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intra and inter wacn roaming question

billy2047

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Hi all, I'm trying to understand the difference between all five coverage types in Motorola CPS.

They are Disabled, SmartZone, SmartZone Omni-link, Inter-WACN and Intra-WACN. I get all the Motorola legacy stuff(SN, SZ and SZOL) but I'm unsure about Inter-WACN and Intra-WACN roamings.

As far as I understand it and please correct if wrong, Intra-WACN allows subscriber unit to roam to any system that has the same WACN but different SysID. What about Inter-WACN? do SysIDs have to be the same for Inter-WACN to work?

Is there a way to program APX series for both Inter and Intra roaming? CPS only allows either or, not both

Thanks
 

GTR8000

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In practice, Inter-WACN Roaming is primarily used for roaming between ISSI connected systems, whereas Intra-WACN Roaming primarily comes into play with Harris systems.

When using Inter-WACN Roaming, the SysID's do not have to all be the same. In fact it's often the case with ISSI connected ASTRO 25 systems that the WACN is the same (BEE00) while the SysID is unique to each system.

Note that when you set the coverage to Intra-WACN Roaming, you must have an Advanced WACN Key, otherwise you will not be able to make any changes to the system, even if you have a regular system key (software or ASK) that matches the SysID.
 

billy2047

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the WACN is the same (BEE00) while the SysID is unique to each system.
see that's where i got hung up on. isnt that what Intra-WACN roaming is for? how would that make a difference versus inter-wacn roaming? Thank you
 

GTR8000

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In theory, yes...Intra-WACN should be for systems that share the same WACN with a different SysID. You would think that would include the 98% of ASTRO 25 systems that all use BEE00. But nope, you need to use Inter-WACN for interconnected ASTRO 25 systems, even when the WACN is the same.

Harris tends to use the same WACN with unique SysID's for interconnected systems, and so in those cases, the use of Intra-WACN is as expected..."systems within the same WACN".
 

ElroyJetson

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DO NOT ASK ME FOR HELP PROGRAMMING YOUR RADIO. NO.
If you are programming this for a Non-Affiliating Scan radio, and not an authorized user's radio, then you should set the coverage type to disabled as you won't be able to, or even want to attempt, to summon the talkgroups you want to listen to, to your local site.

For scanning, use "disabled". None of the others should have any effect anyway on an NAS radio if it's programmed correctly and not affiliating at any time.
 

GTR8000

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If you are programming this for a Non-Affiliating Scan radio, and not an authorized user's radio, then you should set the coverage type to disabled as you won't be able to, or even want to attempt, to summon the talkgroups you want to listen to, to your local site.

For scanning, use "disabled". None of the others should have any effect anyway on an NAS radio if it's programmed correctly and not affiliating at any time.
If done correctly, the so called "non-affiliate" (really non-registration for P25) scan will never try to "summon" a talkgroup to a site. The radio is sitting on a conventional channel, not a trunked talkgroup, so there is nothing to "summon" anyway. The trunked system doesn't care about what's in the radio's scan list. If the talkgroup is active at the site (assuming a hypothetical multi-site system), then the radio will decode the talkgroup, otherwise it won't...stating the obvious.

It really doesn't matter if you use Disabled (SmartNet), or SmartZone, or SmartZone and OmniLink, or even Inter-WACN Roaming for that matter, when setting up passive scanning (a better term for this method) on P25. Again, if done correctly, the radio is going to find the local control channel and start scanning whatever is in the Multi-System Talkgroup or Intelligent Priority scan list mapped to the conventional personality of the conventional channel the radio is parked on.

Frankly, if you are passively scanning a multi-site system, you may want to have the radio set to SmartZone so that it will poll the adjacent sites for a better signal on the control channel, especially if you're traveling.
 

ElroyJetson

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Good points. I've always been ever so slightly mistrustful of this passive scanning method, even though I may well have been the first person to publicize the method, whether I was the first to discover it or not. Intellectually I know that the radio is only scanning trunked data from a conventional mode slaved scan list, but I FEEL a bit unsure that it's as completely safe as it probably actually IS. It's my cautious nature.
 

billy2047

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Will the roaming radio (legit and authorized) just bonk out of range if it was programmed for Intra-WACN roaming on interconnected ASTRO 25 systems? Thank you.
But nope, you need to use Inter-WACN for interconnected ASTRO 25 systems, even when the WACN is the same.
 

GTR8000

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Will the roaming radio (legit and authorized) just bonk out of range if it was programmed for Intra-WACN roaming on interconnected ASTRO 25 systems? Thank you.
Since most ASTRO 25 systems use the same WACN of BEE00, it should work in theory. That being said, as previously noted Intra-WACN requires an Advanced WACN Key, which is not really an MSI thing. So the chances of having one for two ASTRO 25 systems for programming an APX subscriber are pretty slim.
 

GTR8000

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So, what is the difference between SmartZone and SmartZone Omni-link?
I explained it all a few months ago. OmniLink facilitates roaming between multiple RFSS (zones) of the same P25 system.

 

IAmSixNine

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While the APX are nice, if your unsure there are other options. Unication G4 take a lot of the guess work out. And the Bk KNG2-P800 are nice. I picked up one new from the factory about 7 years ago. I still love it.
 

GTR8000

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While the APX are nice, if your unsure there are other options. Unication G4 take a lot of the guess work out. And the Bk KNG2-P800 are nice. I picked up one new from the factory about 7 years ago. I still love it.
OP is an authorized subscriber on the system, a Unication RX only pager is not going to help him out.
 

billy2047

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It appears that with inter-wacn roaming, SUs will tell the foreign system its home sysid and RID (ABC:1234567 as an example) during the registration process. If access is granted, the foreign system will dynamically assign a temporary ISSI TG and RID to the roaming SUs.

With intra-wacn roaming, SUs will just register as it normally would within its home system (Registration; RID=1234567 as an example) without announcing its home sysid to the foreign system.

That's all I can tell the difference between the two options, ofc, please correct me if im missing something.
 
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