have Lost Alco trunk CC

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Ben96cal

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We are getting several reports of no CC on the alco trunk system. I have checked all the CC and find nothing but voice traffic.. Anyone know of a switch over or new CC that has come into effect?

Ben
 

fmon

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WayneH

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ALCO updated all their equipment to support rebanding a few weeks ago. At the moment they're running a mix of 866 and 850 freqs. I haven't seen anything to indicate anyone has to update their scanner bandplans but you may as well start since it's best to program the -15MHz CC channels along with the current ones.

As of this post the CC is on 868.7625. The only "rebanded" channel I'm seeing is 852.5875, which is being used at the "LOCAL" sites only. Expect to see changes soon.
 

dougr1252

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New CC - 852.4125

For a while this morning the control channel was only on 852.4125. I've read that one procedure for rebanding a Mot system is to split the 4 control channels over the 2 bands so maybe that's what they're doing. Keep in mind that Northern CA has reallocated all 851-854 frequencies and most agencies are NOT rebanding exactly 15 mhz down from existing channels. We're just special ...

There's a list of new / future channel assignments here:

Northern California 851-854 MHz Frequency Assignments - The RadioReference Wiki

Kelty's latest guide also has similar data.

In my rebanded scanners all I've done so far is to add 852.4125 to the freq list for ALCO and they work fine again, but they're not anywhere near done reconfiguring.
 

WayneH

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They've been doing them two at a time it appears. I think things got shortly postponed due to some non-upgraded stragglers. I don't think things are going well as the system assignments are a mess. Saw some busies yesterday.

I believe 852.4125 is the new CH 1, and took the place of 866.9375. 852.5875 is trunking Wide talkgroups but I can't hear it from my location like I can all the other Wide channels.
 

kma371

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ALCO updated all their equipment to support rebanding a few weeks ago. At the moment they're running a mix of 866 and 850 freqs. I haven't seen anything to indicate anyone has to update their scanner bandplans but you may as well start since it's best to program the -15MHz CC channels along with the current ones.

As of this post the CC is on 868.7625. The only "rebanded" channel I'm seeing is 852.5875, which is being used at the "LOCAL" sites only. Expect to see changes soon.

I've been running trunk88 about a month now and have been noticing 850 freqs popping up lately....thought it was a bug in the program.
 

dougr1252

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Just based on frequency order, 852.4125 is in the same spot as 866.9375. So the other new control channels should be 852.6250 (867.400), 853.1125 (868.0875), and 853.7625 (868.7625). If the freq order is right, then 852.5875 takes the place of 867.2500 which is only on the west side sites.
 

WayneH

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I can confirm 852.4125 is the new CH 1 (old 866.9375). I'm almost positive 852.5875 took the place of 13, which is/was 866.1500. At the moment CH 13 is disabled and 852.5875 hasn't been used. What makes it difficult is they mark some channels protected so they only get used when the channel pool fills up.

In the database I have the channels in logical numeric order as defined within the system.

WIDE:
01 852.4125d
02 853.1125d
03 868.7625d
04 867.4000
05 867.9250
06 866.8000
07 867.1500
08 866.4250
19 868.0375
20 868.3625
21 868.7125

LOCAL:
09 852.5875
10 867.6750
11 868.4375
12 868.2750
13 866.1500
14 868.6500
16 852.7875
17 868.2250
18 868.2000

ETA: Updated freqs as of 5/18
 
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Window_Seat

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I have a BCT8, and have deleted everything, and reprogrammed everything from scratch, and it's now working like a charm. The trunked IDs are the same (so far).

Here are the freq's:

Red (c) are primary control channels | Blue (a) are alternate control channels.

852.41250a
852.58750
866.42500
866.80000
867.15000
867.40000
867.67500
867.77500
867.92500
868.03750
868.08750c
868.20000
868.22500
868.27500
868.36250
868.43750
868.65000
868.71250
868.76250c

(ETA):One of the Newark frequencies I've observed being used in the trunked network is missing from this list: 866.9375 (so far as I can tell), and again, I have read the above again, and know why now :D. RR is great!

Erik.
 
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dougr1252

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How do you determine system order vs frequency order?

I can confirm 852.4125 is the new CH 1 (old 866.9375). I'm almost positive 852.5875 took the place of 13, which is/was 866.1500. At the moment CH 13 is disabled and 852.5875 hasn't been used. What makes it difficult is they mark some channels protected so they only get used when the channel pool fills up.

In the database I have the channels in logical numeric order as defined within the system.
 

bigdaddylove

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Grrr!

I am SO confused! Which list do I use? I have all three programed but I still seems to be missing things like the first beep of a ALCO call and it seems I don't get Alameda PD before 8:00pm.

I have a RS Pro-433, am I screwed with rebanding in the Bay Area?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.
 

dougr1252

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Use the database page - Alameda, County of (Public Safety) Trunking System, Oakland, California - Scanner Frequencies

This is up to date with what's actually on the air. The other lists are just a heads-up for what's coming.

According to the Wiki, the PRO-433 is not upgraded for Motorola rebanding, so it won't follow calls correctly on Motorola systems like Alco and SF when rebanded frequencies ending in 0 (.1000, .6750, etc.) are used, but it will follow rebanded frequencies ending in 5 (.0125, .3375, etc.). The PRO-433 will still track EDACS and LTR systems correctly after you program in the new frequencies in the right order.
 
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bigdaddylove

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Thanks, dougr1252. I am so bummed since I just got this scanner not that long ago and thought the Bay Area was not going to be rebanded.

At least I can still use it for marine, CHP and whatnot.
 

bigdaddylove

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so, is it me or, does there seem to be more ALCO traffic on my PRO433 between 8pm and 8am since the rebanding?

also, is there any chance that rebanding will not affect one city's system as much as another's?

thanks!
 

WayneH

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How do you determine system order vs frequency order?
It's takes time but when the radio techs are testing channels on the system, and they announce the channel number, it makes it easy. Otherwise you watch for the diagnostic messages (with trunking software) that indicate channels out of service and look for ones that aren't used.

It's not easy and it generally takes time. One thing about ALCO is many of the channels go OOS due to input interference (With Trunker these are the $8Axx and $8Cxx messages). This causes the system to take the channel out for around 10s.


I got a hit on 866.1500 (CH 13) today so I don't know if they reverted or the new channel doesn't take its place.
 

WayneH

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so, is it me or, does there seem to be more ALCO traffic on my PRO433 between 8pm and 8am since the rebanding?
There's really been little that's change that's gonna affect operation. Other than the new control channel, anything else is not new to scanner operation.

also, is there any chance that rebanding will not affect one city's system as much as another's
Yes. It depends on which frequencies the system operates on. If they run on the channels spaced 25.0kHz from 851.0125MHz (851.0125, 851.0375, etc) then any scanner will work. When they use the new rebanded channels (Spaced 25kHz from 851MHz like 851.0250, 851.0500, 851.0750, etc) the scanner thinks they're other frequencies because the assignments were reused. Basically, if the fourth digit to the right of the decimal is a 5, any scanner is safe.

Any new channel ALCO has used so far is still compliant with older scanners. They'll eventually use the new rebanded channels and that's when some scanner will not work (regardless of programming).
 

Ben96cal

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re: EBRCSA

When should I expect to need to shell out for a digital scanner once Alco switches over to their digital system? Looks like a ways off looking at the meeting notes on their website..
 

bigdaddylove

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Cool, thanks WanyeH. I have just a few more questions...

1. So, when will the rebanding be all said and done?

2. When you said, "Yes. It depends on which frequencies the system operates on." Does that mean a city picks the frequencies it will use as opposed to the computer?

3. If a city does pick its frequencies, how do I know which frequencies the city of Alameda will run on?

It seems I am getting about half of the calls for ALCO Fire I once received. Alameda Police scans seem to have dropped although not as much as ALCO Fire.

Thanks again!
 

trooperdude

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Thanks, dougr1252. I am so bummed since I just got this scanner not that long ago and thought the Bay Area was not going to be rebanded.

.
Rebanding is Nationwide. Always has been.

I have to spend some time tomorrow seeing if my old Pro 2096 and Pro 96's can
handle the rebanding.

One 800 Spectra mobile will already be a brick for ALCO. and will have to become my Med91
scanner. :D
 
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