G5 Alerting on scanning channels when not desired (see details)

[w5jam]

Okay. So here's my question...

I'm on with my local VFD and have become the defunct radio programming guy. Which is great. I've upgraded our pagers quite a bit and have done some work with the channels to update them.

My issue is I have 2 channels in a priority scan ( FD and PD) with FD being the priority to listen for tones. I have one of our stations set up to listen to 2 tones on a totally different freq and group id setting. The scan channel still alerts to the 2tone even though that group id is off for that channel and scan. so when we're on the scan channel I DO NOT need it to alert, since we're just scanning and listening. When it does alert, it alerts twice and covers up dispatch audio making to actually hear the call.

What do I need to change to NOT have it alert on anything while scanning?

Additional details...
Our department is on P25 Conventional radio system with an analog repeater doing tones for Rescue with is TG 14 in the digital.
Pagers normal alert works great when listening to analog alerts. I haven't figured out the digital alerting for us yet.

Attached is the detailed printout from our PPS. The Zone and Knob positions that are in question in this post are:
Z1/P5/ FD & PD Scan - Priority Scan
Z1/P4/ KFire-Monitor - Monitor Mode
Z1/P6/ KPD - Mon - Monitor Mode

If you have a minute to help me out it'd be huge!

Thanks
-Josh

 

[N6ML]

I'm not so familiar with P25C and tone alerting, but I think there's not enough information in your problem description.

When the problem occurs:

1) Which knob position is selected?
2) What frequency, mode and TGID (if applicable) do you believe that the tones are being transmitted on (the ones that should NOT be alerted on)?
3) What do you see on the pager screen when the alert happens?

Reading between the lines a bit, I wonder if it's not actually anything to do with the tones, but perhaps that your dispatches are being sent on P25 as "system calls", which are special calls intended to be received by all subscribers. The pager treats these like emergency messages, and makes an emergency alert tone. See Seeking help for 2 issues I’m having.

"Defunct radio programmer" would be a neat title for business cards. Is it you that's defunct, or the radios?

 

[buddrousa]

This is not just my opinion but one of most departments.
#1 Scanning is not an option for EMERGENGY PAGING.
#2 Paging is done by use of page tones and the length of tones SCANNING DOES NOT GUARANTEE that the pager will go off because of missed timming and tones.

 

[w5jam]

This is not just my opinion but one of most departments.
#1 Scanning is not an option for EMERGENGY PAGING.
#2 Paging is done by use of page tones and the length of tones SCANNING DOES NOT GUARANTEE that the pager will go off because of missed timming and tones.

100% agree. I DO NOT need it to tone while scanning yet it tones for whatever reason it tones when I don't need or want it. I have alert channels set up for when I NEED them to page. I just don't understand what is causing it to still page when that channel doesn't have that group assigned to it..

 

[buddrousa]

If you are SCANNING you are missing calls.

 

[w5jam]

Yes. But that’s not my issue. I’m getting toned WHEN I SCAN and it double alerts causing it to cover up dispatch. I DO NOT NEED IT TO ALERT. I am trying to figure out WHY it is alert when I DO NOT WANT IT TO on the scan channels.

 

[N6ML]

I just don't understand what is causing it to still page when that channel doesn't have that group assigned to it..

Did you read my response, or.... ?

 

[w5jam]

1) Which knob position is selected?

Z1/P5/ FD & PD Scan - Priority Scan

2) What frequency, mode and TGID (if applicable) do you believe that the tones are being transmitted on (the ones that should NOT be alerted on)?

155.76 is our digital. TG 14 is the one alerting however in the Group ID page that ID has no alerts on. Could it still be listening for the 2tone even though it is not in that scan? The 2tone is for an analog copy of TG 14 (not P25)

3) What do you see on the pager screen when the alert happens?

not entirely sure. usually don't have enough time to read it as I'm heading out the door. once again, I don't want it to alert, I just want to hear all traffic and if it's my tones, I go. (there are only 4 sets of tones for our area so it's not super busy)

"Defunct radio programmer"

and that definitely wasn't the word I was looking for lol. I got voluntold to be the radio programmer lol

I did look at the emergency alerting. I don't think it's that, but it might be. I may dig into the CPS and see if I accidentally turned that on. I don't know if the emergency alert might be assigned to just my station's TGID for tones or what because it doesn't do it on any other TGID.

so a breakdown of the TGIDs in use..
1= all normal communication
11= station 1 tones and initial dispatch order
12= station 2 tones and initial dispatch order
13= station 3 tones and initial dispatch order
14= rescue station tones and initial dispatch order (mine)
65535= all call tones

Thanks for the help! Let me look and see if emergency alerts are on.

 

[w5jam]

eading between the lines a bit, I wonder if it's not actually anything to do with the tones, but perhaps that your dispatches are being sent on P25 as "system calls", which are special calls intended to be received by all subscribers. The pager treats these like emergency messages, and makes an emergency alert tone. See Seeking help for 2 issues I’m having.

Just checked the emergency alarm setting, it is currently off in this CPS.

 

[N6ML]

Just checked the emergency alarm setting, it is currently off in this CPS.

How does CPS come into play here? Are you programming the dispatch console too? I don't know what the option to send dispatch messages as "system calls" would look like.

If you're hearing traffic that's supposed to be on TGID 14 when using Zone 1 Position 5, there's something funny going on, as it appears that you have it programmed to only include TGIDs 1 (Dispatch) and 659 (DigMonitor) - based on the PDF report that you attached.

I see that you have TGID 14 defined as "RescDig", but I don't see it in use in any knob position...?

I'd definitely want to see what's on the pager's screen when this is happening.

 

[cpg178]

Because when you set the scan mode, you are selecting from the other knob positions. So if one of the channels you had in the scan list is set up to alert, then its going to alert. All channels in your scan list need to have all alerting off, this may be an issue if you have a TG set to play a tone, but I think you can turn off alerting on a knob by knob basis, by default its ID match.