Is this normal? -Yaesu FT-60

[KC9VZV]

I've had my amateur license for almost 2 months now. When I first passed my technician test, I posted a thread on here for advice on what radio to get and ended up getting the Yaesu FT-60R. It seems like a great HT (very good features, easy to use and program, etc.) but I haven't had much luck with it communicating with other hams.

The only time I know that my signal was received is during the local ARES net when I check in and net control acknowledges. Other than that, I get the feeling that something is wrong with the radio because, more often than not, I don't get a reply when I call out on a repeater or simplex frequency. This evening I tried to connect with the repeater on top of the Aon Center in Chicago (I was in Chicago for the evening) and I couldn't get anyone to reply even though I was only 2 blocks from the building. Since I am not very experienced with ham radio, I don't know if this type of thing is normal or not. If it's not I may have to send my radio back to see if I happened to get a faulty radio.

I have a Yaesu FT-60R that I'm using with a Diamond SRH77CA antenna.

Thanks for your help!

 

[W8RMH]

Were you able to access the repeater? Did you hear a squelch tail after transmitting.

Some repeaters require a PL code.

It could be that no one was on the air at the time you tried.

Listen for an ongoing conversation, give your call in-between conversations and see if you get a reply. Then I would ask for a report on how your signal is being received.

I have a FT-60R and have never had any problems and get good reports.

You also might try to join a club in your area or become active with ARES.

If you are getting through to the net I doubt if there is anything wrong with your radio.

 

[KC9VZV]

Were you able to access the repeater? Did you hear a squelch tail after transmitting.

Some repeaters require a PL code.

It could be that no one was on the air at the time you tried.

Listen for an ongoing conversation, give your call in-between conversations and see if you get a reply. Then I would ask for a report on how your signal is being received.

I have a FT-60R and have never had any problems and get good reports.

You also might try to join a club in your area or become active with ARES.

If you are getting through to the net I doubt if there is anything wrong with your radio.

Thanks for the reply. I do hear the squelch talk after I transmit most of the time. However, one time I did listen to my transmission with my scanner and I could hear the key-up and the squelch tail but no voice. Is that possible?
I have already put the PL tones into my radio before I transmit on the repeater, so that shouldn't be a problem.

It is possible that no one was monitoring when I tried, but that is a little hard for me to believe because I feel like I keep trying with no luck most of the time.

The weird part about it is that most of the time I do get good signal reports from people when I check into the net or I am able to communicate with someone on the repeater. I kind of think I may just be paranoid.

 

[W8RMH]

As far as listening to your transmission with a scanner, the transmitter will overload the scanner's receiver, being that close, and prevent you from receiving the signal from the repeater.

In a nutshell repeaters are just not that active anymore what with smart phones, computers, and some of the advanced amateur modes in use today. There have been times when I call on a repeater with no response and I feel like I am the last person on earth.

 

[zz0468]

What you're experiencing is not that uncommon. Repeaters have 'personalities', meaning the people who inhabit them, not the machine itself. Not all repeaters are overtly friendly to newcomers.

Just announcing your call on an otherwise quiet repeater is unlikely to elicit a response. Repeater groups tend to be cliquish, which is fun when you're in, and not so fun when you're not. It's that damned human nature thing rearing it's ugly head.

If you're getting responses on a net, it's unlikely that your radio has a problem.


You have a few choices...

1. Keep looking for a repeater that's friendly to strangers.

2. Join a local club and get to know people that way, and then they'll talk to you on the air.

3. Find some other aspect of ham radio, like HF, or VHF/UHF weak signal modes that are much more conducive to talking to strangers.

 

[canav844]

It could very well be that the FT-60, while a great HT is still nonetheless and HT, and when fully charged it's just eeking out 5w ERP and often less than that. If you're a QRP'er much can be done with 5w, if you're willing to work with antennas, if you just want to talk it may be worth your while to look into an amp, or a mobile rig to use in your car or in your house, of course that will require an antenna outside, and that may be the best place to start helping you maximize those 5 watts you have until you have more power. HTs are very, well handy; but I often don't recommend them as a a first radio because if you're looking to make contacts the low power can be a hurdle for people new to the hobby.

When you checked into the net did you get a signal report? Try that repeater and see if you hear the tail after you key up, or if you hear it ID. Even better throw out you're name and say you're new, there might be someone around to lend you a hand in trying out some other repeaters that they're familiar with.

 

[KC9VZV]

Ok... Thanks for all your help! It's a lot to take in, but all very good info.

I hadn't thought about that - listening to my scanner while transmitting could overload my scanner's receiver - It makes sense though.

Is it possible for my signal to get through just enough to have the repeater ID but my voice to not be heard? I feel like thats happening sometimes, but maybe it's just that I'm new - from what you've said, it sounds like that is more likely.

When I check into the net on Wednesday, they almost always say my signal is good, so that's another thing that makes me skeptical.

I may have to get another antenna that is better yet than the one I have. I am holding off on getting a mobile radio since I don't have my own car yet. Being only 16 y/o, I am still driving my parents cars and I know they won't let me install a rig in one of their cars!

canav844 - I will look into getting a outdoor antenna and also an amp. Thanks for the info. If you have any specific suggestions, I'd be glad to hear them.

Once again, thanks for the help!

 

[AK9R]

Some thoughts:

1. It seems that hams traditionally stretch the truth when it comes to signal reports. During a contest, everyone is 5-9-9 (on CW) or 5-9 (on SSB) whether they really are or not. I hear the same thing on some local repeaters. A guy will be scratchy into the repeater or have bad audio and some other guy sitting at home in a quiet environment will tell the first guy that his signal is perfect. Meanwhile, I'm on the road and can barely make out what the first guy is saying even though I'm receiving the repeater full scale.

2. During a net, Net Control is really just listening for callsigns. You may be getting into the repeater well enough for the NC to make out your callsign, but maybe not well enough to really carry on a conversation. I'll admit, if I hear someone ID on the repeater and I have a hard time hearing them, I may not respond to their call unless it sounds like they really need something.

3. As others have said, you may have run into a clique-ish repeater. The other guys on the repeater don't know you and may not be very welcoming towards people they don't know. If you hear some guys on the repeater talking about a subject that interests you and you have a pertinent comment to add to the conversation, interject your callsign when one of the other stations unkeys. Hopefully, they will come back to you and let you make your comment. If they tell you then that they can't make out what you're saying, then you'll know you aren't into the repeater as well as you thought.

4. Finally, working a repeater that's on a tall tower or tall building can be troublesome if you are close to the base of the tower or building. Most repeater antennas have a fair amount of gain which means their pattern is looking out at the horizon. A quarter-wave vertical antenna has a coverage pattern that looks like donut with the antenna at the center. A high-gain vertical antenna has a coverage pattern that looks like squished donut. If you are two blocks away at street level, you are under the donut and it may take more signal than you think to be heard.

The Yaesu FT-60 is a good radio. I used to have one. But, most stock handheld antennas are a real compromise. I'm a fan of the Diamond RH-77 (BNC mount) or SRH-77 (SMA mount). I think it works pretty well on most handhelds.

 

[KC9VZV]

Some thoughts:

1. It seems that hams traditionally stretch the truth when it comes to signal reports. During a contest, everyone is 5-9-9 (on CW) or 5-9 (on SSB) whether they really are or not. I hear the same thing on some local repeaters. A guy will be scratchy into the repeater or have bad audio and some other guy sitting at home in a quiet environment will tell the first guy that his signal is perfect. Meanwhile, I'm on the road and can barely make out what the first guy is saying even though I'm receiving the repeater full scale.

2. During a net, Net Control is really just listening for callsigns. You may be getting into the repeater well enough for the NC to make out your callsign, but maybe not well enough to really carry on a conversation. I'll admit, if I hear someone ID on the repeater and I have a hard time hearing them, I may not respond to their call unless it sounds like they really need something.

3. As others have said, you may have run into a clique-ish repeater. The other guys on the repeater don't know you and may not be very welcoming towards people they don't know. If you hear some guys on the repeater talking about a subject that interests you and you have a pertinent comment to add to the conversation, interject your callsign when one of the other stations unkeys. Hopefully, they will come back to you and let you make your comment. If they tell you then that they can't make out what you're saying, then you'll know you aren't into the repeater as well as you thought.

4. Finally, working a repeater that's on a tall tower or tall building can be troublesome if you are close to the base of the tower or building. Most repeater antennas have a fair amount of gain which means their pattern is looking out at the horizon. A quarter-wave vertical antenna has a coverage pattern that looks like donut with the antenna at the center. A high-gain vertical antenna has a coverage pattern that looks like squished donut. If you are two blocks away at street level, you are under the donut and it may take more signal than you think to be heard.

The Yaesu FT-60 is a good radio. I used to have one. But, most stock handheld antennas are a real compromise. I'm a fan of the Diamond RH-77 (BNC mount) or SRH-77 (SMA mount). I think it works pretty well on most handhelds.

Okay, thanks for all the tips. I would guess that the repeaters I am trying that aren't around my home may be "clique-ish", as you called it. I actually do have the Diamond SRH77CA antenna for it, which does seem to greatly improve my ability to communicate, but I still am having some issues, as I explained in my first post.
Do you (or anyone on here) have any suggestion of a good mobile (preferably mag-mount) antenna that would work well with the FT-60? That would be 70-cm and 440 bands.

Thanks everyone!

 

[16b]

I echo the suggestion to listen for activity on a repeater and try to join the conversation, if only briefly. There's nothing wrong with interrupting an informal conversation for a quick signal report; just key up and say your callsign between transmissions, and when someone acknowledges you just politely explain you're interested in a signal report. Some hams may invite you to stay and chat, others may not, but almost nobody will refuse to give a simple signal report. This will help you clear up the question of whether or not you're making the repeater. And if you don't get acknowledged on the first try, keep trying; someone may have keyed over top of you accidentally.

The main reason you should try to find an active repeater first is that many repeaters sit quiet 99% of the time even though they work fine. Finding one that somebody is already talking on will rule out the question of whether or not anybody is really out there.

As others have mentioned, finding a radio club is also an option. Finding a good one might take a bit of effort; don't be afraid to attend a meeting and not go back if you don't like it. Some radio clubs are very active and have friendly members; others not so much. One great option is to find a college/university amateur radio club. I'm not familiar with the Chicago area too well, but these clubs (obviously) tend to have younger members, and aren't likely to be as clique-ish since the membership changes a lot. Most of them don't require that you actually be affiliated with their institution to be a club member.

 

[KC9VZV]

I echo the suggestion to listen for activity on a repeater and try to join the conversation, if only briefly. There's nothing wrong with interrupting an informal conversation for a quick signal report; just key up and say your callsign between transmissions, and when someone acknowledges you just politely explain you're interested in a signal report. Some hams may invite you to stay and chat, others may not, but almost nobody will refuse to give a simple signal report. This will help you clear up the question of whether or not you're making the repeater. And if you don't get acknowledged on the first try, keep trying; someone may have keyed over top of you accidentally.

The main reason you should try to find an active repeater first is that many repeaters sit quiet 99% of the time even though they work fine. Finding one that somebody is already talking on will rule out the question of whether or not anybody is really out there.

As others have mentioned, finding a radio club is also an option. Finding a good one might take a bit of effort; don't be afraid to attend a meeting and not go back if you don't like it. Some radio clubs are very active and have friendly members; others not so much. One great option is to find a college/university amateur radio club. I'm not familiar with the Chicago area too well, but these clubs (obviously) tend to have younger members, and aren't likely to be as clique-ish since the membership changes a lot. Most of them don't require that you actually be affiliated with their institution to be a club member.

That makes a lot of sense. I guess I kind of assumed that most repeaters are monitored by people most of the time. It does make sense that they wouldn't be though.

I went to an area club's meeting a year or so ago before I got my license, but I haven't gone since I have been licensed. I will make a point to go to one in the near future. The idea of a college/university club sounds good, but I don't know if there are any in my area. I haven't heard of any yet, but I will google and see what I find. Thanks very much!

 

[gewecke]

I went to my first club meeting in many years with my membership fee just to be on the list of members, but that's probably the last meeting I'll go to!

73,
n9zas

 

[ermin]

Okay, thanks for all the tips. I would guess that the repeaters I am trying that aren't around my home may be "clique-ish", as you called it. I actually do have the Diamond SRH77CA antenna for it, which does seem to greatly improve my ability to communicate, but I still am having some issues, as I explained in my first post.
Do you (or anyone on here) have any suggestion of a good mobile (preferably mag-mount) antenna that would work well with the FT-60? That would be 70-cm and 440 bands.

Thanks everyone!

Hello Dan

I use the Larsen 2/70B (2/70C just as good) on a mag mount here in Southeast Florida and also up into Georgia and the Carolinas on a mag mount. Great antenna. You won't go wrong if you get one.

73

Ermin.

 

[KC9VZV]

Hello Dan

I use the Larsen 2/70B (2/70C just as good) on a mag mount here in Southeast Florida and also up into Georgia and the Carolinas on a mag mount. Great antenna. You won't go wrong if you get one.

73

Ermin.

Hi Ermin-

I looked it up and it looks like a good antenna! Just to confirm, this is the antenna, right?

Have you ever used it as a base antenna? If I were to get it, I would probably use it some by just putting it outside my bedroom window. Do you think this would affect the performance at all?

Thanks for the suggestion!

Dan

 

[AK9R]

You can use a mobile antenna as a base antenna, but most mobile antennas require a ground plane. When used mobile, the vehicle's sheet metal provides the ground plane. If you just stick a mobile antenna outside your bedroom window, there won't be any ground plane.

That said, I often use a mobile antenna on a mag mount stuck on top of something inside the house that provides the ground plane. A steel filing cabinet or a refrigerator work quite well. I keep the power down to 5 watts (which won't be a problem for you if you are using your FT-60) to reduce the RF exposure problem. I don't use this solution very much, but it does work.

If you can attach something to the side of the house, take a look on the web for J-pole antenna construction plans. You should be able to find plans for building a J-pole out of copper water pipe and fittings. Most of the parts will be available at a hardware store or big-box home improvement center. Other J-pole plans use twin-lead antenna feedline. The twin-lead can be enclosed inside PVC pipe for a sturdier construction. J-poles are a half-wave antenna end fed through a quarter-wave matching section. They work quite well. Keep the bottom of the J-pole away from metal objects, though, because they will interact with the matching section.

 

[Rt169Radio]

You could also get a Larsen 2/440 mobile antenna and use it with a Larsen base conversion kit.

 

[KC9VZV]

Ok. I have a steel bucket that I have used to put mag-mount antennas on when I had them sitting on my window sill, so that should work for the ground plane. Please excuse my ignorance about electronics for a minute, but just to make sure, is there anything else I have to do to ground the antenna or do I just magnet it on to a metal object and that automatically "establishes" a ground?

In terms of making a J-pole, I think that is a little out of my abilities because I am not good with working with electrical hardware. Once I get a little more know-how, I will probably try that but for now I just don't have enough confidence in me. LOL. But thanks for the suggestion.

Rt169Radio- I looked at that on UniversalRadio and it does look nice. Thanks for the suggestion. I may get that for using it at home.

 

[AK9R]

Yep, the base conversion kits will do the job. Your steel bucket will work in a pinch, too.

 

[KC9VZV]

Yep, the base conversion kits will do the job. Your steel bucket will work in a pinch, too.

Great, thanks! I may get the Larsen NMO 2/70, but first I am going to try to find one that seems comparable at a little lower price. Thanks for everyone's help again!

 

[KC9VZV]

Anyone have thoughts on this antenna? It is sold by Amazon with no recognizable brand name, so I am a little skeptical but it has good reviews and is it is much less expensive than the Larsen 2/70. http://www.amazon.com/MAGNETIC-Mobi...218&sr=8-1&keywords=ham+2+meter+70+cm+antenna Thanks!