How many TACN counties do I have to keep for Karns Fire?

[Gsquared]

So I think I'm finally understanding how to program my BDC436HP with Sentinel but, I've made some stressful mistakes with the TCAN builds and have a question. So I currently have Karns Fire as a favorite and Sentinel/RR has it listed as TACN P25. When I load that favorite in the scanner with the default frequencies and sites, I can see it scanning through all of the 50+ counties in Tennessee. I'm assuming I don't need county sites that are nowhere near Karns or for that matter, Knox county area.

So is there somewhere I can go on RR to see what surrounding counites I need to keep? I poked around the Karns database but didn't see any correlations that matched the Sentinel list. I've been in Knoxville since 1999 and know most of the counties surrounding the area but I don't want to remove any that I may not know and that may provide a better signal for scanning, if that's what the "sites" do.

I provided a frame grab of some of the counties from the default list and a condensed list from my saved favorite. I kept what I thought was around the area but keeping and removing others was a guestimate which may or may not be a good decision.

 

[buddrousa]

At best the only sites that will carry the traffic is the City or County the Department is in or if a Site in another County is very close to the Department as most Agencies are only going to work City or County wide.

 

[Gsquared]

Thank you. So basically any county within this area since Karns is using the system and Knox County Fire (Rural Metro) is still conventional.

 

[buddrousa]

I would not think that Karns Fire would operate in that complete circle.

 

[Gsquared]

Agreed, I was just thinking since they were using the system, that the listening range would go that far. I live and work just north of the 140 logo on the map so I'll just add the counties around my area and go from there. Ty.

 

[click23]

The way that I understand TACN each channel will only transmit on a site if there is a radio that is associated with that channel actively connected to the site.

I would for sure program in Knox and Anderson county sites, and most likely the Roane and Loudon counties sites if I was only wanting to monitor Karns FD.

 

[Gsquared]

So for receiving, is it in relation to the towers I am near? Meaning, I would "avoid" the names I'm not near?

 

[zachgallop]

Karns Fire Radios only affiliates with Knox Simulcast and Windrock on Karns FD talkgroups, so those are the two I would keep in the site list. Most Knox radios when on Knox talkgroups only affiliate with Knox Simulcast but there is a few exceptions to that setup. Seymour VFD is another.

 

[Gsquared]

Thanks for this. Is there something I should be looking for in the RR database that would allow me to see what towers a department's transmissions are are actually using or is it listening trial and error?

 

[zachgallop]

Thanks for this. Is there something I should be looking for in the RR database that would allow me to see what towers a department's transmissions are are actually using or is it listening trial and error?

No I have not seen in that in the database for TACN. Sometimes in other systems in the database I’ve noticed little notes about which sites they use but it doesn’t seem to be common. But like you said it’s usually just trial and error. I have tried to make my own list of who uses what sites county wise. In a scanner, I usually program each county in as it’s own system and then put the towers they typically affiliate with instead of scanning they whole TACN System. I do keep the whole TACN system as a favorites list though in case I miss some sites. I also try and set it up at similar way in my Unication in case I miss a few towers. I hope you figure it out!

 

[buddrousa]

Common Sense on what I said in my 1st post above.

 

[radiocrazy123]

This does not have to be a long discussion.
Karns FD = Site 3-10

 

[Gsquared]

Well I've been monitoring Karns FD Conv and P25 for 3 weeks on my BCD436HP and haven't heard a single call. I attached my Sentinel setups to look at but I'm pretty sure I'm not missing anything.

On a side note, For Rural Metro, I have to use my Baofeng UV-5r since the 436HP for some reason is too distorted for any of their conventional channels. This is while monitoring in West Knoxville (11 miles from Sharp's Ridge) both inside the house with a Diamond RH77CA and while driving with a mag mount vehicle antenna. I've read here that sometimes the digital handheld scanners sometimes don't do well with conventional channels and monitoring Rural Metro is proof of that. Maybe their Sharp's Ridge repeater just isn't as strong as other services around East Tennessee because I can easily hear other city departments much farther away like Lenoir City and Pigeon Forge.

 

[radiocrazy123]

Karns does NOT use conventional for primary. So I am confused as to what you are speaking of.
Karns uses Site 03-10 as I already previously posted. I hear them daily...on TG-10670 (Dispatch, response, tactical), the other talkgroups are rarely used and some are 100% encrypted.

Knox Fire VHF-01 analog is crappy for portables. Even my APX portable has a hard time hearing traffic in the Farragut area.

 

[Gsquared]

Hmm. I'll remove the conventional bank and just leave Karns P25 on for 24/7 with the Record function on and see what the radio picks up.

 

[Gsquared]

Karns uses Site 03-10 as I already previously posted. I hear them daily...on TG-10670 (Dispatch, response, tactical)

Not 30 minutes after replying to your post, I finally heard Dispatch on 10670 so I guess I just wasn't listening long enough. Thanks again.

 

[surfacemount]

Well I've been monitoring Karns FD Conv and P25 for 3 weeks on my BCD436HP and haven't heard a single call. I attached my Sentinel setups to look at but I'm pretty sure I'm not missing anything.

On a side note, For Rural Metro, I have to use my Baofeng UV-5r since the 436HP for some reason is too distorted for any of their conventional channels. This is while monitoring in West Knoxville (11 miles from Sharp's Ridge) both inside the house with a Diamond RH77CA and while driving with a mag mount vehicle antenna. I've read here that sometimes the digital handheld scanners sometimes don't do well with conventional channels and monitoring Rural Metro is proof of that. Maybe their Sharp's Ridge repeater just isn't as strong as other services around East Tennessee because I can easily hear other city departments much farther away like Lenoir City and Pigeon Forge.

If you're that close to Sharp's Ridge, you may be getting swamped, too. Have you tried using attenuation, or perhaps some notch filtering, if you're having receive issues? There are a *lot* of emitters up there.

 

[Gsquared]

If you're that close to Sharp's Ridge, you may be getting swamped, too. Have you tried using attenuation, or perhaps some notch filtering, if you're having receive issues? There are a *lot* of emitters up there.

Can you give me attenuation/notch filtering for dummies help or links? I don't know what those setting do and how to tweak them.

 

[Gsquared]

If you're that close to Sharp's Ridge, you may be getting swamped, too. Have you tried using attenuation, or perhaps some notch filtering, if you're having receive issues? There are a *lot* of emitters up there.

Found a Wiki on it. Ty.

 

[surfacemount]

You may have found a wiki on sharp's ridge, or on the other topic. lol In the case of the former, attenuation is the intentional making of your receiver to be increasingly signal deaf.

Usually, we want a receiver to be very sensitive, or 'hot', but when there are competing signals, the processor can sometimes struggle. Making the system less sensitive knocks down the stuff we don't want, to help pre-select the stuff we do.

For instance, paging towers used to be a pain in the diode. So, if I wanted to listen to a UHF signal, I might pad down -20dB so that the closer signal of interest was stronger than the more distant, but more powerful paging tower.

Notch filtering is a similar technique. Again with the paging towers, if I wanted to listen to a UHF signal, but a VHF paging tower was closer, and desensing my receiver, I could insert a VHF notch filter, reducing all VHF signals, but allowing the UHF and others to pass through unmolested.

Both are reversible, and can be as simple as removing your antenna entirely and pointing the box around slowly, reducing squelch until something breaks. Going outside, or taking the scanner for a ride, as well.

Just different techniques.