FDNY TPS TONE

[AustinBodurian]

Hello All. I am aware this has been discussed many times before but I still have questions. I am looking to figure out how to get my xts5000 to sound like the FDNY Fireground end of transmit tone. I am aware they are using TPS and this is the reason it sounds this way. I have set up my xts5000 with tps and have not been able to obtain the desired results. I am in NO WAY looking to operate or decode any of the FDNY transmissions. I just find the tone that is used interesting and would like to emulate it for my own use. I will attach a file with the tone i’m looking to emulate.

 

[AustinBodurian]

 

[AustinBodurian]

I do not have the flash code with the Rx/Tx FDNY tones still not sure what that is used for. Does this add extra tones ontop of the TPS that they use on the fireground to keep track of personal?

 

[nikronzo]

I also find the FDNY TPS signalling system interesting
I may be 100% incorrect on this so someone more in the know please correct me;
The double TPS burst you hear at the end is the unit ID transmitting on the fireground but also if I remember correctly has something to do with the simulcasting of the fireground on a p25 trunk.
In terms of the G857 FDNY Rx/Tx Tones, that is something that their radios in conjunction with the fireground accountability system they use and you have to be on their system to actually utilize. TPS signalling on your XTS5k will work fine without that flashcode feature, but I don't think you are going to be able to get that double burst your looking for.

 

[AustinBodurian]

I also find the FDNY TPS signalling system interesting
I may be 100% incorrect on this so someone more in the know please correct me;
The double TPS burst you hear at the end is the unit ID transmitting on the fireground but also if I remember correctly has something to do with the simulcasting of the fireground on a p25 trunk.
In terms of the G857 FDNY Rx/Tx Tones, that is something that their radios in conjunction with the fireground accountability system they use and you have to be on their system to actually utilize. TPS signalling on your XTS5k will work fine without that flashcode feature, but I don't think you are going to be able to get that double burst your looking for.

Thank you for your reply. It would make sense that it has something to do with simulcasting. I was always under the impression that the fireground was simplex though. I tried all the preamble settings and nothing even came close to the sounds in the video.

 

[nikronzo]

well TPS is very simple when using simplex, its just analog voice but using the Astro system ID. But the burst is just a single P25 ID at the end of the transmission

 

[dmason04]

It sounds like MDC-600. MDC-600 is MDC-1200 but at half the baud rate. I assume the radio has to be flashed for MDC-600 but I could be wrong as I have no experience with MDC-600. The last I heard of any MDC-600 was in the early 2000s with the FDNY (especially 9/11, the radios were quite busy that day). I've attached some audio samples below that might aid you! Good luck!

MDC-600 baud: http://www.w2sjw.com/sounds/MDC-600.mp3
MDC-1200 baud: http://www.w2sjw.com/sounds/MDC1200.mp3
MDC-600 baud on an FDNY transmission: http://www.w2sjw.com/sounds/MDC-600_FDNY.mp3

 

[K2NEC]

It sounds like MDC-600. MDC-600 is MDC-1200 but at half the baud rate. I assume the radio has to be flashed for MDC-600 but I could be wrong as I have no experience with MDC-600. The last I heard of any MDC-600 was in the early 2000s with the FDNY (especially 9/11, the radios were quite busy that day). I've attached some audio samples below that might aid you! Good luck!

MDC-600 baud: http://www.w2sjw.com/sounds/MDC-600.mp3
MDC-1200 baud: http://www.w2sjw.com/sounds/MDC1200.mp3
MDC-600 baud on an FDNY transmission: http://www.w2sjw.com/sounds/MDC-600_FDNY.mp3

No it's NOT MDC600. If you read above you'd know that it's TPS. They sound absolutely nothing alike.

 

[Citywide173]

Hello All. I am aware this has been discussed many times before but I still have questions. I am looking to figure out how to get my xts5000 to sound like the FDNY Fireground end of transmit tone. I am aware they are using TPS and this is the reason it sounds this way. I have set up my xts5000 with tps and have not been able to obtain the desired results. I am in NO WAY looking to operate or decode any of the FDNY transmissions. I just find the tone that is used interesting and would like to emulate it for my own use. I will attach a file with the tone i’m looking to emulate.

A little confusing.

If you're not looking to operate on or decode and FDNY transmissions, what are you looking to do?

If you're looking to see what ID's are being transmitted, that would count as decoding.

If you're looking to transmit the tone on a channel that you are authorized on, are you listening with another radio? You won't hear the tone on the radio you are transmitting from. I'm not fully familiar with XTS software, but I understand that you have the signalling enabled, but do you have an ID entered? Is that ID designated to be pre-transmission, post-transmission or both? Without an ID to transmit, it won't send the data, even if it is enabled.

 

[nikronzo]

TPS will work when these circumstances are correctly configured in the CPS, if you are using a Simplex frequency or repeated, regardless if you have a unqiue Astro ID or just leave at as 1, it will still send a data burst.

 

[a417]

If you're not looking to operate on or decode and FDNY transmissions, what are you looking to do?

Noise for noise sake.

 

[nikronzo]

Noise for noise sake.

there is actually a somewhat practical use for it;
my ham buddies and myself all have XTS2500's flashed for P25, in our area we use a 70cm repeater that is connected to a Pi-star MMDVM configured for p25 use. In order to connect to the repeater and open it up, besides having the proper NAC, you also need your Astro ID to correlate with your DMR ID from the database. We then put our name aliases in the Astro Call List so we can see whose radio is talking with the PTT ID. However, since we also use FM for both the repeater and talkaround, we use the TPS so we can still see each other's ID aliases without making additional changes to the codeplug. In addition, it's less annoying than MDC. Digital ID and analog voice is a nice feature

 

[a417]

there is actually a somewhat practical use for it;
my ham buddies and myself all have XTS2500's flashed for P25, in our area we use a 70cm repeater that is connected to a Pi-star MMDVM configured for p25 use. In order to connect to the repeater and open it up, besides having the proper NAC, you also need your Astro ID to correlate with your DMR ID from the database. We then put our name aliases in the Astro Call List so we can see whose radio is talking with the PTT ID. However, since we also use FM for both the repeater and talkaround, we use the TPS so we can still see each other's ID aliases without making additional changes to the codeplug. In addition, it's less annoying than MDC. Digital ID and analog voice is a nice feature

Ok, that's actually a good usage case. I'll give you that.

Wonder if the OP is doing the same...

 

[AustinBodurian]

Ok, that's actually a good usage case. I'll give you that.

Wonder if the OP is doing the same...

I am not using it for any particular use. I just want to know the ins and outs of how this system works in a fashion to make these sounds. Again I don’t live in the city and I have no plans on decoding any of the IDS. I’m a city buff and have always heard the end of transmission tones and it was different then any other system i’ve ever heard. I got TPS to work with IDS put in it, but it never sounds the way that the video I posted sounds. A commenter added that it sounds that way due to a retransmit on a secondary p25 system adding in the double burst we hear.

 

[AustinBodurian]

A little confusing.

If you're not looking to operate on or decode and FDNY transmissions, what are you looking to do?

If you're looking to see what ID's are being transmitted, that would count as decoding.

If you're looking to transmit the tone on a channel that you are authorized on, are you listening with another radio? You won't hear the tone on the radio you are transmitting from. I'm not fully familiar with XTS software, but I understand that you have the signalling enabled, but do you have an ID entered? Is that ID designated to be pre-transmission, post-transmission or both? Without an ID to transmit, it won't send the data, even if it is enabled.

Yes that’s correct no interest to decode their IDS. Don’t even live in the city or nassau. It’s interesting to me because i’ve never been able to recreate the end of transmission tone and I want to see how it’s done that’s all. And yes i would have 2 radios i’m aware it doesn’t tone on the transmitting radio. The id is filled out with numbers so that wouldn’t be the issue.

 

[nhfdcadet]

Yes that’s correct no interest to decode their IDS. Don’t even live in the city or nassau. It’s interesting to me because i’ve never been able to recreate the end of transmission tone and I want to see how it’s done that’s all. And yes i would have 2 radios i’m aware it doesn’t tone on the transmitting radio. The id is filled out with numbers so that wouldn’t be the issue.

care to send me your codeplug and i'll take a look at it?

 

[AustinBodurian]

care to send me your codeplug and i'll take a look at it?

Will PM you in a couple minutes out right now, thanks for willing to take a look.

 

[gatekeep]

You are hearing 2 TPS packets, and it has to due with the way FDNY's radios are setup.

FDNY's Fireground channels are entirely simplex, and as I understand it, they essentially have a Battalion Chief truck (or Fieldcom or another unit) typically VRS fireground traffic from the scene to the city's trunked system, and in doing so it causes a second quick TPS packet to be transmitted on the fireground channel. This is why you tend to hear 2 TPS packets back to back.

The first packet is typically the unit transmitting on fireground, and the second is usually the VRS transmitting. And it all supposedly has to do with fireground accountability.

 

[marcotor]

there is actually a somewhat practical use for it;

You're talking ASTRO conventional signaling, not TPS which the OP asked about. We use it here in SoCal on the few amateur P25 repeaters for the same reason, altho THANKFULLY the repeaters are not linked, except locally.

 

[nikronzo]

You're talking ASTRO conventional signaling, not TPS which the OP asked about. We use it here in SoCal on the few amateur P25 repeaters for the same reason, altho THANKFULLY the repeaters are not linked, except locally.

on a moto radio, analog voice and Astro ID transmission by definition is TPS signaling, reference the CPS screenshots


it's the same feature set on an APX