Henry County New P25 Phase 1 phase 2 capable System

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Buttabean

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Well i see the residents of henry county that own the Uniden BCD325P2 Police Scanners arent gonna be able to hear Henry County Law Enforcement pretty soon. The control freqs were just posted to RR yesterday which means their getting closer to utilizing the new system installed by Harris Corp.


RFSS Site Name Freqs
1 (1) 010 (A) Site 10 852.050c 852.700 853.9875

Upon a little investigating i found the presentation for the commissioners online with photos. It states its 40% complete in august so its gotta be 70-80% by now since March was the deadline. I dont know since im only a Scanner Hobbyist/Amateur Radio Skywarn Spotter. Im hoping they dont go 100% encrypted like clayton county did, i have family & friends in Henry so i can monitor while down there visiting. :wink:
 

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Why won't those with a XXXP2 scanner be able to hear them? Only those with Provoice can hear them now.

I presume because Harris is almost impossible to receive with a scanner due to simulcast distortion?
 

Buttabean

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Posted on Broadcastify Previously

Why won't those with a XXXP2 scanner be able to hear them? Only those with Provoice can hear them now.

I presume because Harris is almost impossible to receive with a scanner due to simulcast distortion?
Its because on their Broadcastify feed for the henry cty fire dept (That Feed Is now offline due to the new system being implemented) they had a note that said They were moving to a new P25 Phase II system in the near future and Law enforcement TG's expected to be encrypted. They used to not be a scanner made that could recv EDACS Provoice then that XXXP2 scanner was released that could recv the provoice. And now that scanner wont be able to pickup whats encrypted, but thats why i said HOPEFULLY they dont go with 100% encryption like clayton county did, u cant hear the Police, Sheriff, animal control, code enforcement, Fire, EMS, Corrections, water, or ANY of the county services radios EXCEPT for the school buses, they are on a LTR Standard radio. Henry may only encrypt law enforcement TG or go partial with a TAC channel but who knows. Within the next month i maybe close enough with my TRX-1 to enter the control channel into it and scan with a wildcard to see what i can find out. :)
 
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....I didn't realize someone had "Broadcastified" Henry Co.'s Radio traffic.

That does tend to change things... But it's not because of a particular scanner.
 

Buttabean

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....I didn't realize someone had "Broadcastified" Henry Co.'s Radio traffic.

That does tend to change things... But it's not because of a particular scanner.
Their fire dept (Someone Thats Employed with henry county fire) had a radio (Fire Dispatch Ch Only) linked into broadcastify, not a civilian with a scanner. My ham buddy david i call him works for their fire dept. His Ericsson work radio has access to everything on the county system, their old EDACS Provoice system that is, im sure hes getting an upgrade to a nice motorola now though.
 

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I don't see why they are "Upgrading" (?) though, besides possibly being the "end of life" nonsense. Their EDACS/Provoice system sounds great. I know P25 is the current standard, and I understand their wanting to comply and such, but wow, thats like putting your 2010 F350 King Ranch that looks and runs great out in the back yard to sit and rot away, and going out to buy a brand new one and pay cash for it.
 

MTS2000des

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I don't see why they are "Upgrading" (?) though, besides possibly being the "end of life" nonsense..
EDACS/ProVoice is being sunsetted. Like Smartnet/Smartzone 4.xx, it is dated legacy technology. I am surprised Harris has kept it alive this long. Shows you how they listen to their customers and want to keep them happy supporting very old technology (25 years+). Their competition killed off this level of support (at least on infrastructure) close to 15 years ago.

I know P25 is the current standard, and I understand their wanting to comply and such, but wow, thats like putting your 2010 F350 King Ranch that looks and runs great out in the back yard to sit and rot away, and going out to buy a brand new one and pay cash for it.
Not really a good comparison. Your 2010 F350 can drive on the same roads a 2018 Raptor can. EDACS/Provoice cores are legacy design (many are circuit switched), no ISSI capability in the core or subscribers (at least on an EDACS/ProVoice system). We're moving that direction in the metro area. We're already using ISSI to replace the legacy UASI system. Henry is making the right moves to be on the same page. For Henry to play in that court, P-25 is the only option. Fayette will have their P-25 system online in the next 12-18 months, it only makes sense. Everyone around Henry will be on an ISSI capable P-25 system.

This makes for great opportunities for interoperability at the network level. And not this garbage pail "patching through radio gateways" either. In my ISSI automatic roaming tests, it is a seemless handoff between disparate systems. No fumbling with changing zones, asking a dispatcher to patch CCGW resources, and muffled audio with long tails or breaks due to VOX kicking out.
 

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Fair enough.

Would be nice if their existing system could be used for something, though. It is so crisp and clear, and you rarely hear garbled traffic on it. (I admit, I don't monitor it a lot, this is from casually listening, and talking to HCSO/HCPD officers)

But I haven't considered the other operational and interoperability functions you mentioned. Yep, P25 is the way to go, and you are right on the money, Larry.

What usually happens to all the old portables, mobiles, base stations, etc. at "end of life" transitioning when they aren't going to use it anymore?
 

MTS2000des

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Would be nice if their existing system could be used for something, though. It is so crisp and clear, and you rarely hear garbled traffic on it. (I admit, I don't monitor it a lot, this is from casually listening, and talking to HCSO/HCPD officers)
I can't comment on the infrastructure in the EDACS world. I can tell you that keeping 27 year old MSF5000's, Spectra TACs, and doing mod comps every month because old hardware drifts out of spec becomes a labor intensive act just to keep something sounding good and up to public safety quality. It ends up costing real dollars in terms of man hours. Nevermind that when parts are needed, you're SOL and pulling parts from carcasses. Not exactly what you want when people's lives depend on this stuff. This was what I stepped into when I came to my current agency. Talk about a literal trial by fire.

Contrast that to the modern P25 world. GTR8000s are trouble free for the most part (even GEN 1s like an agency down the street has had online since 2008 are running strong with almost zero major failures), and full factory support means we all sleep easier.

I am sure the same things go on in a Harris shop. Radios are radios.

What usually happens to all the old portables, mobiles, base stations, etc. at "end of life" transitioning when they aren't going to use it anymore?
Most of our analog radios were traded in towards our new purchase of APX hardware. This may or may not be what Harris offers Henry county. Or they may surplus them, sell them on GovDeals, just depends on whatever that agencies' protocol is.
 

476259

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I’m in Henry County and I’ve been listening to PD since Uniden released the firmware upgrade for Provoice. I’ve entered the new frequencies and can hear the dispatchers but the mobile units are garbled. Does this mean they are encrypted?

Edited. I see now where this is a Harris simulcast issue. Looks like I’ll dig out a yagi.
 
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P25 system is partially active. Fire dispatch is in the clear. PD is in fact encrypted.
 

476259

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P25 system is partially active. Fire dispatch is in the clear. PD is in fact encrypted.
Not good! This morning everything is garbled. I’m close to one of transmitter and was hoping it was a simulcasting issue, but you are saying it’s encrypted. I’m not liking where this is going.
 

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Found this while playing with DSD+
P25-1 Site:10, Network 92511.00A-10.10, NAC 00A, Frequencies 851.1750, 851.3500, 851.8375, CC 852.0500, 852.7000, 853.2125, 853.8750, 853.9875. Some, but not all traffic is encrypted.
 

tncem

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Henry likes to operate in the black under the disguise of "officer safety". They've always operated out of public view and their attitude is that they will continue to do so. Unfortunately, our commissioners believe this garbage.

I could use a hand putting this new system into my BCD436HP is anyone has done it yet. I thought HPDB would have updated their system, but I guess not.
 
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Henry likes to operate in the black under the disguise of "officer safety". They've always operated out of public view and their attitude is that they will continue to do so. Unfortunately, our commissioners believe this garbage.

I could use a hand putting this new system into my BCD436HP is anyone has done it yet. I thought HPDB would have updated their system, but I guess not.
Henry county (Co. police, LG, Hampton, McD) has been out in the open every since they were all on 155.595 with "KSU625" callsign wayyy back in the 80's and 90's, and on up through the Provoice system. It wasn't until they just recently switched over to the P25 system that there has been any widespread encryption, and it appears to be mainly used on the units, dispatch seems to be in the clear, as does Fire/rescue ops and other agencies.
I don't know what you are basing your information from that they have "always" tried to operate out of the public view, could you please provide some examples?
 

tncem

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Sure. You didn't listen to them for the entire time they were ProVoice, except for the last year and a half or so. They operate out of public listening capability because they don't want the public to know what they're up to. Do you think they will continue to broadcast their PD dispatch in the clear? Once the new bugs are worked out they'll be black all around, just like Clayton County. Enough examples for you?
 

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Sure. You didn't listen to them for the entire time they were ProVoice, except for the last year and a half or so. They operate out of public listening capability because they don't want the public to know what they're up to. Do you think they will continue to broadcast their PD dispatch in the clear? Once the new bugs are worked out they'll be black all around, just like Clayton County. Enough examples for you?
I didn't see any example, and you don't know what I was listening to. Regardless, ProVoice was the format of digital signal on their EDACS system. That system was not chosen due to the inability for off the shelf scanners to be able to monitor it, there is so much more that goes into choosing a vendor than that. And they had the ability to encrypt had they wanted to, but for all those years, they did not. And there were people listening in before "off the shelf" scanners could monitor ProVoice, by other means. (Ever used a computer with the "dongle" thing before?)

Put your tin foil hat back on, sheesh.
 

tncem

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I didn't see any example, and you don't know what I was listening to. Regardless, ProVoice was the format of digital signal on their EDACS system. That system was not chosen due to the inability for off the shelf scanners to be able to monitor it, there is so much more that goes into choosing a vendor than that. And they had the ability to encrypt had they wanted to, but for all those years, they did not. And there were people listening in before "off the shelf" scanners could monitor ProVoice, by other means. (Ever used a computer with the "dongle" thing before?)

Put your tin foil hat back on, sheesh.
Yep. Most public safety radio systems are purchased by EGO. No interoperability taken into consideration when purchasing EDACS systems whatsoever.
 

MTS2000des

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Yep. Most public safety radio systems are purchased by EGO. No interoperability taken into consideration when purchasing EDACS systems whatsoever.

You broadbrush an entire industry. Typical of someone who has zero real working knowledge of the business. How many public safety radio systems have you been involved with implementing? Project timelines and agencies please.
 
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