DSD+ and DMR Tier 3

[seagravebuff60]

I'm monitoring this local DMR T3 (Hytera) System with DSD. The issue I'm having is that I can only hear half of the transmissions. From what I understand from DSD, and I still don't know a lot, I need to define the Channel IDs/LCNs/LSNs and the Frequencies in the .frequencies file in order to properly decode DMR Audio. I may be wrong. So I defined all the Channel IDs pertaining to the site im monitoring, turned on "Synthesize all Digital Voice", and set the volume all the way up...but I seem to still be missing some audio. Can someone point me in the right direction? I'm using the latest release of DSD

 

[mwjones]

What system are you trying to monitor?

Can you share the appropriate section of your DSDplus.frequencies file?

 

[Reconrider]

I'm monitoring this local DMR T3 (Hytera) System with DSD. The issue I'm having is that I can only hear half of the transmissions. From what I understand from DSD, and I still don't know a lot, I need to define the Channel IDs/LCNs/LSNs and the Frequencies in the .frequencies file in order to properly decode DMR Audio. I may be wrong. So I defined all the Channel IDs pertaining to the site im monitoring, turned on "Synthesize all Digital Voice", and set the volume all the way up...but I seem to still be missing some audio. Can someone point me in the right direction? I'm using the latest release of DSD

Hey @seagravebuff60 , DSD is confusing with DMR systems, it's not just hytera.
You have to "code" the dsdplus.frequencies file for that system.

File format is:
; protocol, networkID, siteNumber, OTAchannelNumber, TXfrequency, RXfrequency, sortOrder
; for TIII, siteNumber format = area.site

NetworkID is the number after the L
siteNumber is the digits after the L#.
OTA is the LSN. Dsd using logical slot number while uniden uses logical channel number
TX and RX frequency. I ONLY fill in the TX frequency
TX use the frequency you find
RX use 0.0
sortorder, i leave as 0 since it doesn't do anything except put them in order in the frequency window- i find it useless

If you use tx/rx as the same thing, it will ONLY squelch open when they were to do a simplex talk, don't want that to happen

You have to keep poking around FMP. In a sense, you have to go on a hunt while using FMP bu clicking on any signals that it will decode.
When it decodes, make sure the network and site numbers all match, if they do add it to that same "block" for that system/site.

You can make notes by add ";" at line start to type in what they are.

Feel free to DM or reply on here for more help

 

[seagravebuff60]

TX and RX frequency. I ONLY fill in the TX frequency
TX use the frequency you find
RX use 0.0

It seems to have improved a little when I set the RX to 0.0. I had them defined before.

You have to keep poking around FMP. In a sense, you have to go on a hunt while using FMP bu clicking on any signals that it will decode.
When it decodes, make sure the network and site numbers all match, if they do add it to that same "block" for that system/site.

You can make notes by add ";" at line start to type in what they are.

So, when I hunted around the FMP24 window All the signals I clicked on didn't seem to display or match the Network ID or site Number just the CC apparently lol, See the picture below. But then after a while it starts to decode more
First:

Then:

 

[Reconrider]

It seems to have improved a little when I set the RX to 0.0. I had them defined before.

So, when I hunted around the FMP24 window All the signals I clicked on didn't seem to display or match the Network ID or site Number just the CC apparently lol, See the picture below. But then after a while it starts to decode more
First:
View attachment 132320
Then:
View attachment 132321

BS means Base Station
When you see it decoding an actual system like in the 2nd picture with BS, it's probably the system you're trying to monitor but it's only going out as voice. copy the same frequency line that you used on the first one, and change the info to match that new frequency.
It should be added into the frequency screen when it comes up. I also use a scanner with DMR purchased to help aid in getting frequencies. I'll usually temp l/o the ones that I have already found so I don't keep making dupes in the file.

 

[seagravebuff60]

Sounds good! The system is a bit dead right now but ill try again in the morning.

I also use a scanner with DMR purchased to help aid in getting frequencies. I'll usually temp l/o the ones that I have already found so I don't keep making dupes in the file.

Do you think an SDS100/200 would work? Also maybe it would help if I used the LCN Search feature?

 

[Reconrider]

Sounds good! The system is a bit dead right now but ill try again in the morning.


Do you think an SDS100/200 would work? Also maybe it would help if I used the LCN Search feature?

sds100 LCN finder won't find anything on a hytera system. Its an internal glitch that'll never be fixed.but you can use the search feature to scan through that frequency range area and see what other voice hits you get. then temp lockout the ones you have saved /written down

 

[cg]

It was asked what system/site you are trying to monitor. Unless it is a new system, you will not be the first one to monitor that system and someone may have files or can create them

Some Tier III systems only need the Control Channel in the Frequencies list, some need them all. If you put them all in no matter which system you are using, that is good. If you are missing channels and the system does not populate the channels automatically, you would likely miss traffic.
A lot of those network systems have school buses so I find the morning and afternoon are busy times.
Put the Control Channel information in the .FREQUENCIES file.
Get the Control Channel set so that it is active in FMPx.
In the Control tab, choose Passive Digital Monitor.
You then get either channels alone or channels with frequencies show up. Let the system run for a while and let it populate the Channel Activity window. If it populates with frequencies, then you are set and don't need to add them to the file. If you only see Channel numbers, you need to figure out what frequency the channel number pairs with.

 

[mmisk]

Hello @seagravebuff60 ,

I use SDR# running on a separate SDR device along with DSD.
When you see an active TG, watch for a frequency that becomes active at the same time on SDR#.
If you want, you can send SDR# to a separate instance of DSD so that you can hear the voice on the found frequency.
It is only a 2mhz window but it seems to do the job very well and the frequency range can easily be moved up or down.
I have found many voice frequencies using this method, and it is fun to do.

 

[seagravebuff60]

Ok, so it seems that when I tune into the frequency with the FMP window the Ch IDs and the TX Freq auto Populate. If I have it set to "Passive Digital Monitor" I can see the TGs and Radios popping up. But when I have it set to "Combined VC/CC Monitor" It seems to follow the voice call half the time and the other half it just hangs on the CC and I can see activity popping up in the Channel Activity window but it doesn't follow the voice call and I can't hear it.

Then other times, what will happen is only the Ch IDs will populate so I would need to find the TX Freq Value. Is there an easy way to calculate that? or would I have to scan around the band and see if I can hear the voice call?

 

[Reconrider]

It seems to follow the voice call half the time and the other half it just hangs on the CC and I can see activity popping up in the Channel Activity window but it doesn't follow the voice call and I can't hear it.

Then other times, what will happen is only the Ch IDs will populate so I would need to find the TX Freq Value. Is there an easy way to calculate that? or would I have to scan around the band and see if I can hear the voice call?

The only "hearing half the call" is because you don't have the other frequency in your dsdplus.frequencies file.
The passive monitor should help find all of those other frequencies if, way back when, I read it correctly meant that.

Feel free to join the discord group in my signature and I can help you quicker and show you screenshot much easier

 

[waynedc]

Use this to calculate your frequencies based on known channel numbers and at least one known frequency/channel number combo:

26.4 KB folder on MEGA

3 files

mega.nz

I think DSD+ uses Logical Slot Numbers vrs Logical Channel numbers. This app will work with both.

I think the SDS radios and the RR database use the Logical Channel Number...

 

[cg]

Still no info like system name or the known and unknown channel numbers so you will have to figure it out yourself (that is the challenge I enjoy). If the system has channels like 1,2 & 3, 4 & 7/8, they will be harder to determine than if they are something like 189, 190 & 299, 300 & 2297, 2298.

 

[seagravebuff60]

They seem to be random like 748 & 749, 1347 & 1348, 1868 & 1869, 169 & 170, etc.

 

[waynedc]

They seem to be random like 748 & 749, 1347 & 1348, 1868 & 1869, 169 & 170, etc.

seagravebuff60,

Send me or post an image of your DSD+ "Channel Activity" window with some channel numbers and at least one identified frequency shown in it. It will look similar to the one I attached from my DSD+

Wayne

 

[seagravebuff60]

This is from Logging the site for about 12 Hours. The only thing I inputted into the .frequencies file was the CC frequencies and the CH ID.

 

[mtindor]

This is from Logging the site for about 12 Hours. The only thing I inputted into the .frequencies file was the CC frequencies and the CH ID.

View attachment 132389

So the _only_ frequency in your DSDplus.frequencies file is 451.2125 ?

And, what state is this system in? Nevermind. I'm guessing this a DMR site in Danbury CT for Marcus Communications? Is this correct?

FCC Callsign WPVV437 (MARCUS SPECTRUM HOLDINGS, LLC)

FCC Callsign WPVV437 (MARCUS SPECTRUM HOLDINGS, LLC)

www.radioreference.com

MOSES MTN 2.4 MI SW OF DANBURY
DANBURY, CT FAIRFIELD County
451.0625
451.1375
451.1625
451.2125
462.325
463.3125
463.7125
464.600
464.8875

If it is, you might want to submit all of the relevant details, at least for a new trunked system in Fairfield CT -- such as Network ID, Site ID, freqs and LCNs. Looks like the only existing Marcus Communications stuff in the DB is LTR and EDACS.

 

[seagravebuff60]

So the _only_ frequency in your DSDplus.frequencies file is 451.2125 ?

And, what state is this system in?

I'd rather not say. But, yes the only frequency I had in the .frequencis file is 451.2125, I calculated the CH ID of 197, Using the program from post #12, then I let it run overnight and everything else populated by itself.

 

[seagravebuff60]

MOSES MTN 2.4 MI SW OF DANBURY
DANBURY, CT FAIRFIELD County
451.0625
451.1375
451.1625
451.2125
462.325
463.3125
463.7125
464.600
464.8875

If it is, you might want to submit all of the relevant details, at least for a new trunked system in Fairfield CT -- such as Network ID, Site ID, freqs, and LCNs. Looks like the only existing Marcus Communications stuff in the DB is LTR and EDACS.

If that is it, I'll calculate the CH IDs and see what I can find.

 

[seagravebuff60]

Double Post.