how do you figure out the LCN order of a system if all you know are the frequencies?
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LCN order?
- Thread starter kb0rpj
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robbinsj2
Member
There is no rule for this -- simply put, by trial and error. LCNs and corresponding frequencies are programmed into the radios, the control channel emits only the LCN and not any frequency equivalency information like for P25 systems. LCNs do not even have to be created without gaps -- theoretically a system may use LCNs 03, 07, 08, 12, 14.
If you program in the control channel, many scanners will display what its LCN is. If the control channel regularly changes frequencies then patiently monitor and you'll eventually accumulate data that way.
It's much easier and quicker if you have something like Unitrunker running plus another scanner monitoring the repeater frequencies conventionally. You can correlate Unitrunker-displayed activity for a particular as-yet-unidentified LCN with activity on a frequency.
Systems often have LCNs assigned sequentially ascending or descending through the frequencies in order, so if the control channel is displaying as LCN 3 and it is the third-lowest frequency in the system's pool, you might try assuming that and seeing how it works when you program the rest accordingly. If frequencies have been added to a system since it was originally configured then any ordered sequence which may (or may not) have been there to start with was likely thrown out of whack.
Finally, you might try posting in the regional forum which covers the particular system. It is possible someone has already figured it out and it was never submitted to the database here.
Good luck,
Jim
If you program in the control channel, many scanners will display what its LCN is. If the control channel regularly changes frequencies then patiently monitor and you'll eventually accumulate data that way.
It's much easier and quicker if you have something like Unitrunker running plus another scanner monitoring the repeater frequencies conventionally. You can correlate Unitrunker-displayed activity for a particular as-yet-unidentified LCN with activity on a frequency.
Systems often have LCNs assigned sequentially ascending or descending through the frequencies in order, so if the control channel is displaying as LCN 3 and it is the third-lowest frequency in the system's pool, you might try assuming that and seeing how it works when you program the rest accordingly. If frequencies have been added to a system since it was originally configured then any ordered sequence which may (or may not) have been there to start with was likely thrown out of whack.
Finally, you might try posting in the regional forum which covers the particular system. It is possible someone has already figured it out and it was never submitted to the database here.
Good luck,
Jim
the only thing my scanner displays is CTL-06. its the third frequency in the system, so no luck there
robbinsj2
Member
Well that's a start, you know that one frequency/LCN combination. Keep an eye/ear on the system and maybe you'll catch the control channel on a different frequency, and start to fill in the chart that way.
How many frequencies are there? If eight then maybe it goes backwards, with highest frequency = LCN-01 and lowest frequency = LCN-08, though that guess is really going out on a limb. Can you provide a RR database link or FCC callsign(s) for the system?
Do you have a second scanner to scan the system frequencies conventionally while your first one monitors the control channel?
How many frequencies are there? If eight then maybe it goes backwards, with highest frequency = LCN-01 and lowest frequency = LCN-08, though that guess is really going out on a limb. Can you provide a RR database link or FCC callsign(s) for the system?
Do you have a second scanner to scan the system frequencies conventionally while your first one monitors the control channel?
WNVQ250 (AMEREN SERVICES) FCC Callsign Details UTICA site. it looks like they've recently added a P25 emission designator to the call sign, so i might just wait for them to switch to P25
Oh that's not too bad, there are only 4 frequencies for that site and you already know what LCN the control channel frequency is, correct? If I'm reading your post correctly, you believe that 857.7875 is LCN06 and is also the control channel? If that's correct, try programming this and see if it works:
LCN02 - 855.7875
LCN04 - 856.7875
LCN06 - 857.7875
LCN08 - 860.7875
LCN02 - 855.7875
LCN04 - 856.7875
LCN06 - 857.7875
LCN08 - 860.7875
855.7875 is the control channel showing CTL-06
Radio Pro-2096
robbinsj2
Member
My logic here is ... reaching ... but it can't hurt to take a few minutes and try:
LCN06 - 855.7875
LCN07 - 856.7875
LCN08 - 857.7875
LCN09 - 860.7875
LCN06 - 855.7875
LCN07 - 856.7875
LCN08 - 857.7875
LCN09 - 860.7875
robbinsj2
Member
I have a 2096 and have used it extensively for EDACS monitoring, but it has been a while since I paid much attention to its operation (it's now a feed scanner for me). If I am correctly remembering the way it displays data, I suggest:
Program in 855.7875 for channel 06.
Program in 856.7875 for every other channel from 01 to 15. Use the frequency text tag (not the TGID text tag) to label the channel slot, which is the LCN -- "01", "02", "03", etc.
Set all those channels for EDACS trunking, scan that bank in open mode preferably at a time when the system is not very busy (ideally only one voice transmission at a time).
The scanner will now always try to receive any voice transmission on 856.7875. Roughly 2/3 of the time this will be wrong and you shouldn't hear anything (unless there are multiple simultaneous transmissions on the system); the scanner may act buggy but this will not harm the 2096, at worst you will have to press SCAN for it to resume.
Occasionally it will receive exactly the way it should -- this is when the programmed frequency and the system's LCN match. You need to catch this and visually identify which LCN is in use at the moment. I'm pretty sure the 2096 displays the frequency text tag ("01" "02" "03") on one line and the TGID on another line, so just see which channel number is displayed. Voila, that is the LCN for 856.7875.
Now repeat the above for 857.7875 and 860.7875, unless the LCN numbering pattern is obvious.
Post back and let us know how it works; if I'm remembering the 2096's operation wrong then I can play with mine in a couple days to give you better instructions.
Program in 855.7875 for channel 06.
Program in 856.7875 for every other channel from 01 to 15. Use the frequency text tag (not the TGID text tag) to label the channel slot, which is the LCN -- "01", "02", "03", etc.
Set all those channels for EDACS trunking, scan that bank in open mode preferably at a time when the system is not very busy (ideally only one voice transmission at a time).
The scanner will now always try to receive any voice transmission on 856.7875. Roughly 2/3 of the time this will be wrong and you shouldn't hear anything (unless there are multiple simultaneous transmissions on the system); the scanner may act buggy but this will not harm the 2096, at worst you will have to press SCAN for it to resume.
Occasionally it will receive exactly the way it should -- this is when the programmed frequency and the system's LCN match. You need to catch this and visually identify which LCN is in use at the moment. I'm pretty sure the 2096 displays the frequency text tag ("01" "02" "03") on one line and the TGID on another line, so just see which channel number is displayed. Voila, that is the LCN for 856.7875.
Now repeat the above for 857.7875 and 860.7875, unless the LCN numbering pattern is obvious.
Post back and let us know how it works; if I'm remembering the 2096's operation wrong then I can play with mine in a couple days to give you better instructions.
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