Encryption Coming to Charleston

[DanRollman]

I added some explanations of Charleston County fire and EMS talkgroups at the top of their respective talkgroup groups on the RR database page for Palmetto 800. Based on my little bit of listening, Ops A and B are more used for admin communications. Fire units are assigned an Incident channel as part of their dispatch for response/ops communications. The most commonly used Incident channel for fire responses is Incident 4.

Your description is helpful and clears up some questions I had based on listening during my travels to Charleston.

One remaining question - how is the Charleston City talkgroup that is labeled "FD Ch.1 Ops" actually used? Are there actual operations on that talkgroup or, as suggested by the explanation you added to the Charleston County Fire Departments group, are operations always on an Incident channel?

I leave this to you and other local experts, but it may be helpful to add an explanatory note in the text field for the Charleston City talkgroup group, since someone looking specifically to monitor Charleston FD (or just learn about how they use radio channels) wouldn't necessarily see the description in the Charleston County section.

 

[brian]

Your description is helpful and clears up some questions I had based on listening during my travels to Charleston.

One remaining question - how is the Charleston City talkgroup that is labeled "FD Ch.1 Ops" actually used? Are there actual operations on that talkgroup or, as suggested by the explanation you added to the Charleston County Fire Departments group, are operations always on an Incident channel?

I leave this to you and other local experts, but it may be helpful to add an explanatory note in the text field for the Charleston City talkgroup group, since someone looking specifically to monitor Charleston FD (or just learn about how they use radio channels) wouldn't necessarily see the description in the Charleston County section.

Based on my very short time of monitoring, I can't say for sure. I ran DSD+ on the Charleston Co simulcast for about 48 hours recently, and talkgroup 2030 Chas FD Ops 1 was active some, but not a lot. I didn't monitor the talkgroup, so I don't know if it's operational/incident radio traffic for CFD, or more admin traffic. I'm hopeful a local expert can weigh in on its precise use.

 

[APX8000]

When all the departments are dispatched, they are multicasted on the County locution channel and the Ops channel of the department getting dispatched. Then they respond on one of the Incident channels. By multicasting the dispatch, the individual departments can just monitor their Ops talkgroup for their pages only instead of hearing every call in the County. You will also hear some Admin stuff on their Ops channels.

 

[brian]

When all the departments are dispatched, they are multicasted on the County locution channel and the Ops channel of the department getting dispatched. Then they respond on one of the Incident channels. By multicasting the dispatch, the individual departments can just monitor their Ops talkgroup for their pages only instead of hearing every call in the County. You will also hear some Admin stuff on their Ops channels.

I did not note this when I monitored earlier, but the activity I see in my DSD+ logs certainly shows activity on most departments' Ops channels. Thanks for pointing this out - I will adjust my notes in the talkgroup groups accordingly.

 

[DanRollman]

Back to the topic in post #1 above, has the transition to encryption of law enforcement talkgroups in Charleston occured?

 

[caldwest]

Not yet.

 

[APX8000]

Ironic how the Sheriff led the charge against encrypted P2P messenger apps all the way to Congress, but then it’s ok to encrypt your stuff.....just sayin’ Al.....

 

[caldwest]

It is what it is. I am thankful that encryption has not yet been implemented. I am hoping that perhaps the powers to be have changed their mind. Perhaps it is a budgetary issue. If I recall correctly. I have read that each encrypted radio incurs a monthly fee. I am sure someone has more information on that question.

 

[yardbird]

Like I said before.

Encryption just another way of screwing to honest man out of a hobby that has been around for years.

Thanks to 911 and the dishonest crooks and public safety chasers.

David

 

[KF4JYE]

It is what it is. I am thankful that encryption has not yet been implemented. I am hoping that perhaps the powers to be have changed their mind. Perhaps it is a budgetary issue. If I recall correctly. I have read that each encrypted radio incurs a monthly fee. I am sure someone has more information on that question.

Prior to the Palmetto 800's changeover to P25, there was an extra fee for encryption. However, this fee no longer applies. Please see the attached memo sent out in March 2017 when the system was being changed to P25:

Will user fees change?
- Palmetto 800 P25 rates have been included in the State Contract since 2008.
- Current 4.1 users will see a 15% increase in rates when they switch to P25.
- No encryption fee is charged in the P25 fees.
- Current P25 users will not see any changes in rates.

 

[BMedcom]

It is what it is. I am thankful that encryption has not yet been implemented. I am hoping that perhaps the powers to be have changed their mind. Perhaps it is a budgetary issue. If I recall correctly. I have read that each encrypted radio incurs a monthly fee. I am sure someone has more information on that question.

I highly doubt they will change their minds, or their stance. I have been in 4 different Counties working where this has taken place, and it never changes. I will say this, and I don't want anyone to mis-understand me, I have no reason to think this would happen here, and I have nothing but respect for everyone else who wears a uniform, but you would be surprised how quickly after an agency, or entity goers dark, how soon radio etiquette goes away. You all would not believe some of the things that are said over the air once encryption is fully online. That is why I stand by my last comment, that for an entire system to go dark, it is not called for. All the places I have been, and affiliated with, this is what has happened, the entire system goes dark. It takes away not only scanner hobbyist, but it also kills any public accountability.

 

[caldwest]

I highly doubt they will change their minds, or their stance. I have been in 4 different Counties working where this has taken place, and it never changes. I will say this, and I don't want anyone to mis-understand me, I have no reason to think this would happen here, and I have nothing but respect for everyone else who wears a uniform, but you would be surprised how quickly after an agency, or entity goers dark, how soon radio etiquette goes away. You all would not believe some of the things that are said over the air once encryption is fully online. That is why I stand by my last comment, that for an entire system to go dark, it is not called for. All the places I have been, and affiliated with, this is what has happened, the entire system goes dark. It takes away not only scanner hobbyist, but it also kills any public accountability.

I agree with you. When I came to Charleston in the 1960s my public service band monitoring was by an AM/FM radio with a police band setting. As I recall this was prior to Radio Shack scanners and others becoming popular. Anyway, public service band radio in the '60s could be shocking to anyone with sensitive ears. On the plus side. especially the past few years, I have observed how polite most public service band transmissions have become . . . yes sir, no mam, thank you, I apologize, have a good night, etc., etc. I agree that for entire systems to go dark, there will be a question of accountability. Is this something that law enforcement needs in our current times?

 

[roeddog]

Did the change over occur? I ask because before Isaias I was able to hear North Chas. PD and Chas. County SC North. I deployed with the Red Cross for the storm and did not really have a chance to listen to the scanner. Today, so far at least, each of their channels are garbled - for lack of a better description.
I don't know if that is what encryption would sound like though.
Thanks
Jeff

 

[GaRebel]

The more you hide, the more you can get away with!

 

[caldwest]

Did the change over occur? I ask because before Isaias I was able to hear North Chas. PD and Chas. County SC North. I deployed with the Red Cross for the storm and did not really have a chance to listen to the scanner. Today, so far at least, each of their channels are garbled - for lack of a better description.
I don't know if that is what encryption would sound like though.
Thanks
Jeff

Yes, I believe it happened at 7:00 a.m. this morning.

 

[roeddog]

Yep. Live 5 news article about it here

 

[ILjim]

Yep. Live 5 news article about it here

"Law Enforcement Encrypting Scanners"

Gotta love the media...

 

[evan]

Two notable lines from the Live 5 article:
"The change is happening now because of “the proliferation of police scanner smartphone apps,” according to Charleston County Public Information Officer Shawn Smetana."
But also:
"no agency in Charleston County has offered a specific example of a criminal using law enforcement radio communications to impede police operations."

At least Fire/EMS is still in the clear.

 

[brian]

This is actually one of the better written articles on the subject of law enforcement encryption I've read. Perhaps it's my confirmation bias, but the fact that there was an attempt to get comments from all sides - the agencies themselves, as well as a media member that seems to understand the role scanners do (or do not) play in their news gathering efforts, and government transparency advocates - is quite impressive and rare these days.

I think it's notable that only one agency representative - from Sullivans Island - was willing to comment, and he showed notable ignorance on the technical aspects of encryption. This should be a red flag for citizens and taxpayers in the affected area.

 

[WeBeCinYa]

Fully encrypted now. 1million spent during a pandemic to do this.