FDNY UHF signal drop

[nycpress]

Greetings -

My "I miss the old days of VHF" bias notwithstanding, I often find that the signal on FDNY's UHF system quietly and stealthily drops out for me, even when I'm stationary. It almost sounds as if a simple case of the dispatcher not turning on the mixer, which has always happened from time to time, but there may be silence for more than a minute before suddenly I hear a unit in the field answering a dispatch transmission that sure wasn't audible to me. For a practical example, on Thanksgiving a box went out in Midtown Manhattan. I was a few blocks away, and heard the initial dispatch. Then silence for a while. What I didn't hear was them giving the "10-76." I knew something was up because all of a sudden I heard a unit acknowledging that they were the FAST truck, and so forth. Is this a problem unique to my scanner's attenuator (I have it set to "off") that doesn't seem to affect FDNY unit radios, or is it the transmitter?

Thanks.

 

[richee2000]

I have the same problem with NYPD sod since they went multicast .... when they had a single transmitter location they were five by five... But since they started multi casting the signal is continuously dropping in and out and very weak where I am located in New Jersey...

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

[GTR8000]

*Simulcast, not multicast.

Simulcast = transmitting on the same frequency from multiple sites/transmitters
Multicast = transmitting the same signal on different frequencies

In any event, the FDNY UHF dispatch frequencies are indeed simulcast, which can sometimes lead to reception issues, particularly with scanners. Professional grade radios fare much better with simulcast signals.

 

[richee2000]

Yes simulcast... So my Uniden 536 and 436 pick up the NYPD sod simulcast system on 470. 8375... but very weak... The SDS 100 was totally deaf on that frequency... The SDS100 had major sensitivity problems on all analog VHF UHF and 800...

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[Twister_2]

I was in Times Square last week for work and I made a mistake when I brought my xpr-7550 over my apx-6000xe. Every transmission would cut out due to simulcast distortion. I bet if I had my apx, there would have been no simulcast problems.

 

[Danny37]

I've had numerous amount of LMR radios programmed with FDNY RX only, out of all of them my xts5000 performs the best. My vertex radios are a close second.

 

[Danny37]

Yes simulcast... So my Uniden 536 and 436 pick up the NYPD sod simulcast system on 470. 8375... but very weak... The SDS 100 was totally deaf on that frequency... The SDS100 had major sensitivity problems on all analog VHF UHF and 800...

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

I'd suggest getting a cheap UHF radio to program the NYC stuff. A used xts3000 can be picked up for $100 and then feed an outdoor antenna to it. Any LMR radio will outperform a scanner hands down.

 

[Frequency1]

Greetings -



I was a few blocks away, and heard the initial dispatch. Then silence for a while. What I didn't hear was them giving the "10-76." I knew something was up because all of a sudden I heard a unit acknowledging that they were the FAST truck, and so forth.



Thanks.

Specifically on a Uniden scanner, have you tried disabling the CTCSS?
This may help you receive those missed FDNY transmissions.
Downside to no CTCSS is ‘front end overload’/ bleed over of other strong signals.


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[mikeybus44]

Greetings -

My "I miss the old days of VHF" bias notwithstanding, I often find that the signal on FDNY's UHF system quietly and stealthily drops out for me, even when I'm stationary. It almost sounds as if a simple case of the dispatcher not turning on the mixer, which has always happened from time to time, but there may be silence for more than a minute before suddenly I hear a unit in the field answering a dispatch transmission that sure wasn't audible to me. For a practical example, on Thanksgiving a box went out in Midtown Manhattan. I was a few blocks away, and heard the initial dispatch. Then silence for a while. What I didn't hear was them giving the "10-76." I knew something was up because all of a sudden I heard a unit acknowledging that they were the FAST truck, and so forth. Is this a problem unique to my scanner's attenuator (I have it set to "off") that doesn't seem to affect FDNY unit radios, or is it the transmitter?

Thanks.

Agree 100% on missing those VHF that you could hear loud and clear 50 miles away. No background noise where sometimes i'd have to look and see if the radio was still on. I find, though, that some things have improved as far as missed transmissions. On my 436 I have the CTCSS set on search - but when I had the actual CTCSS set that is when i had the most issues with missed transmissions.
My SDS100 just has issues on most of the spectrum - a ton of background noise when the mixer is on and no one is transmitting - on VHF UHF and trunking. I think that is just a product of the big city.

 

[Priority-One]

I am currently using a Vertex EVX 539 UHF for RX only. I work in Times Square and the 17, north and south cut out continually all day. I had to stop staying parked on that channel. Is that a common issue with DMR radios?

 

[ansky]

Agree 100% on missing those VHF that you could hear loud and clear 50 miles away. No background noise where sometimes i'd have to look and see if the radio was still on. I find, though, that some things have improved as far as missed transmissions. On my 436 I have the CTCSS set on search - but when I had the actual CTCSS set that is when i had the most issues with missed transmissions.
My SDS100 just has issues on most of the spectrum - a ton of background noise when the mixer is on and no one is transmitting - on VHF UHF and trunking. I think that is just a product of the big city.

I tried setting the CTCSS to search on my HP-2 and it did not make any difference. The Queens dispatch frequency sounds especially horrible. It gets hung up on what sounds like an open carrier with a high pitched wail in the background.

 

[joerobb23]

i agree vhf was great i wish fdny or doitt would clear their uhf frequencies static or whatever that constant buzz is and also on trunk uhf increase output range i used to be able to hear fireground repeater output. Very frustrating for a life long buff.

 

[radioman2001]

I have both 17 Div and FDNY UHF on in my office (Times Square Area) and have no problem with Astro Spectra's or XTS-3000 portable. Also within the last few days I have been hearing FDNY City Wide on VHF again. Don't know if it's being turned on and off at will or what. The 800 DOITT for FDNY is sporadic.
Try carrier squelch.

Quote"
Agree 100% on missing those VHF that you could hear loud and clear 50 miles away. No background noise where sometimes i'd have to look and see if the radio was still on.

Thats the difference between 500 watts output on VHF and less than 100 on UHF. The VHF used to carry down to Virginia Beach.

 

[joerobb23]

thanks are there any other channels on vhf besides citywide?

 

[Rudy3145]

I too miss the old days of the powerful VHF stations. VHF signals travel greater distances than UHF, but UHF penetrates buildings better and that’s what NYC needs. Also, keep in mind - the system is designed to cover the city, it’s not designed to cover the tri-state area for us listeners...much to our dismay. It would have been nice for them to keep simulcasting their new UHF system with the respective boroughs VHF, but I guess there’s no reason for it.

 

[12dbsinad]

The days of high power are pretty much over. VHF in any dense area in modern day isn't easy. WAY to much garbage being radiated on the lower frequencies.

Most systems now are designed to cover the area they serve. It's not in the design to be heard 50 or 100 miles away. The reason for this is lower power, and engineered antenna systems that may include a downtilt pattern to saturate the city. Sticking a high gain antenna on a tall skyscraper and pumping out 500 watts does little for the 4 or 5 watt handheld at ground level or below, in a building or some other area were RF is blocked. That's what the systems today are designed for.

Sucks for scanner listeners not in the immediate area, but much better design for the folks in the field relying on their radios to work.