JIWN Intermittency with WSP

[doovenator]

I've got a perplexing problem that has been bugging me for some time with the IWN in District 6 (Central Washington) http://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=3509, specifically channel 59612 for dispatch. Now normally the area is only Analog/Conventional for all public safety, but every now and then I'll pick up this system on digital, which is exciting because its all there is digital and I like hearing it over analog. The problem is it doesn't last. When it works I'll usually hear it the whole day, or as long as I'm scanning, like I did yesterday (4/22). Today? Nothing, not a peep. And its like this all the time, I'd say I probably only hear traffic on it once or twice a month. I highly doubt they just decide one day to broadcast digital and others they don't. So I feel like I'm missing something. I locked my HP-2 on the conventional analog and my SDS200 on the IWN and they would both key up at the same time with the same traffic (broadcasting digital and analog simultaneously).

I'm right smack dab in the middle of two sites, usually when I hear traffic its on site 49 (Beezley), yesterday it was site 46 (Burch). I don't think its a signal issue since I had my base scanner hooked up to an external antenna and my mobile to an expandable antenna indoors, both picked it up fine. So what am I missing? I've heard some trunk systems switch control channels randomly or on a rotation, could that be it? Are there just frequencies for the site that could be missing? Do scanners check all the frequencies to see if one is actually a control channel but not labelled as one? I'm a complete noob when it comes to discovering, so not sure how I would go about finding "missing frequencies" if that's even the case. Does anybody else in central washington pick up this system consistently? Thanks for any insights or advice.

 

[BigMikey2011]

I am up here in Okanogan County and I pick it up coming off of Goat Mtn. (Site 47)

 

[devicelab]

Well I doubt those frequencies are accurate. You need to run pro96com on the IWN site and make sure you have the correct alternates. Also I presume you're not mixing control channels? Some of the IWN sites share the same frequencies around the region so you should only be monitoring the closest site and/or a few local sites maximum.

 

[doovenator]

Thanks for the suggestion devicelab, once I get home I'll test it out. The pro96com doesn't mention the HP-2 or SDS200, do you happen to know off-hand if either will work or will I need to pick up one of the supported scanners somewhere? I don't know about mixing control channels, I just have it loaded off of whatever RR database says the control channels are. If I find new info I'll definitely submit it into the database, might take awhile, still trying to figure this stuff out.

 

[devicelab]

The pro96com doesn't mention the HP-2 or SDS200, do you happen to know off-hand if either will work or will I need to pick up one of the supported scanners somewhere?

Nah they won't work. I think your HP2 has some feature that can decode the control channel but I've never used one personally.

If you're just going by the massive RR database you're likely picking up a zillion sites and some use the same frequencies. For starters just try to get one site up and scanning. Then you can add more sites from there.

I guess if you already have the RR database in your scanner then just go and disable all the sites except the sites closet to your location -- that'll probably help a little.

 

[doovenator]

Yeah I think the HP2 has some discovery capabilities with the Extreme Upgrade which I never purchased. I guess I could try that then just wait until that same control channel is used again like it was yesterday to find what other frequencies are used. As far as the sites, I only added the two within my area to a favorites list and don't believe either have the same control channels or frequencies, one has 2 and the other has 3 total frequencies so they're not big by any means. Thanks again for your suggestions, hopefully I'll get it figured out Conventional comes in fine on both, no problems with filter just set to off. I would just rather hear the digital, so If i get it working regularly by discovering new channels i'll just take the analog out of my favorites list.

 

[BC_Scan]

Up here its the same thing , we have P25 on VHF loud & clear and consistent but only occasionally one of three diff sites Blaine, Sumas or Bellingham , it must be due to the fact that they operate within three diff radio systems, but depending on area if they are vhf than it is mixed on to IWIN or to the 700 mhz system.

 

[devicelab]

Up here its the same thing , we have P25 on VHF loud & clear and consistent but only occasionally one of three diff sites Blaine, Sumas or Bellingham , it must be due to the fact that they operate within three diff radio systems, but depending on area if they are vhf than it is mixed on to IWIN or to the 700 mhz system.

Most of the troopers probably have no reason to affiliate with the IWN trunk so they stick to their normal channels.

 

[ScanYak]

My experience with JIWN system and WSP here in Yakima is they use it almost all the time. Possibly due to the terrain between Yakima and Ellensburg and also highway 12 to White Pass. Early on when they started to use the system it was used randomly. Sometimes it was only on in the morning not at night. I now use it all the time here locally due to the simulcast issues with 154.920. I spend time in Moses Lake with family and have discovered that the JIWN system is rarely used with Ephrata WSP. When it is used it shows up on Whiskey Dick site.

 

[doovenator]

Thanks ScanYak... thats good to know I'm not the only one that noticed it being used randomly. I am hearing it more than I used to, but just not constantly. I can pick up Ephrata also, and its always digital on the conventional frequency, every great great now and then on JIWN from the Beezley site (Quincy). I have been hearing the radio tech going to different sites more frequently, maybe they're changing stuff around. I know there's a project in the works that's supposed to be switching off the JIWN, moving everything to a Quincy Data Center (I think going to their own P25 Phase 2 system, but I can't remember if I read that for sure) then the FBI switching back in. I posted a link about that in the other thread about the WSP 700 mhz system.

 

[code3kid]

I think they’re still in the testing phase. When I hear them on 154.935 in analog, I can tell when they’re testing on digital and its simulcasting on conventional analog. Because you can hear the distinct robotic digital sound in the audio through the analog. And I’ve only heard it a handful of times in the past few months. They also usually say for example “935, Wenatchee on trunking” mind you I hear this on 154.935 in analog mode but you can hear that distinct P25 audio.

 

[doovenator]

They also usually say for example “935, Wenatchee on trunking”

Interesting, how have I missed hearing that? Maybe I should lock on the department more or scan fewer channels . Also, to answer my own question from my first post, I ran two trunking discovery sessions (one on each site) and never picked up any new frequencies. So the ones listed in the database must be correct and its more of an issue of them simply not using it 100%. Case closed I guess, unless i messed up on trunking discovery and did something wrong since it was my first attempt, that's always a possibility. Anyways thanks everyone for their replies, I did learn some new details from everyone's posts.

 

[ScanYak]

When I monitor WSP on the Selah JIWN site I just monitor the voice frequencies. Control Channel never changes so I program the other two frequencies as a conventional p25 with the NAC (D30) number.

 

[devicelab]

When I monitor WSP on the Selah JIWN site I just monitor the voice frequencies. Control Channel never changes so I program the other two frequencies as a conventional p25 with the NAC (D30) number.

Umm... why?

 

[code3kid]

When I monitor WSP on the Selah JIWN site I just monitor the voice frequencies. Control Channel never changes so I program the other two frequencies as a conventional p25 with the NAC (D30) number.

D30 NAC on the JIWN voice freqs? Those WSP NAC’s are only on their conventional freqs. The JIWN has its own NAC’s 711 through 71F. The Selah site NAC is 717

 

[ScanYak]

Umm... why?

To scan faster with other conventional frequencies.

The JIWN has its own NAC’s 711 through 71F. The Selah site NAC is 717

My bad.. yep, Selah NAC 717
I did find a new voice frequency for Whiskey Dick not listed on RR. >>170.587500 NAC 716

 

[doovenator]

When I monitor WSP on the Selah JIWN site I just monitor the voice frequencies. Control Channel never changes so I program the other two frequencies as a conventional p25 with the NAC (D30) number.

Interesting, that is pretty clever, I wouldn't have thought to do that. Might try that up here since there's only once CC also.

 

[scottkrueger]

I’ve been listening to regular traffic on JWIN just about 10mins ago, I heard 489 in service enroute 60 which mean home. Just heard Parks on the same talk group 59612.. Might still be testing but that’s what I’m hearing..

 

[code3kid]

I’ve been listening to regular traffic on JWIN just about 10mins ago, I heard 489 in service enroute 60 which mean home. Just heard Parks on the same talk group 59612.. Might still be testing but that’s what I’m hearing..

Which site?

 

[scottkrueger]

I believe it was Beezly Canyon site.. 59612 the talk group.