GRE PSR 800 Pre Release Thread

[USScanner]

Any talk about it if it will be able to monitor the P25 Phase II

I know GRE is working on a Phase II scanner.. This is not it.

 

[n4jri]

Confused slightly:

20 "Scan sets" that represent groups of enabled scan lists. An object is scanned if: it's not locked out, it's in an enabled scan list, and the scan list is in an enabled scan set. By default, only one scan set is populated and it contains all 200 scan lists."

So will it work the same way as the PSR500 for scanlists, but just using a menu interface to turn on/off? I'm not quite sure I follow that.

This sounds to me like the setup on the AR8200 where you had hot keys that would each bring up a particular combination of scan banks. Of course on the 8200, I don't think that you could hot-key individual banks in combination.

They probably see it as a way to manage certain habitual combinations of those 200 SL's, given that this user interface isn't going be able to hot-key systems as directly as a 396.

I'm not nuts about this interface, but that capacity and feature set would sure be a blast on the 500...

73/Allen (N4JRI)

 

[burner50]

And here I was hoping for them to come out with something to track MOTOTRBO and NXDN In my dreams.....in my dreams

And MPT1327

 

[Mike_G_D]

• 200 scan lists
• 200 V-Folders
• 20 "Scan sets" that represent groups of enabled scan lists. An object is scanned if: it's not locked out, it's in an enabled scan list, and the scan list is in an enabled scan set. By default, only one scan set is populated and it contains all 200 scan lists.

I read this to mean it has a total of 200 scan lists with AN ADDITIONAL sub-dividing layer (YAY!!!) of 20 "scan sets" meaning that you can have, as an example, 20 scan lists as members of "scan set 1", 30 scan lists as members of "scan set 2", 100 scan lists as members of "scan set 3", etc., all the way up to the limit of 200 scan lists total. So, for example, for me, I could setup (in my usual personal desired fashion) different scan lists for Fire, Law, Emergency, Medical, Roads, and Misc (with the extra scan lists, I could even add further subdivide beyond the catch-all "Misc" category) then have a separate set of each of those sub-divided among different "scan sets" which, I would then name as "City/Local", "County", "State". and "Federal" with a lot of lists and sets still available; this is GREAT to me as I am very anal about sub-dividing categories. In my PSR-500 I have setup my 20 scan lists this way and use my TSYS's to sub divide the trunked stuff but I do not have that separate sub division for my conventional stuff. If my interpretation of Don's description is correct, the PSR-800 the "scan sets" provide that separate sub-division which is trunk/conventional type agnostic! Of course, the default setup puts all 200 scan lists in scan set number 1 and only that scan set is initially enabled but the user can change this.

This is my interpretation, of course I could be mistaken.

Now, I am interested in the statement written by Don as "Can be configured to supply IF output through headphone jack. Sort of a built-in "discriminator tap". To me, with my RF engineering background, that is confusing; a true "Intermediate Frequency", "IF", output is, ideally, just a down-converted (or up-converted in some cases) raw form of the RF signal input to the antenna connector while a discriminator output is processed output from the final IF conversion stage primarily intended to pre-process signals with angle modulated information (such as FM, PM, C4FM, etc.) to create linearly proportional amplitude variations which map to the instantaneous frequency variations (or phase variations) of the angle modulated signal prior to being presented with final filtering including de-emphasis and final AF filtering in FM analog signals. The common tap point for such programs as Unitrunker, etc, is the discriminator output which then bypasses the FM de-emphasis and final AF filtering - this is needed for a good usage by the demodulating software using computer soundcards for processing of unfiltered digital signals. Having a true IF output would be useful for those of us interested better post-processing of more complex modulation types (such as may be needed for pi/4DQPSK and maybe forms of so-called "linear simulcast" P25 signals) for which you may need even cleaner (more accurately put less processed) raw RF as a starting point for further processing. In short, a discriminator output is nice, a true raw final IF output is terrific, and both would be "fantabulistic" (especially if a true I/Q output is also added to the SELECTABLE mix!;-) (Well, I can dream!). Anyway, I am unclear if the output Don is describing is true final IF raw output or a discriminator output.

-Mike

 

[JPSan]

Phase II standard?

I know GRE is working on a Phase II scanner.. This is not it.

That's pretty cool that GRE has a Phase II scanner in development when as far as I heard that Phase II is still in the development phase and no specifics have been set in stone , yet.
GRE is darn good then! ..
GRE is there nothing they CAN'T do...ahead of the manufacturers...:lol:

 

[krokus]

Your Iphone is not a scanner, you are listening to an audio feed provided by someone's scanner. That being the case, any scanner is going to pick-up better.

The biggest advantage of having a scanner, over listening to what someone else is listening to, is that you choose what agencies you monitor, along with when and how you monitor them.

This scanner will just make it easier for the radio illiterate to monitor the radio signals.

 

[wrhenker]

Mmmm. Very interesting!

 

[mobile1]

MSRP on PSR-800 EZ Scan ?

So is there any rumors on the cost of this new GRE? I'm thinking $349.99 and then on sale a little later for say $289.99 I would like to see these in the big box stores like WalMart later this year. That would be great.

 

[ScanXO]

so whats new
digital formats - as stated over over again
dstar, motboat(turbo) passport which can be run under a computer and a program .....
not next year the year after back to sleep.......

 

[rgchristy]

"200 scan lists"

This alone is worth the price of admission. This was my biggest gripe with GRE. If you live in a metropolitan area, 20 scan lists are not enough. You can have 1,000 V-Folders, but if you can't listen to everything you want at one time, they're worthless. Thank you GRE! (and Don, of course)

Rich C

 

[KK4HG]

PSR 800 Photo

 

[DonS]

Site names:
The data organization is nearly identical to the PRO-107 / PSR-700. A trunked system has one or more sites (limited only by card space). A site has up to 32 frequencies, an alpha tag, etc. When receiving a talkgroup on a system that has two or more sites programmed, the site's alpha tag can be displayed, alternating with the system's alpha tag.

Scan Sets
Mike_G_D's interpretation is right on.

An object (talkgroup or conventional channel) can belong to any or all of 200 scan lists. A scan list can belong to any or all of 20 scan sets. Scan lists and scan sets can be individually enabled/disabled. An object is scanned if and only if: it's not locked out AND it's a member of at least one enabled scan list AND at least one of those enabled, member scan lists is a member of at least one enabled scan set. Mike's description of using a very fine granularity (geography, agency, and/or usage) for scan lists, then grouping them in scan sets, is precisely how the feature was intended.

By default, only scan set 1 is enabled and it contains all 200 scan lists. This makes the scan sets feature "transparent". If you want to use them, you'd start changing memberships.

"IF" Output
It's really a discriminator out - the signal used internally for all decoding and demodulation of all signals. For anyone familiar with tapping a PRO-96 or PSR-500, it's the signal from "TP4". It's just passed through the audio amp and sent to the headphone jack (and, optionally, the speaker).

 

[guitarbrian30]

usb port

So can you make the usb port into a GPS port? Just wondering? That would be cool if they "GRE" made that port do just about anything you want too... I guess if you have the wiring detail and the proper knowledge you can rig your own port.

I live 20 miles from two other states. Uggghhhhh, I guess setting the scanlists up like my 106 is the only way out of that. Would be cool if they just tossed a GPS ant. within the top of the unit..

now time to update all the database for all the new users for the pre-programmed units... Since is the next wave of scanning technology..

When is the release date?

 

[K8PBX]

Sound's pretty cool. I'm anxious to hear if there's any improvement in decoding P25 CQPSK simulcast systems.

 

[JohnNDenver]

I know GRE is working on a Phase II scanner.. This is not it.

The model GRE PSR 800 is the APCO P25. The price for it is as secret as obamas birth certificate. I think $299.00 is on target.

 

[svrstorm]

Im very excited

This is what alot of us folks have been waiting for. I noticed that it holds 4 aa batteries and also the audio output shows 500mw so it should be much louder than my pro-107.

 

[Mike_G_D]

Site names:
The data organization is nearly identical to the PRO-107 / PSR-700. A trunked system has one or more sites (limited only by card space). A site has up to 32 frequencies, an alpha tag, etc. When receiving a talkgroup on a system that has two or more sites programmed, the site's alpha tag can be displayed, alternating with the system's alpha tag.

Scan Sets
Mike_G_D's interpretation is right on.

An object (talkgroup or conventional channel) can belong to any or all of 200 scan lists. A scan list can belong to any or all of 20 scan sets. Scan lists and scan sets can be individually enabled/disabled. An object is scanned if and only if: it's not locked out AND it's a member of at least one enabled scan list AND at least one of those enabled, member scan lists is a member of at least one enabled scan set. Mike's description of using a very fine granularity (geography, agency, and/or usage) for scan lists, then grouping them in scan sets, is precisely how the feature was intended.

By default, only scan set 1 is enabled and it contains all 200 scan lists. This makes the scan sets feature "transparent". If you want to use them, you'd start changing memberships.

"IF" Output
It's really a discriminator out - the signal used internally for all decoding and demodulation of all signals. For anyone familiar with tapping a PRO-96 or PSR-500, it's the signal from "TP4". It's just passed through the audio amp and sent to the headphone jack (and, optionally, the speaker).

Thanks, Don, for the clarification, ok, well, the true discriminator output is still nice to have. Now a user has a choice between using the internally processed digital data output of the PC/IF CCDUMP or the relatively raw analog discriminator output for usage with programs like Unitrunker and Trunk88 to decode the the EDACS, Moto3600 baud, 9600 baud P25, and LTR data streams plus the usefulness of having the "raw" discriminator output for usage with other decoders to use for other less common (in the US, at any rate) trunking formats and for usage with programs like DSD for decoding various digital voice modes other than the now commonly supported P25 phase 1 variants. That's a step in the right direction and, in my view, surprising as a feature for a unit of this type given the primary target user category - the non-technical scanner user.

I'm still hoping that GRE is working on or soon (within a year or so) to release an "advanced technical user" category radio scanner for the consumer crowd which will have pre-discriminator IF output and/or hardware I/Q demodulator output. I guess the statement from a previous poster (someone who is "in the know", I guess...???) that they are working on a Phase II capable scanner is a good sign here. In my opinion, the general commonly held view that since P25 phase II is still not finalized as a standard completely yet the scanner manufacturers shouldn't yet be expected to create a phase II capable scanner is supremely silly, at least from a non-bean counter bottom line revenue centric technical/engineering-only standpoint. DMR is an open source TDMA based standard and Motorola has their pre-standard "phase II-like" system so I am fairly positive that, given the advanced state of digital hardware, one could relatively easily engineer a scanner with upgradeable firmware which could support these formats right now and be upgradeable via firmware to support the "standard" when it is ultimately finalized. In other words, form a technical only standpoint, if you design a scanner which supports DMR it should be quite capable of supporting MotoTurbo. In the same vein, if it has the hardware to support the Motorola pre-Phase II P25 variant (I know this is different from MotoTurbo which is why it is separately addressed here) it should be easily capable of supporting the future final P25 phase II standard with just firmware updates. So, working on this now, and even actually producing and marketing the unit now, is, in my technical non-bean counter centric opinion, quite feasible.

But I also believe that it is silly to believe that producing a consumer scanner capable of properly handling simulcast P25 is not practical. I KNOW it can be done somewhat cheaply since I understand the hardware. I can only surmise that the bean counter types dominate these engineering decisions to a horribly and sickeningly extreme extent.

Anyway, I do find the 800 to be a nice step forward even given the "non-technical user" focus so I applaud GRE for coming out with it.

-Mike

 

[sjgostovich]

I'll continue to wait...

This is GRE's response to the Home Patrol?!! I'll wait..

 

[DonS]

This is GRE's response to the Home Patrol?

No. This is GRE's follow-up to the PRO-107 / PSR-700.

 

[W6KRU]

This is GRE's response to the Home Patrol?!! I'll wait..

I hope that GRE doesn't have a response to the HP. I would prefer that they use engineering resources on something useful to those of us with a little more knowledge than Great Aunt Milly.