Illinois State Rep Dan Brady introduces anti-rebroadcast legislation

[INDY72]

Nice analogy indeed. :twisted:

 

[shelleys1]

Does this bill address recording or archives?

Years ago I did some lobbying here in Sacramento. I learned quite a bit and got a good understanding of how the bill process works. The grassroots group I was with made a LOT of changes. It wasn't easy though and required that everyone be on the same page.

The most effective means is to WRITE letters. Don't be vulgar or rude. Treat the person that you are writing to as your best friend. Remember you want them to vote in the direction you want.

If every RR member in Illinois wrote to the author of this bill against it, it would at least make him take notice. Politicians are all about numbers, and mostly looking at potential votes in their area. I can think of dozens of good reasons to state in opposition to this bill, and that's what needs to be written. The fact it is a hobby or because you want to listen/stream is not a good idea. Point out the tax dollars generated by sales of equipment (it takes more than scanners to stream), and that's $ lost to the state, if this passes.

Find out the bill number, and the committee it goes to next. Every RR member should write the people on that committee. Hopefully the bill is killed there. If not, we have to stick with it as it winds its way to becoming law. The group I did work for often had to innundate the governor with letters when a bill made it to his desk. We killed a lot of them that way, but let's hope it does not get that far.

Actually, of all things, it addresses REBROADCASTING. Odd, isn't it? I thought so and wrote to the state reps on the committee (and of course the rep sponsoring it. Haven't heard back, but then I'm only from an adjoining state - meaningless to them, no doubt).

But your suggestions are good and the same that I and others had, many posts ago. But they were buried in other posts...

Shelley
K0SHL

 

[INDY72]

As far as I can tell this bill soley addresses rebroadcast of recieved signals of the public safety broadcast. Nothing in it as for recording, that I can tell. But one must keep vigilant as in committee things get added, taken off, and twidted to fit the members wants/needs. It may go into committee saying that you cant rebroadcast without written permission. It may come out saying only certian tg's or chans.. Or it may reappear to ban any use of scanning without siad written permission. As I see it, if it passes as is, then one of our IL HAMS, or an official in PS can get a piece of paper signed and keep right on having an internet feed. Or we keep calling, writing and trying to get things stopped. Though that didnt work out hot for thousands of US citizens on health care reform. If you want to check on that, ask say... Blanche Lincoln (D) AR, office about the massive overload of e-mails, letters, and calls to get her to not be an pansy in that.. Hmm you all saw the result.

 

[gmclam]

Letter writing

I thought so and wrote to the state reps on the committee (and of course the rep sponsoring it. Haven't heard back, but then I'm only from an adjoining state - meaningless to them, no doubt).

I'd like to see the following posted here:
* email address of the bill's author
* (snail) mailing address of the bill's author
* name of the first committee hearing the bill, and a list of all members of that committee
* a sample letter

In my group, which was made up average folks, most people are not "letter writers" nor can come up with all the politically correct reasons a bill should be killed. When we provided a sample letter, and the place(s) to send it, people jumped in. When someone gets just a few letters, or only receives them from a few people, it does not hold as much weight as when 100s of people write on an issue.

 

[shelleys1]

As far as I can tell this bill soley addresses rebroadcast of recieved signals of the public safety broadcast. Nothing in it as for recording, that I can tell. But one must keep vigilant as in committee things get added, taken off, and twidted to fit the members wants/needs. It may go into committee saying that you cant rebroadcast without written permission. It may come out saying only certian tg's or chans.. Or it may reappear to ban any use of scanning without siad written permission. As I see it, if it passes as is, then one of our IL HAMS, or an official in PS can get a piece of paper signed and keep right on having an internet feed. Or we keep calling, writing and trying to get things stopped. Though that didnt work out hot for thousands of US citizens on health care reform. If you want to check on that, ask say... Blanche Lincoln (D) AR, office about the massive overload of e-mails, letters, and calls to get her to not be an pansy in that.. Hmm you all saw the result.

That's what I said - rebroadcast. And it will take sensible letters and emails, not people going off the wall, making threats, yelling, etc. But most important, it will take people writing from the State of Illinois - those are the constituents and the people the state representatives will listen to. So if the people here on RR want to do something about it, they need to get the people in IL working to stop the legislation by going through the proper channels in a businesslike manner. It works, we've seen it happen many times.

Shelley
K0SHL

 

[gmclam]

This bears repeating

This bears repeating. I can attest as to this is how you get things done in your favor.

And it will take sensible letters and emails, not people going off the wall, making threats, yelling, etc. But most important, it will take people writing from the State of Illinois - those are the constituents and the people the state representatives will listen to. So if the people here on RR want to do something about it, they need to get the people in IL working to stop the legislation by going through the proper channels in a businesslike manner. It works, we've seen it happen many times.

 

[jack103]

I'd like to see the following posted here:
* email address of the bill's author
* (snail) mailing address of the bill's author
* name of the first committee hearing the bill, and a list of all members of that committee
* a sample letter

In my group, which was made up average folks, most people are not "letter writers" nor can come up with all the politically correct reasons a bill should be killed. When we provided a sample letter, and the place(s) to send it, people jumped in. When someone gets just a few letters, or only receives them from a few people, it does not hold as much weight as when 100s of people write on an issue.

http://www.carmachicago.com/Representative Dan Brady.pdf

 

[shelleys1]

As it so often does, CARMA provides an excellent letter which can be used by the CARMA members and can also molded for other Illinois scanning enthusiasts to use for submission to Representative Brady and the other committee members (if they so wish).

Shelley
K0SHL

 

[lfd8e4]

Actually, of all things, it addresses REBROADCASTING. Odd, isn't it? I thought so and wrote to the state reps on the committee (and of course the rep sponsoring it. Haven't heard back, but then I'm only from an adjoining state - meaningless to them, no doubt).

But your suggestions are good and the same that I and others had, many posts ago. But they were buried in other posts...

Shelley
K0SHL

Having a little knowledge of how the political system works, if you are not from a Reps. district your e-mail is filtered out.

 

[shelleys1]

Having a little knowledge of how the political system works, if you are not from a Reps. district your e-mail is filtered out.

I figured that, but thought I would try anyway. *smile* It never hurts to try.

Shelley
K0SHL

 

[Samuel]

I am going to take a shot in the dark here but I would imagine the reason they may have targeted rebroadcasts is the new Smart Phone applications that allow you to recieve feeds of various public safety systems. They may view these as more of a concern as they require no skill on the part of the end user. Your average criminal may very well not have the knowledge or money to purchase and program a p25 scanner. That same criminal may already have an iPhone that they can receive a rebroadcast on.

Again not saying that its a well thought out or written bill but that is one possible explination. Also in the interests of full disclosure I do not live in IL nor have I ever been there... ;-)

 

[KIKINWING]

Here is a simple analogy for you.

We live in adjacent properties and it is raining.
Your yard and my yard are both getting wet as it rains.
In my yard I built a large container to collect rainwater.
If I install a pump and a hose to pump the water out of my container and into your yard, I am doing the SAME THING AS REBROADCASTING.
Having it rain on both our properties is occurring naturally. Pumping it into your yard is man-made.
Radios or scanners (our yards) listening to the airwaves (falling rain) is a matter of natural order. Channeling it (rebroadcasting) into your yard is not.

Maybe you should come out from under the bridge and see the light.

Your kidding right? Capturing the broadcast in any machine is natural?? If you heard it without assistance, that is natural. If then telling someone else, at a later time, is conveyance or rebroadcast in every ense of the word. Collecting any broadcast in a machine (scanner alone or scanner to a computer to a set of speakers 12k miles away) and playing it, be it through speakers within the broadcast zone or speakers outside the broadcast zone is not natural. Both actions within and outside are the same. This is so simple - I give up.

 

[KIKINWING]

Actually, of all things, it addresses REBROADCASTING. Odd, isn't it? I thought so and wrote to the state reps on the committee (and of course the rep sponsoring it. Haven't heard back, but then I'm only from an adjoining state - meaningless to them, no doubt).

But your suggestions are good and the same that I and others had, many posts ago. But they were buried in other posts...

Shelley
K0SHL

I was contacted by Rep. Brady's office director and was told to expect follow up beginning of week to discuss details, intent and merits of the bill.

Dara Brockmeyer to JOHN (KIKINWING)
show details 5:01 PM (2 minutes ago)

Dear John,

I wanted to let you know we received your email. I have relayed your concerns and I am getting some additional information on the legislation. I will be in touch early next week to clarify the intent of the bill and who it will impact.

Thank you,

Dara BrockmeyerDistrict Office DirectorState Representative Dan Brady, 88th District(309) 662-1100202 N. Prospect, Suite 203Bloomington, IL 61704


Keep sending e-mails to anyone you can think of..... They do so matter........

 

[KIKINWING]

What NONSENSE!!!!! The government is for the people, by the people and we must guard against any body who so knowingly attempts to shield any aspect of government business from the greater population. If we are not a nation of individuals but a nation of laws moved by the masses then the price of freedom becomes eternal vigilance which means we must unite, get off our butts and swamp this foolish rep. with calls. e-mails and threats of financing any opponent we see fit to run. If we pounce and make an effect, a noticeable effect then we have clout. Any other fool who seeks to diminish Liberty via the bandwaves would only have to told the story of poor Dan Brady. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. That said i am calling this man and voicing my displeasure and I invite you all to do the same;
dan@rep-danbrady.com <dan@rep-danbrady.com> or (309) 662-1100 mention HB5194 an act to limit radio rebroadcast....
I need not remind all of us, myself included, not to call this man a scum burping little weenie. It will only make you feel good in the short term and all of us look bad in the long term. If enough of us, thats you and me, call and write then we will get at a minimum clarification if not outright success. this is serious. While I am not fully briefed on parlimentary procedures of Illinois Legislature it seems it was reported out of committee favorably and already heading for a second reading. It still has time, but if what I see is accurate it would seem that this thing may be fast tracked. So be warned, with digital encryption (another illegal government power grab) becoming the norm. If you love this hobby. If you love Mom, apple pie and your country then DO SOMETHING!!!! Democracy is not a spectator sport!!!! as the Gipper once said "Liberty is a fragile thing. It is never more then one generation away from extinction. It is not ours by inheritance. It must be fought for and defended each day by each generation for it only comes once to a people. Ronald Reagan....... GET BUSY dan@rep-danbrady.com <dan@rep-danbrady.com> or (309) 662-1100 anyone who reads this and doesnt act will be summarily bound, gagged and fed feet first through a wood chipper or just called a lazy looza!!!!
YOU DONT NEED TO BE HIS CONSTITUENT TO CALL OR WRITE. ALL POL'S HAVE HIGHER ASPIRATIONS, HE WILL LISTEN. I LIVE IN MASS, UNDER A BRIDGE, BUT WILL BE DOING MY CIVIC DUTY TODAY IN ILLINOIS. WILL YOU???
This is what I just e-mailed;

Representative Brady,

I write with hope and fear about HB5194. As I read this bill it would seem it's effect would be to destroy or greatly diminish a hobby that is very dear to myself and millions of others across this great nation of ours.
I have been a scanner enthusiast for over 30 years. It is much more than a hobby as any enthusiast will tell you. I have personally become more involved in community policing and crime watch right in my own neighborhood by knowing exactly what our public safety personnel know. Just today our own incident notification system, manned, funded and reported by us the scanning community dispatched an AMBER alert approximately 30 minutes before the general public started to receive the information.
This is but one of the many thousands of times the scanning community has rallied to assist public safety and the general public as a whole.
My fear is is you begin to diminish our ability to enjoy our hobby while simultaneously assisting our respective community's. If this Bill passes as is you will be doing Illinois and potentially this great nation a grave dis service.
I would ask that you rethink or at least explore the alternatives. There are many. I would gladly make myself available at your convenience to discuss any and all aspects of your concern. 508-xxx-xxxx
Thanking you in advance

This was post 5 out of 114. It bears reposting.

 

[ERICMYERS]

I copied the carma letter (thanks Rich) and emailed Mr. Brady along with my own thoughts.

I'm in full agreement with the points Rich made.

Encourage all your friends to do the same.
73's
Eric

 

[KIKINWING]

Here is a simple analogy for you.

We live in adjacent properties and it is raining.
Your yard and my yard are both getting wet as it rains.
In my yard I built a large container to collect rainwater.
If I install a pump and a hose to pump the water out of my container and into your yard, I am doing the SAME THING AS REBROADCASTING.
Having it rain on both our properties is occurring naturally. Pumping it into your yard is man-made.
Radios or scanners (our yards) listening to the airwaves (falling rain) is a matter of natural order. Channeling it (rebroadcasting) into your yard is not.

Maybe you should come out from under the bridge and see the light.

This is comical. Yes rain is a natural force. Radio waves, as it applies, arent. Collecting those radio waves arent, putting them through a machine in your yard is not. Hearing a sound emit from a speaker in your yard is not. Hooking that machine up to another machine is not. Sending sound from those two machines 12k miles away is not. Listening from those two machines, 12k miles of wire, to a set of speakers is not. But do you want to know what all of the above is?? THE SAME EXACT THING.

There is absolutely, positively no difference as it applies to "authorized rebroadcast" Wether you understand it today or when it is beyond reproach is not up to me.

Truthfully this discussion could be for moot. I will wait to speak with Mr. Brady's director when she calls me this week and get clarification. At that point I will share what I have learned.

The only "natural order" you present Joey C is Darwins theory.

 

[ILMRadioMan]

Ignore is such a wonderful feature.

 

[N_Jay]

Give it up KIKINWING!

You idea that there is no difference between receiving a signal and rebroadcasting it is completely illogical and your defense of it is verging on stupid.

Yes, you can pick holes in any analogy use to try to get this through your (obviously thick) skull, because they are SIMPLIFIED ANALOGIES. Simplified in the mistaken belief that is made simple enough you just might understand.

Well, guess what. From your posts on this piece of the discussion, there is no way that anyone could ever make it simple enough for you to grasp.

Good night!

 

[KIKINWING]

Give it up KIKINWING!

You idea that there is no difference between receiving a signal and rebroadcasting it is completely illogical and your defense of it is verging on stupid.

Yes, you can pick holes in any analogy use to try to get this through your (obviously thick) skull, because they are SIMPLIFIED ANALOGIES. Simplified in the mistaken belief that is made simple enough you just might understand.

Well, guess what. From your posts on this piece of the discussion, there is no way that anyone could ever make it simple enough for you to grasp.

Good night!

I wont take your bait. I have read many of your posts and it is clear you are attempting to post volume over substance. I have asked you repeatedly a simple question that clearly confounds you and you cant answer but too attack and call others opinions STUPID. That is the height of ignorance if ever there was one. You sir a low class ignoramous who has not added anything constructive to this discussion. Oh these boards are to lay down in the hopes that someone the likes of you might not attack? Give it up. My positions are sound. My reasoning is clear. There is no difference in either and you will eventually realize.

Please read the prior posts and tell me exactly what is the difference as it pertains? Stop your name calling. Grow up and act like an adult, if you can. This is a simple discussion that you turned into a low bred trailer trash Jerry Springer free for all. hey, if the shoe fits. If you cant see the reasoning and logic I cant help you. But I can forgive you for being a sophmorish poster. Please, without the rain buckets, etc...etc... tell me how it is different. Because piping it through a scanner to your ear is the same as piping it through a computer to your ear. There the same. as are the phone apps, etc...etc... So please stick to facebook or you tube or what ever children of your ilk do these days and please leave the big thoughts to the adults.

I never thought Humpdy Dumpty was pushed. And even if my conclusions are wrong I am clearly entitled to them and this is the place for them. Your verbal assaults seem almost designed with a different purpose. Like you are a disinformation agent trying to put fire on a movement that has yet to get out of the gate. Your effect on this discourse has no substance other then to disrupt, belittle and impugn. If you have nothing nice to say then dont say it. Go back to phone sex or where ever you come.

 

[datainmotion]

In the interest of ending the bickering, let's try this one:

"This comes back to the analogy of standing on your lawn naked and then demanding the neighbors be arrested for invading your privacy."

Naked person on their own lawn = StarCom21 un-encrypted transmissions
Neighbors = scanner listeners
Neighbors taking pictures and e-mailing them out = rebroadcast

While its clearly the naked guy's own fault for expecting privacy on his lawn, anyone seeing the naked guy (however scarred they may be :lol and then taking snapshots to show others that weren't there, are actively sharing the information they saw (or in the case of a scanner - heard). The recipients of the photos were not first-person to the lawn event.

I don't agree with banning rebroadcasting either, but good God man, most of the people here agree with you in principle, yet you seem to be more interested in arguing for arguements sake. Take a breath and relax. Just because everyone's rationale isn't the same as yours doesn't make them wrong.