Lets Stir The Pot a Bit

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The City of Tulsa of Tulsa and Tulsa County Sheriff are in discussions to call upon the Sheriff Deputies to respond calls within the City limits.

A few decades ago there was talk about combining TPD and TCSO into one agency; we already have consolidated city/county library and health dept., perhaps it's time to re-examine that idea.

After al,l the radio system and dispatching are already shared along with the jail; mybe something along the lines of Las Vegas/Clark county or Miami/Dade.

It's my understanding that according to sate law the Sheriff is the highest law enforcement officer in the county, so Tulsa wouldn't need a Chief.
 

hacksaw

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I wonder how busy the county is now. What would happen to the area in the county? OH wait, would this result in Tulsa city going into county areas, too?
 

w0kie

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They are not going to combine the agencies. They are just going to partition Tulsa patrol areas (I think). I'm betting that the heavily populated areas of Tulsa will remain TPD.
 
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That's the current thinking. But we can speculate on the advantages vs. the dis-advantages of combining both departments. Not too many years ago both TPD and TCSO ran separate jails and detention facilities. I would further speculate that some number crunching is or will be done on this matter. The talks between the agencies is most likely a prelude to some sort of combining of forces.
 

Freqed

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Can't be. Oklahoma is recession-proof. Heard it on the TeeVee so it must be true.
I believe the statement was "The Sheriff's department is recession Proof since they get their funding from property taxes"

I woke up this morning to constant chatter on RMA-2F 38352 the team operating on this ID used to be know as Bullettrap but I don't know what it is now but it's the same players everyday. I started hearing the chatter about 6 am which is typical for these guys (6 am Start up) and finally came into the shack to hear what was going on about 7 am, and it was all about the different scenarios of what could happen if the two offices merged. I did hear some of them say that they really needed to reconsider the taking home of units to areas outside of the City Limits. I also caught a sound bite of a TCSO dispatcher who's mike was open and commenting on Mayor Bartlett's decision to investigate the Giraffe incident at the Zoo.

If you haven't already added RMA-2F to your favorites I highly recommend you do!
 

Secret_Squirrel

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146.805 is a great frequency to listen to around lunch time as well. w0kie and others take a stab at solving Tulsa's problems. If I was Dewey Bartlett, I'd listen to that frequency. :)
 

hacksaw

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I will have to give a listen on 146.805. Sounds interesting. Thanks! Might even say hi!

I will have to write out what I thing the advantages are, I think the dis-advantages list would be quite a bit longer.
 

UTLNOK

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The City of Tulsa of Tulsa and Tulsa County Sheriff are in discussions to call upon the Sheriff Deputies to respond calls within the City limits.

A few decades ago there was talk about combining TPD and TCSO into one agency; we already have consolidated city/county library and health dept., perhaps it's time to re-examine that idea.

After al,l the radio system and dispatching are already shared along with the jail; mybe something along the lines of Las Vegas/Clark county or Miami/Dade.

It's my understanding that according to sate law the Sheriff is the highest law enforcement officer in the county, so Tulsa wouldn't need a Chief.
Interesting you should bring that up, Last night I was listening to TPD Utility 8-F... I believe it was, anyways, someone rumored that TPD was now "chief-less"...Hmmmmm

From all I've seen...we wouldn't be missing much...
 

roxcomrox

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After Fridays events I think this is looking more and more likely. TPD bringing in a TCSO Caption ? I honestly think a merger would be better for the city.
 

KD5WLX

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Regarding property taxes being "recession proof" - not true. I'm "house shopping" right now. Looked at one today that the current owners (married couple) are both TPD officers that just got pink slips. They paid $210,000 for it 3 years ago. It's worth $190,000 or so.

Property taxes don't go up as fast as home values during good markets because of the state law that limits assessors to 5% per year. However, if the value goes down, so does the assessment.

So property tax receipts are still hurt by a down economy, just not as much or as fast. And the "as fast" part is that if prices are up and wages are down, I have less money to buy stuff, so I pay less sales tax (immediate) but the property taxes get paid regardless, and won't go down until enough houses are bought at $95 per SF for the assessor to realize that all these houses on his rolls aren't worth $100 per SF any more.
 

Sparky_one

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One solution is to do what other counties have done, like Pittsburg. The sheriff deputizes the police force. This means the police can join in on a raid even if its not in the city limits. It usually only applies to felony crimes though as it doesn't mean a McAlester police officer can start writing tickets in Krebs. I'm still waiting for The U.S. Police. We sort of have one already that operates in emergency zones as and extension of any federal agency such as FEMA. A U.S. Police force would have been effective to fight people like Ray Nagin and Kathleen Blanco during Katrina. Imagine both of them locked up at a federal prison for the duration of the catastrophe.
I'm not sure why TPD doesn't call up the reserves en masse. They are one of the few police departments their size who actually have a reserve force. Oklahoma City got rid of theirs many years ago and OCSD relies heavily on their force of volunteers.
 

plaws

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Property taxes don't go up as fast as home values during good markets because of the state law that limits assessors to 5% per year. However, if the value goes down, so does the assessment.
Pretty sure you've got to dispute your assessment to see it go down. Just got my assessment and it went up ... pretty sure the amount I can actually get for the property stayed the same or went down (not that there was a bubble here).
 

KD5WLX

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Plaws,

Yep - because of the 5% rule. I've been in my house 11 years, and it's still appraised under value. Between 1999 and 2007, the value (real) went from 69k (what I paid) to 121k (what a house two doors down with a similar floor plan and sq. ft. sold for - I realize that's not a real appraisal with multiple comps, but it's what I have to work with). At that point, my assessment (capped at the 5% increase per year maximum) was only 101k.

However, in the next two years, comps in my neighborhood have dropped, and my house today is only worth about 110k. If I get a 5% increase next year my assessment will go to 112k, but unless the market takes off again, it won't be worth that. If the assessor is honest, my assessment should go from wherever it is to what the house is actually worth, and track the market from there. However, the assessors don't "value" every house every year - they take the average % change in the area overall and apply it by formula to all houses in their district that haven't sold. Except the formula takes into account the "carry-over" from prior years.

Assessments go down three ways.

1) a house is sold. The new owner starts their assessment at the price they paid. My house was assessed at 48k the year I bought it, but my 1st assessment was 69k. If your house sells for less than its assessment, you get no benefit, but whoever buys it will pay less in taxes than you did the prior year.

2) The whole market goes down and stays down, for a long time. If prices go up 2% a year, then assessments go up 2%. If prices go down 2%, then assessments go down 2% - in theory. However, if assessments go up 6% a year for 5 years, then the assessment is 5% "behind", and it will go up 5% the next year EVEN IF values went down overall. You only see the assessment go down (in the above case) if values dip again the next year. However, if you've been in your house 30 years with 10% per year increases then you are 60% behind and your assessment can keep going up for another 10 or 12 years. (ie, your house is 60% under assessed (a 60k assessment on a 100k house), therefore you get the max 5% for 10 more years to "catch up", assuming a totally flat market).

3) There are other factors that depress the value of certain pockets of homes below the surrounding market value (like a new airport being built and the nearby houses being devalued by the noise factor). In that case, until enough of them sell to show lower values, the assessor has nothing to go on - and then you challenge.

Of course, in most places, the assessors raise the assessments of ALL properties the max amount regardless, but that's another story. (If you want to discuss who to vote for assessor, we'll have to take this to The Tavern).

Where your assessment should not go up 5% is if you bought a house recently (within 2-3 years before the real estate bubble burst). It hasn't been long enough in the up market for your assessment to get "behind", therefore in the first couple of years of a down market the assessment should go the direction of the market, and by the amount of the market's change - up or down.
 
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Today the City of Tulsa announced a top to bottom audit of the City. One of the comments reported by the media is that the possibly of consolidatation of "some" city and county services, probably one of those services that they are considering is TPD and TCSO. For many years the Health Dept. and Libraries have operated as a single entity, so why not law enforcement?
 

HogDriver

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Today the City of Tulsa announced a top to bottom audit of the City. One of the comments reported by the media is that the possibly of consolidatation of "some" city and county services, probably one of those services that they are considering is TPD and TCSO. For many years the Health Dept. and Libraries have operated as a single entity, so why not law enforcement?
Hmmm...libraries....health department. Yea, I guess they are similar. They both have paper documents and employ human beings. Oh, yea. AND running water in the buildings!
 
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