Kings County switch from P25 back to conventional? Why?

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emt_531

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Kings County Sheriffs Department switched back to conventional radio from their P25 system like a month ago and I am wondering why......They announced it over the radio and then did roll call.....I thought it was some sort of test, but they have remained in FM mode since then....What dispatch said was "Turn your radio over to FM mode and we will be using that until further notice." Im confused why they would go back to FM when P25 was working well. Also, all other Kings County agencies; HPD, CPD, LPD are all P25, which provides no interagency communication.....Any ideas? Are they going to encryption?
 

car5le

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The Sheriff's Office just wasn't happy with P25. They could never get it to work right with their field units, even after "M" sent engineers out to help solve the problem. So the Sheriff's Office went back to analog while the incorporated cities with their own system stayed P25.
 

avtarsingh

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probably cause P25 is crap !!

put up a tower on every corner in the city and it MIGHT work
 

emt_531

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So they bought the system, used it for a few years and trashed it.....Sounds like a waste of money to me. Their conventional transmissions are worse then the P25. I know that the P25 garbled quite a bit, but it was clear when it came through.....So I assume that they are just going to stay conventional or are they looking at a new system? Thanks for the info by the way....
 

avtarsingh

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kings county are amateurs in wasting money

chp just spent 500 million on a system that doesnt work

thats what chp gets for forcing their garbage equipment ino usage instead of listening to the rational ppl who actually install and do the work

i dont get why these cities cant just put a simple hiband or uhf system into place and use it ?
you could easily get by with 3-4 chans it isnt THAT HARD to get freqs

why does everything have to cost millions and millions of dollars ? its insane
 

car5le

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Well - Monterey County is about to move on a Harris P25 mixed system - conventional and trunking, over 10 new towers, county wide system for all agencies. Kings County only changed out their transmitters/receivers. Probably spent under $500k. Monterey is looking to spend over $25M on a system that is essentially ineffective, as seen by agencies back east.
 

car5le

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All they did several years ago is update their infrastructure equipment and decided to go P25. They had to update because of the narrow banding requirements. That cost also included several other departments in Kings. They just moved on their equipment when they had the money, unlike the rest of the procrastinators. Like WayneH pointed out, all they did was reprogram their existing equipment. They didn't buy anything new, nor are they see a need to buy anything new.
 

emt_531

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I have noticed that they are flip flopping between conventional and P25 at certain times. Like they will use digital on secondary if they cant hear dispatch. It sounds like a mess having both available to them. I just think that them being FM and everyone else digital creates some sort of interagency issue since they cant communicate quickly....
 

jeatock

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Once upon a time... A Fable from Far-Far-Away.

Once upon a time…

In the land of Far-Far-Away there was a county in the State of Confusion. They had a stupid old plain vanilla analog radio system that worked perfectly two thirds of the time, but the other third of the time (except for maybe 1%) their communications weren’t perfect, but completely useable. They could talk to all their neighbors, too. It just wasn't NEW.

One of the Chiefs had been hearing about the shiny new digital systems. New must mean it’s better, so he got a bid. It was only $1 million, and the vendor said it was a bargain from the State Contract for the latest thing. Besides, newer is always better.

During the sales demo, all the chiefs had to agree that the digital system didn’t have any little static, although the voices sounded… different. All the chiefs argued about the change, but the first chief insisted and got his way. Newer is always better. That Christmas the chiefs, the mayor and many of the council members all got wonderful cards from the vendor.

Halfway through the project, the vendor came to the chiefs and told them that there were going to be problems with their initial design, and that it would only take another million to make it even more better, but would only delay the project a year. Since they had already invested one million, they had to agree to the additions to make the new system even better.

When the towers were built, the vendor came to the chiefs and told them about a brand new portable that had just been introduced. It was even newer than the radios on the State Contract and let the dispatchers know how much battery life the portables had remaining. The price only added another million to the project, but newer is always better and the chiefs agreed.

The new portables weren't in production quite yet, and only thirteen months later they arrived. During testing, they found that the extra data (knowing battery life was new and therefore important) saturated the towers. The vendor said that they could add new channels to carry the extra data. New channels are always better and besides, it would only cost another million.

Finally, the day arrived and the shiny new portables went out in the field for the first time. They were brand new, and simply had to be better. But there were problems with the firmware, and the system controller crashed so nobody could talk. So, until the vendor could rewrite the code they had to go back to their stupid old plain vanilla analog radio system that worked perfectly two thirds of the time but had a little static the other third.

Two months later the vendor said that the problems were fixed and that new firmware had been installed. Newer was always better. They could talk to each other with no static, but had trouble recognizing their brother’s voices. The dispatchers had even more trouble understanding Officer Mumbles, specially when his dog was barking.There were also places that worked better when you stood on just your left foot during rush hour, and on your right foot between midnight and 3AM. The vendor said that they needed one or two more towers so they didn’t need to stand on one foot to hear. Each new tower would only cost a quarter million. But new was always better.

While the new towers were being built, they had to go back to their stupid old plain vanilla analog radio system that worked perfectly two thirds of the time but had a little static the other third.

Six months later, four towers were built and the new system was much better. There were only a few places that didn’t work, so the many of the officers carried their stupid old plain vanilla analog radios to use in those places.

One day there was a big y’all come fire, and the firefighters had to use stupid old plain vanilla analog radios to talk to the neighboring firefighters. The next day, the vendor said that the neighbors needed to get new radios too, so they could talk to the department. Besides, newer was always better.

When one of the neighboring old-fashioned chiefs found that because the new system was ‘special’ and only one vendor made the $5,000 radios that would talk on it, he offered to spend $10,000 to update his system so he could bridge his stupid old plain vanilla analog radios to the new system. The vendor said that wouldn’t work because his stupid old plain vanilla analog radio traffic would saturate the shiny new system. He needed new radios because new is always better. The old-fashioned chief politely showed the vendor to the door and kept on using his stupid old plain vanilla analog radio system that worked perfectly two thirds of the time but had a little static the other third. He decided instead to spend the $10,000 on twenty new stupid old plain vanilla analog portable radios that worked perfectly two thirds of the time but had a little static the other third.

The new system worked perfectly 90% of the time, but didn’t work at all the other 10%. The vendor said they were working on it. A few months later, one of the firefighter’s shiny new radios didn’t register on the shiny new system. He didn’t hear the order to evacuate the building and suffered a serious injury at a fire. The union sued the chiefs because the new system was dangerous. The chiefs counter-sued because newer is always batter. The judge made them go back to the stupid old plain vanilla analog radio system that worked perfectly two thirds of the time but had a little static the other third until the case was settled.

Four years and twelve million dollars later, some of the chiefs began to wonder if that stupid old plain vanilla analog radio system that worked perfectly two thirds of the time but had a little static the other third wasn’t so bad after all.

The End.


-------------

The really scary thing is that right now there are hundreds of places all across the country that could be in the land of Far-Far-Away.
 
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car5le

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So you've been reading the horror stories too. Newer is not always better. Maybe someone will tell that to Monterey County before they may a big mistake with the new, bigger and "more expensive so it should work better' system from Harris. P25 is not the cure-all. There are agencies who won't touch the stuff because they've been reading the horror stories just like you. Kudos to you!
 

ScannerDude244

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So you've been reading the horror stories too. Newer is not always better. Maybe someone will tell that to Monterey County before they may a big mistake with the new, bigger and "more expensive so it should work better' system from Harris. P25 is not the cure-all. There are agencies who won't touch the stuff because they've been reading the horror stories just like you. Kudos to you!
Monterrey county still doesn't have the money for it!
 

car5le

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They have a fairly good grant that is supposed to pay for most if not all of it. It is part of the 700LTE grant that the East Bay area is working on from what I understand.
 
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