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I have not any issues with CPD, on my xts 5000.
Greater Cleveland Radio Communication Network
- Thread starter Thunderbolt
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Thanks, I only broadcast District 1 and 2 and will update if it was the antenna when it is installed. I thought of trying a antenna amplifier but have not decided to yet until the new antenna arrives. But last couple years the Tram worked fine and I am fairly close to the towers
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This sounds like the same issue I had way back about 7 years ago had a mobile in the car. Kenwood tk-760 had an issue with my tram antenna out of no where. Replaced it with a different one and everything worked again. Before replacing I had maybe 1,000 of range when receive and transmit
I am crossing my fingers it is the Tram antenna. I did notice the top bolt kept spinning, not sure what it attaches to but that may be the problem. I should have another antenna within a week, little better then the last one
an39511
Member
I am coming in late here but I suspect that storms, be it lightning or high wind effect their radio network. I am located in a terrible multi path area and when the Cleveland system is operating normally I have a yagi pointed towards Hopkins airport. Every time there is a bad lighting storm or high winds the Hopkins location seem to be affected. When this happens I must re-aim the yagi to the W130 site until the Hopkins location returns to normal. I don't know how or why but I suspect that it requires some manual intervention from radio service to correct the problem. I have seen it take up to several days before things return to normal. I gather that there is a lot of built in redundancy so if one area is affected the other tower sites fill in until repairs are made. Because my main fixed antenna is roof mounted and a pain to aim, I use a second yagi that I can easily point where needed until they fix whatever they need to fix.
Added. Don't forget that sometimes more attenuation is better. Years ago I tried amplifiers and it just made it worse.
Added. Don't forget that sometimes more attenuation is better. Years ago I tried amplifiers and it just made it worse.
Most likely path losses caused by the weather, which causes greater path losses the higher you go in frequency. Even water on the outside of the antenna can change things somewhat. Doubtful that there's actually a physical problem requiring service tech intervention if the problem happens every time it rains or whatever; the system administrators wouldn't allow such a problem to continue past the first time unless they're really dumb.
Real radios can adapt to this issue with little or no trouble (and the user probably won't even notice) but if you're reliant on a single path, you notice it every time.
I replaced the antenna, after moving the old from the attic to the garage roof it did not help. So the new antenna is in the attic again and 97% back to normal and hearing all calls again but a couple hiccups every once and a while but tolerable. So in my case it seems the old Tram antenna was bad in some way. I am near Sunrise part off Maywood and there is a tower not sure who has what on the tower but it is on Clinton Rd like 400' from me and I am not far from another tower bt Rays indoor bike track the old silk mills they used to call it by Clinton and West Blvd and more cumminication devices on the large chimney there and that is only like 1,000 feet from me. So no idea where I get my signal from but I do pretty good now again. I am closer to First District maybe 2+1/2 to 3 miles away also
an39511
Member
I think somewhere in this thread is the location of the sites being used for Cleveland. As I recall the first district is one. Another is I176 / I480 and the one at Hopkins is a smaller site, probably to help service most of the South West suburbs. If you continue to have multi-path issues get yourself a very narrow focused yagi and point it directly at a site. Adding a bunch of attenuation may help too. I don't know if the Hopkins site affects you much but for me I find it rather wonky, especially when a lightning storm passes over the airport. I have two identical antennas, one roof mounted and another ground mounted in a weather protected area. When I have reception issues I switch off the main antenna onto the ground antenna. If its aimed in the same direction it too has problems that is when I swing it to point at the first district. The South West suburbs using the Cleveland site also experiences increased issues during this time as well. If I'm not mistaken, Cleveland Communications is the company that services that system.
Ok. For now I am doing pretty good. The Tram one I got this time has the whip that goes up in the air from the center. I put the long one in and it came with 2 shorter ones like 18" with a black thing on it. The whip that is in it now is like 36" straight stainless rod. Not sure if the black thing does anything but may try to put that in and take the long one out and see if it does even better yet
budevans
Member
Ron,
Just curious, what make and model scanner(s) are you using?
Based on your location and the location of the local GCRCN towers (1st District West 130th & I77, 2 to 2-1/2 miles) (Hopkins Airport 4 1/2 to 6 miles) (Justice Center on West 3rd at 4 1/2 to 6 miles). At those ranges, you should be able to monitor with a rubber ducky.
The only receive issue you should have with most P25 scanners, should be Simulcast distortion.
budevans
Member
Thx Ed, good catch.
budevans
Member
Nope. The District 1 antenna is located at the District 1 building. Which is at West 130th just north of I-71.
budevans
Member
I've looked over several of your posts and based on what you've described (garble & audio cut out) it sounds to me like you have an intermittent Simulcast distortion problem. Tom Swisher (wa8pyr) did a reply to an39511, who is having the same issue you are.
As the weather changes, it affects the signal strength that you get from each of the towers. Since none of your scanners are capable of handling Simulcast distortion, in my opinion your best bet would be to buy an inexpensive Yagi.
The ground plane antenna's like the Tram are omni directional. So your scanners are receiving out of sync signals from multiple towers. Your scanners are decoding these multiple out of sync signals, which is where the garble and cut outs come from. You need to receive a single dominant signal. The only way to do that is with a Yagi.
A couple of suggestions.
1. If you decide to buy a Yagi, get it from a company (like Scanner Master) that allows for returns. Just to be safe, in case the Yagi doesn't resolve your issue.
2. If you get a Yagi, plan on spending some time to find the best direction for reception. Most folks start by pointing in the direction of the towers they know of. I have a Yagi that I use to monitor MARCS. What I found out while testing the Yagi was, that I ended up having to point it in a direction where there aren't any towers. Moral of the story is, don't become fixated on the tower locations. Just go with the direction that works the best.
Swipesy
Member
As Bud has stated a Yagi is best to try and knock down simulcast. Also, a Yagi antenna receives off the side and rear of the antenna as well as the front of the Yagi. So as Bud suggested you have to play with a Yagi to find a "sweet" direction.
Ok, I thought they may have repeaters to carry their signal to further away districts in case they had to communicate with them
If I broadcast 2 districts and say I am aiming a Yagi towards 1 of the districts, does that mean I am only going to get the 1 district? All the districts actually get dispatched from a downtown location I have been in their dispatch center. But I know in the zone cars they might tell D2 to change over to channel 1 that D1 has some questions they want to ask. Just need to know for sure if a Yagi pointed in the direction of District 1 will also pick up District 2 or would I be limited to just 1 district. If I am limited then pointing to downtown may have to be the way to go
an39511
Member
No, you will receive all coms from all districts. Cleveland is a simulcast system meaning the same transmission is being sent out on multiple towers. That is why scanners have difficulty receiving because the signals are coming from multiple locations and due to the difference in distance from each of those towers and your scanner the signal is arriving a few milliseconds off which confuses the scanner on which signal to listen to.
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