• Effective immediately we will be deleting, without notice, any negative threads or posts that deal with the use of encryption and streaming of scanner audio.

    We've noticed a huge increase in rants and negative posts that revolve around agencies going to encryption due to the broadcasting of scanner audio on the internet. It's now worn out and continues to be the same recycled rants. These rants hijack the threads and derail the conversation. They no longer have a place anywhere on this forum other than in the designated threads in the Rants forum in the Tavern.

    If you violate these guidelines your post will be deleted without notice and an infraction will be issued. We are not against discussion of this issue. You just need to do it in the right place. For example:
    https://forums.radioreference.com/rants/224104-official-thread-live-audio-feeds-scanners-wait-encryption.html

Hex vs Dec

Status
Not open for further replies.

N9JIG

Sheriff
Moderator
Joined
Dec 14, 2001
Messages
4,006
Location
Far NW Valley
Loumaag wrote:

I am going to close this as some of this advice is just going to confuse the newer scanner users. The DEC we show in the Database is the Uniden Decimal Value. This is the value that all trunk tracking scanners use. No trunk tracking scanner uses anything else.

To the old hands:
It would depend on what system as to if the HEX value we show in the DB could be converted to the Uniden Decimal value directly or not. The HEX value is not stored in the Database, it is merely displayed; if it was up to me we wouldn't do it as we get more confused questions and even more confusing answers to why it is there. In regard to tower numbers; there is no intention of ever displaying a site number with the HEX tower number.

This thread made me add to the RR FAQ pages on the Wiki. I suggest everyone look there for the correct information.
There are different places that show Hex and Decimal. The RR database shows talkgoups as Decimal, which is fine since that is what scanners will show. The RR database however also uses Decimal for tower ID's on the newer 9600 baud systems (like StarCom21 in IL or the MI MPSCS systems) when the scanners that the majority of users have use Hex. Some programming software allows either Hex of Decimal entries. Also, Trunker and other similar applications use Hex or allows one to choose Hex or Decimal.

Is there a way for the RR Database to show the tower ID's on Astro systems in Hex Mode vs Decimal? Since both the Pro96/2096 and BC396/996 radios ID towers in Hex this would relieve a lot of confusion. It should be an easy thing to do to allow alpha characters (According to what I hear this database field only allows numeric characters).
 

loumaag

Silent Key - Aug 2014
Joined
Oct 20, 2002
Messages
12,911
Location
Katy, TX
N9JIG said:
There are different places that show Hex and Decimal. The RR database shows talkgoups as Decimal, which is fine since that is what scanners will show. The RR database however also uses Decimal for tower ID's on the newer 9600 baud systems (like StarCom21 in IL or the MI MPSCS systems) when the scanners that the majority of users have use Hex. Some programming software allows either Hex of Decimal entries. Also, Trunker and other similar applications use Hex or allows one to choose Hex or Decimal.

Is there a way for the RR Database to show the tower ID's on Astro systems in Hex Mode vs Decimal? Since both the Pro96/2096 and BC396/996 radios ID towers in Hex this would relieve a lot of confusion. It should be an easy thing to do to allow alpha characters (According to what I hear this database field only allows numeric characters).
Let me address these in order of how you bring out the points:
  • The RR shows DECimal numbers for TG's, because that is what all (I will repeat all) scanners use. No argument from you on this point.
  • The site numbers are numeric, as you point out, in the RR Database and yes of course they are the decimals. We use the site numbers in a creative fashion and for those Project 25 systems you talk about, we actually mimic the way the scanners display the tower number. Those are not just HEX values you see on the scanner display it is actually a double word HEX value. I will admit that sometime down the road, the database is going to have to adapt something because we will not be able to put the tower number in the way we currently do because sometime we are going to run out of numbers. i.e. the display on the scanner is actually two numbers, typically it looks something like this "T010A", what that stands for is on Network 01, Tower 10. So we display it as 110. That is fine until we get something like this showing up -- "T0164" or Network 01, Tower 100; obviously that will not fit in the current scheme. However, not matter how we adapt to that scenario, I suspect that we will continue to use decimal numbers because it just makes more sense; everyone is familiar with them and will not change the sorting of the sites in some crazy way.
  • Yes, some scanner programming software allows you to use HEX to put TG ID's in the scanner. There are two things wrong with that IMHO, except for Project 25 systems, those HEX numbers used in the software are not the same as what we display in the DB and the ability to use them just confuses the issue even more because a new user will think we are supplying the HEX equivalent of the Uniden Decimal number(which we don't.)
  • As to your point about there being confusion when looking at what the radio displays and what we display in the database, you are the first person I have ever heard mention this, whereas the display of the HEX numbers for TG's prompts at least 5 questions a month from new users who don't understand the difference.
  • You bet that Trunker (and some other decoding software) allows the choice of using hexadecimal or decimal numbers in the display, but anyone using such software is way beyond the "newbie" stage of scanning and has no trouble with handling the conversions and/or understanding the difference.
n3ncn said:
"This is the value that all trunk tracking scanners use. No trunk tracking scanner uses anything else."

My BC-780 XLTand a few others allow you to choose DEC or HEX for use per system.. It is in the menu from the factory.
Really?

Suppose you tell me what menu item allows that on the 780XLT. While you are looking for that, would you mind pointing to the A, B, C, D, E, & F digits on the scanner keyboard; I must have missed them when looking at it.
 

JoeyC

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2002
Messages
3,395
Location
San Diego, CA
n3ncn said:
"This is the value that all trunk tracking scanners use. No trunk tracking scanner uses anything else."

My BC-780 XLTand a few others allow you to choose DEC or HEX for use per system.. It is in the menu from the factory.
Not a hint of DEC vs HEX on MY 780!:roll:
 

loumaag

Silent Key - Aug 2014
Joined
Oct 20, 2002
Messages
12,911
Location
Katy, TX
n3ncn said:
Change DEc to AFS In EDACS mode Use a HEX DEC calc and check it out
Oh Please! Like AFS has anything to do with hexadecimal numbers...
 

n3ncn

Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2002
Messages
308
Location
Trinity,North Carolina
Sorry I only have a high school education. YOU ARE ABSOLUTLY RIGHT. So please take my membership and block me from this site. I have better things to do than argue over the internet. Arguing over the internet is like being in special olympics, even if you win your still retatrded. Good by to everyone on RR. Great site.
 
Last edited:

morfis

Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2004
Messages
892
n3ncn said:
Arguing over the internet is like being in special olympics, even if you win your still retatrded.
Is this sort of comment really necessary?
 

n3ncn

Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2002
Messages
308
Location
Trinity,North Carolina
No, your absolutly right morfis. It it not necessary. Loumaag, I apollogize. I still don't have the time to argue. Correcting someone and teaching them is one thing,but a pissing match is another I don't have time for.. so I'm sorry for the comment and will move on to more suttle activaties.
73's N3NCN
 

loumaag

Silent Key - Aug 2014
Joined
Oct 20, 2002
Messages
12,911
Location
Katy, TX
n3ncn said:
Loumaag, I apollogize. I still don't have the time to argue. Correcting someone and teaching them is one thing,but a pissing match is another I don't have time for.. ...
Agreed, that is why I try not to get in them.

TO: N9JIG
I will leave this open for another day or so in case you reply, but as I said in the first thread I closed, this DEC vs HEX thing is just confusing to the new scanner user and I wish that the subject would go away.
 

N9JIG

Sheriff
Moderator
Joined
Dec 14, 2001
Messages
4,006
Location
Far NW Valley
I wasn't trying to start anything, just trying to point out that the RR database and the radios most users of that database use to monitor the systems have different ways of identifying towers.

This has come up before, and all I wanted to say was that it would be nice if RR's database could speak the same language as the Pro96/2096 and the BC396/996 when it comes to tower ID's.

These things would be a lot less confusing if the threads were allowed to run their course and newbies were able to read the thoughts of others who have tread this path before. I know I did a lot of reading to figure out the Hex-Dec-AFS stuff years ago.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top