Foothills Medical Centre Calgary **NEW** DMR/ DMR T3 system

[VE6RSU2]

Hi all...

I was searching in the 420's yesterday and logged more DMR than usual. It seems that Foothills Medical Centre has switched from the MPT-1327 analog system they have been using for 20ish years to a new DMR system. (I will ask for and update to the Foothills MPT-1327 site to be changed to "depreciated" today).
Yesterday I logged 422.2125, 422.4375, 422.6625, 424.5875 & 424.7875 - All CC1 showing "DT3" Tier 3 DMR trunk. Looked like 422.2125 was a control channel.

I drove to the hospital today and confirmed the following with DSD+:
422.2125 Control Channel "Network 3 Site 1.2". No activity except idle data. Strangely not controlling 424.5875.
424.5875 "Network 2 Site 1" acting like a conventional DMR repeater and showing "S2" for LCN. Logged 102 as Foothills Security - ONLY on slot 2. RAS is enabled so my CS580 is useless to monitor with. No ENC monitored. Other groups logged (no slot info I'm afraid: 103, 112)

Unfortunately I did not log any of the other frequencies in use when I was there (about an hour) and I can't get a signal from my QTH as they have really ramped down the power at the site (I find that's common now too with digital systems) - so if you are in the NW of Calgary any help would be appreciated!

TAFL says "AHS FMC Radio Replacement" and I noticed that the emission designators have been changed to 7K60F7DWT from 11K NFM.

Question for the techs out there: Is it possible this system is just being set up and is in "failsoft/Failover" mode? All the frequencies (repeaters) are physically at Foothills so that is what I thought...please weigh in if you know/have an opinon.

Thanks guys...73's.

Mike VE6RSU

 

[kayn1n32008]

I doubt it is in a ‘failsoft’ condition. If you are hearing a control channel, and hearing traffic then the system is being used. As for the other frequency, it May have been set up to take over traffic, until the MPT trunk system could be Decommissioned, and the Tier-3(if it has RAS, likely Capacity Max) could be installed and tested. Maybe once everything is good on the trunk system, the other channel will be added to the trunk system resources.

Not surprised on dropping power, they only need to cover the facility and the FMC property.

Also slot info is irrelevant with a cap-max/Tier-3 system. The RF and slot is dynamic based on system loading at the time of PTT.

 

[harryshute]

It appears this upgrade also involves Alberta Children's Hospital as well. It almost looks like the U of A Hospital DMR system that has about 4 sites in different locations in the building. I don't think it's a Cap Max Tier 3 but I'll check. I can hear the U of A system in the west end of Edmonton quite strong.

 

[kayn1n32008]

It appears this upgrade also involves Alberta Children's Hospital as well. It almost looks like the U of A Hospital DMR system that has about 4 sites in different locations in the building. I don't think it's a Cap Max Tier 3 but I'll check. I can hear the U of A system in the west end of Edmonton quite strong.

Not sure what Hytera’s equivalent of RAS is called, or if DSD+ shows them differently, but if you can run DSD+ on the system in Edmonton, that should determine if it’s Con+/CapMax/Tier-3. If it shows RAS it will be CapMax or Con+. I don’t think Tier-3 supports RAS.

I don't think it's a Cap Max Tier 3

Tier 3 and CapMax are not the same, although CapMax can be built out in a Tier-3 compliant mode.

 

[harryshute]

So U of A Hospital comes up as a CON+

 

[Jay911]

I won't be in the FMC area for a few days but I will try to bring DSD+ and check it out when I am.

I'm in Cochrane right this moment, outside of their Community Health Centre and the same old Cap+ rest pulse is happening on 410.8125. Calling itself Site 5, color code 5, with neighbors 3, 6, and 8.

We have this system in the DB as linked Cap+ repeaters throughout the area. 3 is Canmore and 8 is Airdrie - no idea who 6 is. (We have both Pincher and High River listed as site 7, but I think High River is in Calgary Zone and Pincher is in South Zone, so that accounts for the duplicates.

Fort Macleod and Pincher Creek should probably be moved into a separate system for South Zone.)

 

[robertmac]

I noticed these frequencies 422.2125, 422.4375, 422.6625, 424.5875 had changed to digital about a month ago. I have them now locked out and no way to monitor for other frequencies from SE. Can still pick up 422.2125 but nothing to monitor it with. Sorry cannot help more.

 

[Jay911]

I sat across the road from FMC today for about 20 minutes and had mild success with DSD+ on this system.

Identifying as TIII (MOT) RAS on DSD+. My SDS200 is not tracking it but not sure if that's because I have no LCNs identified in the system yet (I set it up as "MotoTRBO" in Sentinel). Monitoring the freqs conventionally worked on the scanner but obviously gave me no talkgroup IDs.

I've submitted my info to the RRDB. Key info:

Freq LCN Color Code
422.2125 356 1
422.4375 392 1
422.6625 428 1
424.5875 736 1
424.7875 768 1

And here's a snip from the DSD+ events file.

2020/05/29 12:43:50 RAS No data for current site found in DSDPlus.frequencies file
2020/05/29 12:43:52 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1016 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:43:53 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1016 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:44:00 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1201 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:44:03 RAS ACK: REG/DEREG ACCEPT Tgt=1001 Src=REGI
2020/05/29 12:44:06 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1232 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:44:26 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1409 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:44:29 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1411 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:44:40 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1217 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:45:00 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1407 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:45:00 RAS Group call; TG=102 RID=64251 Ch=392
2020/05/29 12:45:43 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1233 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:45:46 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1398 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:45:50 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1224 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:45:53 RAS Group call; TG=112 RID=1608 Ch=392
2020/05/29 12:45:53 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1241 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:45:56 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1250 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:00 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1252 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:03 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1403 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:06 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1605 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:11 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1253 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:14 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1404 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:21 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1603 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:31 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1028 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:41 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1018 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:44 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1207 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:47 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1406 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:46:51 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1307 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:47:01 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1204 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:47:04 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1397 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:47:07 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1602 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:47:21 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1206 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:47:41 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1316 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:47:51 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1003 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:01 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1001 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:04 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1212 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:14 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1215 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:17 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1228 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:23 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1008 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:26 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1216 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:29 RAS ACK: REG/DEREG ACCEPT Tgt=1242 Src=REGI
2020/05/29 12:48:29 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1226 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:32 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1012 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:35 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1230 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:38 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1312 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:41 RAS Group call; TG=102 RID=1008 Ch=392
2020/05/29 12:48:44 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1024 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:46 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1024 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:47 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1026 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:50 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1401 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:53 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1014 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:55 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1014 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:56 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1214 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:48:59 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1410 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:02 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1022 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:05 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1201 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:06 Current network: S2
2020/05/29 12:49:06 Current site: S2-1
2020/05/29 12:49:12 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1024 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:15 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1026 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:21 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1213 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:23 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1232 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:26 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1014 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:30 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1016 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:32 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1210 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:36 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1409 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:48 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1220 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:49:49 RAS Group call; TG=102 RID=1016 Ch=392
2020/05/29 12:49:52 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1219 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:50:05 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1407 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:50:22 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1020 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:50:52 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1224 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:50:55 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1233 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:02 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1241 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:05 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1250 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:08 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1252 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:09 RAS Group call; TG=103 RID=1207 Ch=392
2020/05/29 12:51:14 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1253 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:17 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1403 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:20 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1605 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:23 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1404 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:26 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1603 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:32 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1028 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:40 RAS Group call; TG=110 RID=1412 Ch=392
2020/05/29 12:51:42 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1018 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:51:50 RAS Group call; TG=102 RID=1010 Ch=391
2020/05/29 12:51:57 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1406 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:52:05 RAS Group call; TG=110 RID=1404 Ch=428
2020/05/29 12:52:12 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1397 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:52:15 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1602 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:52:22 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1206 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:52:25 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1406 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:52:53 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1003 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:53:03 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1001 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:53:13 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1212 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:53:29 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1405 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:53:39 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1226 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:53:47 RAS Group call; TG=103 RID=1212 Ch=428
2020/05/29 12:53:48 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1312 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:53:54 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1008 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:53:57 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1401 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:03 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1022 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:06 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1214 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:07 RAS Group call; TG=103 RID=1212 Ch=428
2020/05/29 12:54:09 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1410 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:13 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1024 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:22 RAS Group call; TG=110 RID=1404 Ch=428
2020/05/29 12:54:23 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1026 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:26 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1203 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:33 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1014 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:36 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1210 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:39 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1232 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:43 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1205 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:49 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1411 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:50 RAS Group call; TG=110 RID=1404 Ch=428
2020/05/29 12:54:53 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1217 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:56 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1219 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:54:59 RAS Group call; TG=103 RID=1204 Ch=428
2020/05/29 12:55:03 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1006 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:55:06 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1016 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:55:09 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1239 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:55:12 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1609 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:55:15 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1407 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:55:22 RAS Group call; TG=110 RID=1404 Ch=427
2020/05/29 12:55:23 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1020 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:55:31 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1225 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:56:07 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1241 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:56:09 RAS Group call; TG=103 RID=1212 Ch=735
2020/05/29 12:56:10 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1398 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:56:17 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1218 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:56:18 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1218 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:56:30 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1224 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:56:50 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1018 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:56:58 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1307 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:57:14 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1308 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:57:27 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1602 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:58:37 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1228 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:58:46 RAS Group call; TG=103 RID=1216 Ch=768
2020/05/29 12:58:47 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1226 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:58:48 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1226 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:58:52 RAS Group call; TG=103 RID=1215 Ch=768
2020/05/29 12:59:00 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1312 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 12:59:26 RAS Group call; TG=103 RID=1216 Ch=768
2020/05/29 13:01:15 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1212 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 13:01:17 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1212 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 13:02:25 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1206 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 13:02:28 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1397 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 13:02:35 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1406 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 13:09:17 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1022 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 13:09:19 RAS Group call; TG=103 RID=1215 Ch=768
2020/05/29 13:09:33 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1405 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 13:10:01 RAS Group call; TG=110 RID=1407 Ch=768
2020/05/29 13:10:41 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1210 Src=TSI
2020/05/29 13:11:58 RAS Reg/Auth/MS Check; Tgt=1028 Src=TSI

 

[mciupa]

I have to enter the true radio channel numbers in the database. This doesn't fly with Uniden scanners. RadioReference policy is to not favour one scanner manufacturer over the other. I have been told to put true Channel ID's and not the Uniden LCN.

With my 536, the formula I use is to -1 from the Channel ID then divide by two. This will give the Uniden LCN.

 

[Jay911]

Thanks, I saw that comment and was curious about it.

So to confirm, Uniden LCNs should be (in same order as the freqs shown in post #8) 177, 195, 213, 367, 383?

 

[mciupa]

Yes. Give it a try and see if the system comes to life with a DT3 when it captures the channels.

Thanks, I saw that comment and was curious about it.

Once the Database Manager told us to ensure that only true ID's were to be listed in the database, I went and replaced all the Uniden LCN's (that I put in there as a favour to the membership for easier download) and put in those instructions.

 

[Jay911]

Yes. Give it a try and see if the system comes to life with a DT3 when it captures the channels.

Confirmed, it does show up as this (or the equivalent on my SDS200 - I think it says DMRT3). In the very brief moments I was in range of the system, one TG got a voice grant, but I got no audio - can't be sure if that was because of poor receive/no content, or if the LCN was misprogrammed. I'll have to try again later when I'm back in range again.

 

[mciupa]

Tweak the LCN -1 or +1 or run a LCN Finder perhaps.

 

[VE6RSU2]

Just did a playground visit in the area with my 3 year old. Plugged in all LCNs as per Mciupa & Jay911 on my BCD325P2. 177 & 195 are confirmed as correct.

 

[VE6RSU2]

...and another playground visit and more LCN's confirmed: 213, 367, 383 all now confirmed as working - thanks Jay!

More talkgroups logged: 107 Foothills Electricians, 110 Possibly Children's Hospital Security (talking about lost and found and a 10-21)

 

[Jay911]

I seem to recall you mentioned early on that you may have discovered a frequency that was broadcasting activity but not in the normal cycle of rest channels. If that's the case, and you have DSD+ handy, park on that channel and run LRRP.exe to see if they are broadcasting unit tracking info.

I found a frequency associated with the Wi-COM TRBO system (naturally, can't remember which freq) which was just pouring out LRRP signals for a batch of radios all clustered around the Palliser Hotel (but IIRC not the Palliser radios or at least not on that set of TGs).

 

[thundermedic]

The RGH is still on the old system, (got off shift With PS there this morning)