GMRS Pirates using P25 with encryption NY/NJ

[Skypilot007]

Is this traffic on repeaters on 462.700MHz and 462.725MHz or simplex (on the repeater outputs)? It shouldn't be hard to locate the repeaters if they get used enough.

The P25 activity I've heard is on repeaters. I can only hear them during band openings as the repeaters are quite far north of me. I have observed P25 operation numerous times going back to last year, mainly on 462.600MHz which is a primary channel for the Blue Comm network. Also on 462.725 MHz. At the time I heard these transmissions they were not encrypted.

 

[AI7PM]

It's the new and improved CB.

 

[Hans13]

It isn't malicious interference if the pirates are unlicensed and operating illegally. The illegal users legally don't exist.

It doesn't work like that.

 

[amphibian]

Lets face it... DIgital is the future. It's just a matter of time before GMRS will be allowed to go digital. FCC has been hammering home the idea and need for better use of the spectrum for years and now it's time they listen to their own suggestions and approve digital for use on the GMRS band. There are many places in my travels over the years that have been and are using digital on GMRS. Is it leagal???? Not currently, Is it making better use of the spectrum???? Yes...

Also, let us not forget, the digital you are hearing and questioning may be by someone that applied for and got a waiver to do testing of digital on the GMRS frequencies..... and I couldn't think of a better place in the country to do those test especially with as much congestion of frequencies there are in that area. I know over the past years that getting a waiver is not that hard. I've even asked for a few myself, and not that long ago.

GMRS radio operators are entitled to the same new technologies as the commercial, PS, and yes even Amateur's radio operators are allowed. Lets not complain, but support the use of it, for testing or otherwise, as we all know that sooner or later, either by force or appreciation for the desire to have better use of the spectrum, FCC will eventually approve digital for GMRS. People should be doing what they can to learn all they can about digital communications so that when it comes about and approved next year they will be ready to move forward with upgrading to digital.

 

[SigIntel8600]

Lets face it... DIgital is the future. It's just a matter of time before GMRS will be allowed to go digital. FCC has been hammering home the idea and need for better use of the spectrum for years and now it's time they listen to their own suggestions and approve digital for use on the GMRS band. There are many places in my travels over the years that have been and are using digital on GMRS. Is it leagal???? Not currently, Is it making better use of the spectrum???? Yes...

Also, let us not forget, the digital you are hearing and questioning may be by someone that applied for and got a waiver to do testing of digital on the GMRS frequencies..... and I couldn't think of a better place in the country to do those test especially with as much congestion of frequencies there are in that area. I know over the past years that getting a waiver is not that hard. I've even asked for a few myself, and not that long ago.

GMRS radio operators are entitled to the same new technologies as the commercial, PS, and yes even Amateur's radio operators are allowed. Lets not complain, but support the use of it, for testing or otherwise, as we all know that sooner or later, either by force or appreciation for the desire to have better use of the spectrum, FCC will eventually approve digital for GMRS. People should be doing what they can to learn all they can about digital communications so that when it comes about and approved next year they will be ready to move forward with upgrading to digital.

Good grief where do I start with this post....... GMRS will never be approved for digital or encrypted transmissions. Digital is NOT the future for GMRS, GMRS operators are not "entitled" to anything other than operating their equipment as per current FCC regulations. Please cite the current process for obtaining a "waiver" to operate digital on GMRS as it is not listed in Part 95. Why would digital be "better use of the spectrum"?

 

[kruser]

GMRS will never be approved for digital or encrypted transmissions.

And if digital were approved for GMRS, I'd think they would follow the rule for digital in the amateur bands where encryption is not allowed.
Who knows if they would ever enforce it though.

 

[alcahuete]

Please cite the current process for obtaining a "waiver" to operate digital on GMRS as it is not listed in Part 95.

You'll find it under Experimental Licensing System with the FCC. Not everything is in Part 95.

Why would digital be "better use of the spectrum"?

You can go extreme narrowband, put the frequencies closer to together, and use the old part of the spectrum for Part 90, etc. I don't think we will hear that happen anytime soon, but it would absolutely be better use of the spectrum.

 

[mmckenna]

Good grief where do I start with this post....... GMRS will never be approved for digital or encrypted transmissions. Digital is NOT the future for GMRS, GMRS operators are not "entitled" to anything other than operating their equipment as per current FCC regulations. Please cite the current process for obtaining a "waiver" to operate digital on GMRS as it is not listed in Part 95. Why would digital be "better use of the spectrum"?

Be careful about using the term "never".

Waivers can be had by applying for an experimental license from the FCC, just like Northern California GMRS Users Group has been doing for the last few years. They are legally running DMR on GMRS frequencies.

https://apps.fcc.gov/els/GetAtt.html?id=234790&x=

.

 

[bill4long]

GMRS will never be approved for digital or encrypted transmissions.

Hmm. Do you have crystal ball or something? If so, what are your stock picks?

 

[kayn1n32008]

I'm not impressed by clowns using "real radios" P25 encrypted on GMRS .

Sounds like someone needs to fill out a hurt feeling report.

 

[SigIntel8600]

You'll find it under Experimental Licensing System with the FCC. Not everything is in Part 95.




You can go extreme narrowband, put the frequencies closer to together, and use the old part of the spectrum for Part 90, etc. I don't think we will hear that happen anytime soon, but it would absolutely be better use of the spectrum.

Thanks for this info.

Be careful about using the term "never".

Waivers can be had by applying for an experimental license from the FCC, just like Northern California GMRS Users Group has been doing for the last few years. They are legally running DMR on GMRS frequencies.

https://apps.fcc.gov/els/GetAtt.html?id=234790&x=

.

Thanks for this info.

 

[APX7500X2]

Be careful about using the term "never".

Waivers can be had by applying for an experimental license from the FCC, just like Northern California GMRS Users Group has been doing for the last few years. They are legally running DMR on GMRS frequencies.

https://apps.fcc.gov/els/GetAtt.html?id=234790&x=

.

I think you will see DMR on GMRS first as a new thing then P25 shortly after.

 

[mmckenna]

I think you will see DMR on GMRS first as a new thing then P25 shortly after.

I hope not. While I agree that digital is coming (eventually), this isn't amateur radio. Hopefully there will be one standard chosen by the FCC to keep things interoperable on some level. The last thing GMRS needs is the freakin' free for all of digital modes that happens on amateur radio frequencies. With amateur being about experimentation, it's fine. For GMRS being a personal use radio service, we don't need that.

While doing some interference tracking yesterday from a couple of high radio sites, I tuned across the FRS/GMRS spectrum. Quite a bit of digital in use on many of the frequencies.

 

[Skypilot007]

Though I love P25, if I had to choose a digital mode for GMRS I would prefer DMR. It just makes sense. Double the voice paths and many more less expensive options and abundance of DMR radios available. DMR has my vote. It would also be easy to keep the rif-raf out using only Motorola equipment and enabling RAS. Speaking of rif-raf, I almost fell out of my chair the other night hearing Danny Delise back on the air, guess he's out of jail and back to his old ways.

 

[ecps92]

But the kids need something to hope for, and somewhere to HIDE with their ENC

I hope not. While I agree that digital is coming (eventually), this isn't amateur radio. Hopefully there will be one standard chosen by the FCC to keep things interoperable on some level. The last thing GMRS needs is the freakin' free for all of digital modes that happens on amateur radio frequencies. With amateur being about experimentation, it's fine. For GMRS being a personal use radio service, we don't need that.

While doing some interference tracking yesterday from a couple of high radio sites, I tuned across the FRS/GMRS spectrum. Quite a bit of digital in use on many of the frequencies.

 

[mmckenna]

But the kids need something to hope for, and somewhere to HIDE with their ENC

Unfortunately we've become a country where ignorance is celebrated.

And God forbid we put any undo burdens on the US companies that are marketing/selling Cheap Chinese Radios to people that aren't even sure which end of the radio to speak into.

300 watt GMRS repeater with 9dB gain antenna running DMR, beaconing all the time, running CW ID every 5 minutes. I'm sure if it's not already happening somewhere in the country, someone is planning it.

 

[Marine_Cotporal]

I hope not. While I agree that digital is coming (eventually), this isn't amateur radio. Hopefully there will be one standard chosen by the FCC to keep things interoperable on some level. The last thing GMRS needs is the freakin' free for all of digital modes that happens on amateur radio frequencies. With amateur being about experimentation, it's fine. For GMRS being a personal use radio service, we don't need that.

While doing some interference tracking yesterday from a couple of high radio sites, I tuned across the FRS/GMRS spectrum. Quite a bit of digital in use on many of the frequencies.

Why not? If I want to use GMRS digitally for my family and buy 4 digital GMRS radios, what does that have to do with others? If you want to listen in, then get a digital radio. If not, then keep your analog.

 

[mmckenna]

Why not? If I want to use GMRS digitally for my family and buy 4 digital GMRS radios, what does that have to do with others? If you want to listen in, then get a digital radio. If not, then keep your analog.

Not sure I understand your statement.
I have no issue with the FCC allowing digital on GMRS. Until then, without the experimental license linked to above, it's not really an option.
Analog and digital will need to cooperate. I don't see the FCC suddenly forcing all GMRS users to digital. It's going to be a gradual progression. Trying to force analog and digital users to cooperate isn't going to go well. If they start allowing any/all digital modes on GMRS, it's just going to be a bigger mess.
GMRS was and is intended to be a shared service. Users cooperating will be necessary to keep it that way.

 

[Marine_Cotporal]

Not sure I understand your statement.
I have no issue with the FCC allowing digital on GMRS. Until then, without the experimental license linked to above, it's not really an option.
Analog and digital will need to cooperate. I don't see the FCC suddenly forcing all GMRS users to digital. It's going to be a gradual progression. Trying to force analog and digital users to cooperate isn't going to go well. If they start allowing any/all digital modes on GMRS, it's just going to be a bigger mess.
GMRS was and is intended to be a shared service. Users cooperating will be necessary to keep it that way.

What I’m saying is if they allowed Digital on GMRS, how does that affect anyone? Those that want to use digital use digital and those that don’t do not. Those that want to chit chat with others that they don’t know, can buy both. Those that don’t want to chit chat with others, can buy either analog or digital depending on their wants and add filters so that they don’t hear anyone else which is what they do with analog anyway.

I don’t see how allowing digital is forcing anyone to do anything.

 

[bill4long]

[delete]