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Kenwood UBZ-LF14 FRS Walkies: They SCRAMBLE!!

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ThomasMcKean

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Yes I have a very high quality set of these beasties. Bought them many MANY years ago (1996 I believe) for a little over $300,00 as these radios were not back cheap then. Especially Kenwoods!

Since my run of business has come and gone for a while, the radios have been sitting a drawer and the quality makes them as good today as they were then, I accidentally found the manual a few minutes ago and rediscovered why I agreed to buy these,

There are so many HIDDEN FEATURES. Yew do not see them. Yew believe that what yew can do with the buttons is it. But there are secret combinations of buttons that change everything. AND, if yew add the SMC-34 Mic (the same one I recently purchased and then lamented earlier in this very forum, not knowing the connection to this radio), then yew have another three buttons for features (including scan and monitor, among other things, that yew would not have on the radio alone.)

BUT....The big thing is the SCRAMBLE. I thought this was not allowed? I am wondering if this set was grandfathered in to allow it? I will post what it says:

"While using CTCSS, you do not hear unwanted calls on your selected channel. But others on the same channel may hear your conversation. This Transceiver also allows you to scramble your calls so that others will not understand your conversation."

Does this mean what I *think* it does? Seems almost too good to be true!

The radio itself, being one of (if not the very first of) the FRS radios, it has only 14 channels limiting it to FRS, and though it took me a while it find it in the book, I was eventually able to find a transmit power output of 300mW. What makes this fascinating is that I recently got over 3 miles away in a rural area. There as SOME stuff between us, but not a LOT. Further testing is called for. These are extremely high quality radios. That is why I paid the money. So far I believe it is money well spent.

If anyone has a set of these (very RARE indeed if yew do!), and/or can provide me with more information on the scramble, it would be most appreciated. Yes. I am wanting to know exactly what this feature is, and also if I am allowed to use it since the radio has it built in.

Thanks is advance. If this post seems a a little "different" or "off" to yew, it is because his honor is loaded with ambien. So off to bed for me. Ai'll be awaiting responses! :)
 

KB7MIB

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Probably simple voice inversion scrambling. I think some manufacturers got in trouble for having it, but I don't know exactly. I'm sure someone else can post specific links to FCC actions regarding that.
 

KB7MIB

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Unless the FCC revoked the certification on the radios, or issued an official ruling saying that that specific feature could not be used, I would think, yes. BUT, I'd do some Googling first, and also see what others may post as far as definitive links.
 

KB7MIB

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Some may tell you to just use it, no one is going to care, you won't get caught. Others will tell you flat out no, it's not legal. And neither will provide any definitive links to whether or not they're right. Research is your friend! (And so is Google!)
 

gewecke

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That little kenwood is old news, besides even now you can still go to walmart ,r/s or any other store and buy the latest and greatest frs/gmrs 22ch and yeah some of them STILL have inversion scrambling.

73,
n9zas
 

ThomasMcKean

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That little kenwood is old news, besides even now you can still go to walmart ,r/s or any other store and buy the latest and greatest frs/gmrs 22ch and yeah some of them STILL have inversion scrambling.

73,
n9zas

Not only is this Kenwood old news, it may be the OLDEST news! But I tell you what, these things were built to last and you can't say that for the CRAP radios at wal-mart...
 

SCPD

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I too have the same Kenwood UBZ-LF14 Radios .Did not pay as much as you did.
Any how my dumb sister put one radio under the car seat(Power seats) and forgot it was there untill
she went to move the seat, long story short the radio got scratched but took the beating.
As to the scramble feature you can use it alll you want it is legal, I use mine a lot and as you said
they are durable to last.
edingirard
 

WA0CBW

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It is legal because there is a difference between scrambling and encryption. Scrambling is making it difficult to understand by voice frequency inversion and encryption is making it impossible to understand without the encryption key. By law scrambling is not the same as encryption but to the casual user the result may be the same. It is legal to unscramble (voice inversion) audio but it is not legal to decrypt encrypted voice transmissions.

BB
 

ThomasMcKean

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I too have the same Kenwood UBZ-LF14 Radios .Did not pay as much as you did.
Any how my dumb sister put one radio under the car seat(Power seats) and forgot it was there untill
she went to move the seat, long story short the radio got scratched but took the beating.
As to the scramble feature you can use it alll you want it is legal, I use mine a lot and as you said
they are durable to last.
edingirard

Yew prolly got yours after I did. I got them when they very fist came out and yew know how they lvoe to charge high prices at first... Do yew prefer scrambled or unscrambled? Have yew noticed any difference in distance or quality between the two modes?
 

ThomasMcKean

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It is legal because there is a difference between scrambling and encryption. Scrambling is making it difficult to understand by voice frequency inversion and encryption is making it impossible to understand without the encryption key. By law scrambling is not the same as encryption but to the casual user the result may be the same. It is legal to unscramble (voice inversion) audio but it is not legal to decrypt encrypted voice transmissions.

BB

I would think, what with your regular scanners not being able to unscramble, that it is unlikely anyone would. They'd have to be in range, and they'd need the equipment. I wouldn't think many are out there. It isn't impossible, but seems unlikely...
 

kbuicker

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I've got one for sale

Hey guys, first post, I was excited to find my trusty UBZ-LF14 today. I don't really use it so I tossed around the idea of selling it. I stumbled across your post and want to offer it to you guys.

I'd be happy to send photos. It's the bright yellow version, pristine shape, with instructions etc. No box. I also have a headset, HMC-3 too.

You can PM me if interested.

Thanks!
Kevin
 

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N4KVE

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Turns out I have one of those too. Years ago I took a new job, & that radio [grey] was in a drawer still in the box. They knew I was into radios, so they gave it to me. Simple voice inversion. I have used it to talk to other voice inversion radios. [different brand. One of the best FRS radios I have ever see. Over 10 years old. GARY N4KVE
 

ThomasMcKean

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Turns out I have one of those too. Years ago I took a new job, & that radio [grey] was in a drawer still in the box. They knew I was into radios, so they gave it to me. Simple voice inversion. I have used it to talk to other voice inversion radios. [different brand. One of the best FRS radios I have ever see. Over 10 years old. GARY N4KVE

Yes. So far I have found the voice inversion is compatible with the Midland GXT900. No doubt others as well. That's a security risk. It would have been nice if different companies had used different inversion. I have learned much more about it since that first post, even found a program that uninverts the audio. I think I prefer the Kenwood to the Midland, even though the Midland is newer with more features.
 

gewecke

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It might be a couple of those I hear on my nights off, as there's no chirp and the audio is pretty clean even on scrambled mode when listening through my Dne-12 decoder.
I don't remember the model but there's a very similar model by icom which is programmed with the ISS military simplex infantry channels. ;)

73,
n9zas
 

ThomasMcKean

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It might be a couple of those I hear on my nights off, as there's no chirp and the audio is pretty clean even on scrambled mode when listening through my Dne-12 decoder.
I don't remember the model but there's a very similar model by icom which is programmed with the ISS military simplex infantry channels. ;)

73,
n9zas

Do yew mean the Icon IC-4088A? :)
 
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DaveNF2G

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It is legal because there is a difference between scrambling and encryption. Scrambling is making it difficult to understand by voice frequency inversion and encryption is making it impossible to understand without the encryption key. By law scrambling is not the same as encryption but to the casual user the result may be the same. It is legal to unscramble (voice inversion) audio but it is not legal to decrypt encrypted voice transmissions.

BB

Absolutely wrong. Scrambling is a primitive form of encryption. There is no legal difference.

There is nothing in Part 95 that prohibits any form of encryption on GMRS or FRS.
 
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ThomasMcKean

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Absolutely wrong. Scrambling is a primitive form of encryption. There is no legal difference.

There is nothing in Part 95 that prohibits any form of encryption on GMRS or FRS.

This can't be right? The FCC fined Midland $50.000.00 for adding scrambling to the GXT900 series. MY understanding (which could be wrong for all I know, cuz things change all the time) is that scrambling is legal up to .500mw, after which it is no longer legal to scramble on FRS/GMRS. Since the GXT900 allowed scrambling at 5 watts, they were fined and ordered to cease and desist. This is why the GXT1000/GXT2000 do not have the scramble feature.
 
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