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Is APCO-25 Allowed on GMRS?

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auxscan

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I was just wondering since some ham repeaters in my area are moving to APCO-25 digital systems, is APCO-25 systems allowed on GMRS repeaters?

Any rules against it?
 

SkipSanders

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No. GMRS authorized emissions do not include digital modulation.

§ 95.631 Emission types.
(a) A GMRS transmitter must transmit only emission types A1D, F1D, G1D, H1D, J1D, R1D, A3E, F3E, G3E, H3E, J3E or R3E. A non-voice emission is limited to selective calling or toneoperated squelch tones to establish or continue voice communications. See § 95.181 (g) and (h).

APCO-25 is F1E, not included in the authorized emission types.
 

James_Bond_007

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I wonder why prsg has not pushed the fcc to allow digital. sure would be nice to be allowed P25. it could be authorized in narrow band only to keep down adjacent interference.

and it would definitely annoy the bubble packers back onto their 14 frs channels :)
 

SkipSanders

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I think he means they were never involved, any more than YOU are.

Anyone can submit a proposed rule change. The FCC will consider it, if they care.

The FCC basically is totally ignoring GMRS, other than (after YEARS), noticing that the manufacturers were including inversion scrambling in GMRS radios, and slapping them with fines and a 'don't do that' order.

The rules are completely messed up, including references in one rule to another rule that no longer exists at all, etc. They need a total rewrite.

The fear some have of bringing GMRS to the FCC's 'attention' is that, considering the current bubblepack mess, the result might just be that they 'delicense' the GMRS, combine it with FRS, cut max power to 5 watts, and remove repeaters, and forget about it forevermore.
 

elk2370bruce

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Once the K-Mart and Wal-Mart blister pack radios came on the scene that included both GMRS and FRS capabilities, this resource began to revert to the CB troubles that began many moons ago and finally destroyed the resource to the point that even the truckers often stay off it. The FCC has no way of telling who has what kind of GMRS or FRS radios and who is licensed or not (mostly not). Its impossible to enforce what has become an almost entirely un-regulated radio service. If anything occurs at the hallowed halls of FCC in Pennsylvania, it will be to combine FRS and GRMS, lower the permitted power, eliminate repeaters, and let the inmates run the prison into the ground. The FCC will then lead their wagons back up the hill and just start shaking their heads in dismay and disgust. Kinda like isolation and quarantine during a disease epidemic.
 
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rescuecomm

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We used to have a system licensed GMRS repeater that was used for public service work, but was available for personal communications. Once the cheap cell phones came in, just about everyone disappeared from the radios. Too bad the FCC botched the 220-222 band thing with the marketing and nationwide buildout. Some of it would be a good start for a narrowband digital personal communications service using something like NXDN or Mototrbo. Let the consumer radios have the former Class A CB band, but give us some more spectrum somewhere (but not lowband VHF).

Bob
 

b7spectra

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Is P25 allowed on GMRS? No. Can it happen? Sure. Will people complain about it? Only the ones who can't participate or hear it.
 

auxscan

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Rant!!!

Its not even that, some repeaters Have a DPL input & PL output but jammers still find a way. Most of the Idoits dont know that I can decode MDC, MODAT, DTMF & GE signaling. So a letter to the owner with the RADIO ID is usaully done and a complaint to the FCC is done after a peroid of time. But the FCC usaully doesn't bother. The problem is that most of the Jammers are hams/gmrs operators that have beef with the members on the repeaters or they feel left out. Also members are told to keep the Tone info to them self and to discuss it to friends or on the repeater itself. Everyone who wants to join must contact the owner himself. but still they follow the rules and everytime we change the DPL input its good for about 3 weeks before the jamming starts again.

WE NEED P-25 ON GMRS!
 

gewecke

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Its not even that, some repeaters Have a DPL input & PL output but jammers still find a way. Most of the Idoits dont know that I can decode MDC, MODAT, DTMF & GE signaling. So a letter to the owner with the RADIO ID is usaully done and a complaint to the FCC is done after a peroid of time. But the FCC usaully doesn't bother. The problem is that most of the Jammers are hams/gmrs operators that have beef with the members on the repeaters or they feel left out. Also members are told to keep the Tone info to them self and to discuss it to friends or on the repeater itself. Everyone who wants to join must contact the owner himself. but still they follow the rules and everytime we change the DPL input its good for about 3 weeks before the jamming starts again.

WE NEED P-25 ON GMRS!
Non-standard pl's are a good deterrent,as well making the jammer's information public! Do the homework or RDF needed to ID the jammer,then after this is done EXPOSE his address,phone #,vehicle id,and name on the air to all legit users on the system!
He's not going to want his life history blabbed on the air to all the ops he's been jamming!!
n9zas
 

auxscan

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Non-standard pl's are a good deterrent,as well making the jammer's information public! Do the homework or RDF needed to ID the jammer,then after this is done EXPOSE his address,phone #,vehicle id,and name on the air to all legit users on the system!
He's not going to want his life history blabbed on the air to all the ops he's been jamming!!
n9zas
I see what your saying but the disapointing part of it all is that its HAM/GMRS operators that are jamming the repeater. usaully smart ones who disable there radio ID's and know the Radio waves inside out. The last that were caught and were issued a warning either a where both ham operators. one also had a gmrs license.

Non-standard PL has been put out before but still jammers find a way, the best thing that work are DPL inputs & PL outputs. confuses the Jammer thinking the Input is a PL.
 

Citywide173

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Non-standard PL has been put out before but still jammers find a way, the best thing that work are DPL inputs & PL outputs. confuses the Jammer thinking the Input is a PL.
You say it's been put out, but has it actually been programmed into the repeater and tried? DPL just takes about 10 minutes longer to determine than PL, so even with a DPL input and PL output, it's not really a deterrent. There is no absolute way of keeping them off, just more difficult ones.
 

gewecke

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Right,but this why exposing the jammer in the open to all takes away his thrill of being anonymous.
It's the only thing they have.
n9zas
 

auxscan

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well the FCC is no help, so I guess we're going fox hunting. go a team of 6 who are gonna do the hunting gonna start on thursday. will update once we get some clues.
 
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