to get much service from anything including wireless. He was using Toughbook though

 

[datainmotion]

Yesterday. I offered, I asked and now it is my fault


Thanks for the info. I figured as such about the cellular. It was just that that particular area does not seem to get much service from anything including wireless. He was using Toughbook though

Good luck with that. Now you'll have to act like an adult.:roll: Fewer people for me to act childish with everyday. Damn.

 

[jasonpeoria911]

Golly who are these people pulling you over lol? 5 times without a speeding ticket. You wouldn't survive in IL, least not with the State Troopers. And yes, most MDT's use cell service. If you look closely, most squads will have a short little squiggly antenna like a cell antenna. I believe its for the MDT's.

Jason

 

[STiMULi]

I've have been a good boy most of the time. I drive a car that is always assumed to be a "Boy Ricer" and they expect a younger less mature person behind the wheel. I am not younger

It is a Subaru Impreza WRX STi and it is a blast to drive. Almost every officer states "I know your car is more capable to drive safely at those speeds but you need to slow down."

Having Veteran Plates probably doesn't hurt either

Then they see all the radios and they want to know more about it and what I do with them. It usually ends up a 15 minute BS session and I am on my way.

I try to be good but the devil in me comes out when I get to the twisties.

Too bad about the Cell MDTs. Uniden needs to come out with a Bearcat Scanner that indicates a signal. Wouldn't that be fun? Beep every single frickin' car that passes.

More fun in the boonies but probably wothless as how often do they really transmit anyway?

 

[DanRollman]

Anyone have more information or have I missed something in the AZ Scannists Bible (SWFD)?

Hi Scott,

Monitoring MDT data on a PC is "legally questionable" at best. Thus, like cellular and digital pager information, it's left out of SWFD. Not because having or sharing the information is prohibited (it's not), but because I made a business choice long ago to maintain my ability to suggest to any skeptical newbie interested in scanning that anything you find in SWFD's pages can be monitored.

Dan
www.ArizonaScanner.com

 

[STiMULi]

I do not want to monitor it. Data slicers, scanner mods, running software on a PC is not my game. No MDT or POCSAG decoding here.

But it would be nice to know the freq so if one where active around you you knew you were in the presence of the DPS.

I guess I'll have to out the old frequency counter then, if it goes that high.

Check out channel alert feature on the UNIDENs. It can be made to emulate the BearTracker feature on the BCT8 and the yet to be released BCT15. I want to put the freq in the new 996 when I get it. (again: NOT TO LISTEN TO IT )

I understand and respect your decision NOT to put it in the books however I my email or PM is not full, I think. .

I haven't bought the new book yet. Is Marana not in there either?

 

[AZScanner]

Just start searching the 800 band. MDT's are very distinctive and easy to find. If you have a uniden digital, turn off the digital card for a moment and listen to a raw p25 voice transmission. They sound like that would sound if you recorded it and played it back twice as fast.

When you find one, subtract 45MHz from it and program that in - that's the mobile side. Voila, instant cop detector... except that the data burst you pick up will likely be them running your plates, and by then A. You already know they are there and B. It's too late to slow down.

-AZ

 

[datainmotion]

Just start searching the 800 band. MDT's are very distinctive and easy to find. If you have a uniden digital, turn off the digital card for a moment and listen to a raw p25 voice transmission. They sound like that would sound if you recorded it and played it back twice as fast.

When you find one, subtract 45MHz from it and program that in - that's the mobile side. Voila, instant cop detector... except that the data burst you pick up will likely be them running your plates, and by then A. You already know they are there and B. It's too late to slow down.

-AZ

This method would only work if they were on a non-cellular system (i.e. - using their own radio net for data.

 

[STiMULi]

It seems that I have recieved two strong hints that they are not.

I would bet that it is not a big secret, I just have to do a little searching

 

[STiMULi]

Interesting things I found while on the hunt:

(The first number listed is the previous count. the second number is the current count [2004*] and the last number is the percentage change)

INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY

DPS Mobile Digital Terminals (MDT) Supported 229 224 -2.2%
MDT Transactions 814,445 712,425 -12.5%


TELECOMMUNICATIONS

Base Stations Maintained 781 589 -24.6%
Engineering Hours Provided to Other Agencies 166 Deleted Category
Other Agencies Supported in Radio Communications 20 17 -15.0%
Portable/Mobile Radios Maintained 7,380 9 28.1%
Radio Communication Sites Maintained 77 76 -1.3%
EMSCOM Call-Signs Maintained 1,151 1,198 4.1%
Number of Microwave Paths 85 84 -1.2%
Microwave Path Miles 3,509 3,542 0.9%
FCC Radio Licenses Maintained 472 468 -0.9%
Voice & Data Telecommunications * 1,163,500 1,238,233 6.4%
Wireless Telephone & Paging Services * 163,300 133,161 -18.5%

OPERATIONAL COMMUNICATIONS

Radio Dispatch Consoles Operated 18 18 0.0%
ACJIS Transactions Conducted 1,390,570 1,286,228 -7.5%
ACIC/NCIC Hits Processed 18,022 15,768 -12.5%

*The 2004 Annual Report
http://www.dps.state.az.us/reports/annualreport/AzDpsArFy2004.pdf

 

[STiMULi]

WAG for Tucson: 813

 

[datainmotion]

Once DPS releases there "death grip" on ACIC access, you'll see those MDT trans stats spike. For the last 10 years, DPS has made access to that info painful and slow for other LE agencies around the state. Kind of a "how to piss off your neighbors" model for other states.

 

[hulka]

I moved here from N.J. and the town I worked for as a radio tech. used to use a UHF channel. That system took a hit from lighting. They moved on to the latest and greatest at that time, ~ 3 years ago, CDPD. From the last I heard that they were having to switch out the modems again because CDPD is no longer going to be supported. I would assume they are using a cell service with gain antennas on the car.

Next time I pass one taking pictures on my way home from work I will take a closser look if I am not going to fast.

 

[DanRollman]

I understand and respect your decision NOT to put it in the books however I my email or PM is not full, I think. .

I haven't bought the new book yet. Is Marana not in there either?

Marana is in there, because they could decide at any time (or at any time the local media decided to make some waives, which in their laziness doubtful they will ever do) to go unencrypted, or partially-unencrypted.

I've never left information out just because the frequency is sometimes or always encrypted. Contrary to popular belief, monitoring encrypted signals is not illegal: Attempting to decrypt them is.

Dan
www.ArizonaScanner.com

 

[wupatki]

Once DPS releases there "death grip" on ACIC access, you'll see those MDT trans stats spike. For the last 10 years, DPS has made access to that info painful and slow for other LE agencies around the state. Kind of a "how to piss off your neighbors" model for other states.

You might want to be thankful to DPS for at least trying to keep a control on your personal information, not everyone is so protective of your identity.

Think about it this way, John Q. Public has a bone to pick with you and controls are lacking. Someone could do any number things to get your personal information. There are a number of ways for people to get questionable/illegal access to the system and they are hopefully being weeded out/cut off/or fixed. Indian Reservations with a makeshift trailer that has an access terminal right in plain view of the public and a suitcase lock on the front door are good examples. Some places that have access just have poor security control and let anyone with a nod of the head into "secured areas". If someone is going to have access to ACIC/NCIC/ACJIS or any of the other systems in use by Law Enforcement they need to have the proper training and security to use it. There's enough screwballs out there messing with our lives without giving them a key and a blind eye to do it.

The other thing that gets me is that MCSO Posse-man/Posse-woman have access to this system. I know plenty of MCSO Posse that are fine people looking to serve their community... BUT pretty much anyone can get into the posse with minimal effort, now you have a volunteer that you just gave access to a criminal information network and suddenly gee where did they get the address for that ex-girlfriend, guy that pissed them off driving home, or anyone else they feel like running in the system. Sure they Might get audited if anyone ever figures out they did something wrong but probably not. There's just too many people with access to our personal information as it is and very little accountability for missuse of it.

Just the other day I head an MCSO Sgt yelling at a Posse member on search-8 because he ran someone on East Dispatch and just identified himself with a name like "Bob". Apparently he was given the info but the Sgt told him he needed to give more information so they didn't have "Just Anyone" getting info from dispatch and knew it was a posse member. Where's the security there?

As for MDT's anything with access to ACIC/NCIC now has to be using encryption so the likelyhood of monitoring is almost zero. Getting to sit down in front of a unlocked system with access is another story!

JMHO

 

[AZScanner]

Heard a rumor that all MDT systems that have access to NCIC must be encrypted - it's a federal requirement for access to the system. But the issue here is not decoding, just simple reception of the mobile side of the system, similar to how Uniden Beartracker scanners scan the input side of known highway patrol frequencies and alert you of nearby transmissions. Because today's MDTs tend to "phone home" every so often to send dispatch the gps coordinates of the unit, they work well for this purpose.

I bet Motorola left that little tidbit out of the sales brochures, huh?

-AZ

 

[datainmotion]

Posse - ah yes - that Arizona throw back to the Old West. Geezers in marked units, right?

Anyway, DPS isn't protecting anything that isn't alraedy protected. They are just making access to it extremely slow for other LEs to access their little fifedom.

 

[datainmotion]

Heard a rumor that all MDT systems that have access to NCIC must be encrypted - it's a federal requirement for access to the system. Because today's MDTs tend to "phone home" every so often to send dispatch the gps coordinates of the unit, they work well for this purpose.

I bet Motorola left that little tidbit out of the sales brochures, huh? -AZ

The first part about encryption is true - NCIC access must go through an encrypted medium.

The second part is only true if the agency utilizes GPS/AVL, which requires additional hardware, whether externally or integrated into the laptop. Then on top of that, the CAD mobile client must support it.