• Effective immediately we will be deleting, without notice, any negative threads or posts that deal with the use of encryption and streaming of scanner audio.

    We've noticed a huge increase in rants and negative posts that revolve around agencies going to encryption due to the broadcasting of scanner audio on the internet. It's now worn out and continues to be the same recycled rants. These rants hijack the threads and derail the conversation. They no longer have a place anywhere on this forum other than in the designated threads in the Rants forum in the Tavern.

    If you violate these guidelines your post will be deleted without notice and an infraction will be issued. We are not against discussion of this issue. You just need to do it in the right place. For example:
    https://forums.radioreference.com/rants/224104-official-thread-live-audio-feeds-scanners-wait-encryption.html

Lincoln Nebraska officials weigh encryption, public access to police radio dispatches

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lmrtek

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ANY transmission put out into PUBLIC space becomes PUBLIC domain

If you don't want anyone else to listen, you either scramble or use a cell phone

Police have been scrambling transmissions and operating where scanners can't listen for 60 years so this is nothing new

Communist states like Virginia forbid the use of scanners and radar detectors for the same excuse

The TRUTH is that many leos and governments want a police state

Sorry, but regardless of any communist or flaming liberal rulings, I will ALWAYS use a scanner and radar detector in my car and record all police interactions with my dash cam

And regardless of the feelings of leos, I will ALWAYS be armed

My "permit" to do all of the above was paid for in patriot blood and signed in 1788
 

RadioDitch

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How about you pull the trigger and stick it to us and all the rest of the streamers (or potential streamers) in your area.
Careful what you wish for, you just might get it. That's exactly what's about to happen in Newark, NJ. The new P25 Trunked System will be encrypted on the police side as a direct result of the number of arrests in the last 24 months alone where a scanner app was used to assist in evading police.
 
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GarretRR

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I think it would be more constructive for them to just pass some sort of law prohibiting the radio traffic to be streamed online, that would pretty much solve the majority of their concerns and all of us could still listen
 

blantonl

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I am. About to roll out a new CAD that will eliminate most over the air dispatching anyway. :D
Demure. Hedge your risk and encrypt it all Mr System Manager.

MTS2000des said:
Most of our operational talk groups are indeed encrypted. This was done when we rolled out APX radios. More to come as legacy radios are phased out. Every new radio has OTAR and AES-256. Makes it easy.
Most of our operational talk groups? What does that mean? If your entire system isn't encrypted right now, you aren't doing your job to hedge the risk of your constituents and customers Mr. System Manager... er Technician.

MTS2000des said:
No, you posted an article. But as always, if someone doesn't agree with you or kiss up, you get all butt hurt and make it personal. I'm merely dealing with facts. Did you read the article that you posted?
You don't need to kiss up to me... but you don't need to continuously run the narrative that we're destroying things whenever I post something regarding encryption. You've been doing that for, what, 5 years now? Any time something is posted you pouce and point to the masses and scream from the mountain tops... "SEE. I TOLD YOU SO!!!" You aren't dealing in facts with the article, because as I've indicated previously, I am in direct contact with the agency that the article was written about, and I have been before the article was written. While nothing has been formally agreed upon, there is a good chance this issue will be solved in favor of everyone involved.

I'm not going to sit here thinking I've got pocket aces in the hole, but I'm also not going to let an outsider jump in and set a narrative about something that he knows absolutely nothing about other than what he read in a news article.

MTS2000des said:
The problem will soon take care of itself. I've already explained that. Streaming by third parties does not make one a friend of public safety agencies. You can stab at me (or anyone else) all day long, but it won't change that fact.
This broken record has been playing for yeeearrrs on your player. Before we know it you might actually be promoted into a position where you actually have say so over policy and procedure, and then maybe you'll finally get to stick it to the big bad broadcastify leaders and strap some encryption to some agency's primary dispatch talkgroups. You'll sit back, crack open a cold beer, and savor the sweet nectar of schadenfreude.

But then a new sheriff will arrive in town, and we'll have an official feed of those encrypted talkgroups before you know it. :D

MTS2000des said:
One would think one who makes a living off streaming and disseminating information would try to be a friend to those creating that information rather than being antagonistic. But you'll figure it out eventually.
Let's be realistic here. From day one, you've always been the antagonistic person in this community. You are against everything we do around here. You've criticized what we and I do from day one. And yet you actively participate in a community that you loathe.

Finally, and let me make this clear, this is not a threat, but a piece of advice. Do you know how many subpoenas I receive a year from public safety agencies that subpoena information for folks just like yourself that attempt to proclaim policy and direction in our forums only to have it reflect badly on the agency, resulting in misguided leaders in those agencies that start to ask questions? Well, it happens more often than I would like. Regardless of your signature line saying your opinion is your own, you might want to tread very carefully proclaiming you are a system manager and this is what we/them/us are saying with regards to policy.
 

MTS2000des

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You don't need to kiss up to me... but you don't need to continuously run the narrative that we're destroying things whenever I post something regarding encryption. You aren't dealing in facts with the article, because as I've indicated previously, I am in direct contact with the agency that the article was written about, and I have been before the article was written. While nothing has been formally agreed upon, there is a good chance this issue will be solved in favor of everyone involved.
So you are saying that you are in contact with the agency? What does this mean exactly? you've sent some emails back and forth. Who hasn't done that. "Nothing formally agreed upon"=nothing doing. Life will go on. The agency will do what is best for the agency. You are less of a factor than you think.

I'm not going to sit here thinking I've got pocket aces in the hole, but I'm also not going to let an outsider jump in and set a narrative about something that he knows absolutely nothing about other than what he read in a news article.
Haha, you have more of an ego than I ever imagined. Do you really think your whims are going to dictate policy? We shall see what happens.

This broken record has been playing for yeeearrrs on your player. Before we know it you might actually be promoted into a position where you actually have say so over policy and procedure, and then maybe you'll finally get to stick it to the big bad broadcastify leaders and strap some encryption to some agency's primary dispatch talkgroups.
Thanks, I already took a promotion.

But then a new sheriff will arrive in town, and we'll have an official feed of those encrypted talkgroups before you know it. :D
Good luck with that.

Let's be realistic here. From day one, you've always been the antagonistic person in this community. You are against everything we do around here. You've criticized what we and I do from day one. And yet you actively participate in a community that you loathe.
No, I've always been a supporter of the radio HOBBY, which is how I got started in this business. That is the only reason I choose to participate in the forums, which I was doing long before you blew in and took over ScanAmerica.

But unlike you, I am not blind to the fact that what is occurring with the unauthorized third party streaming for profit is a thorn in the side to many. Like it or not, it is a fact. And you can take cheap shots at me or anyone else all day long, it only makes you and the company you represent look like a bottom feeder. Keep up the good work!

Finally, and let me make this clear, this is not a threat, but a piece of advice. Do you know how many subpoenas I receive a year from public safety agencies that subpoena information for folks just like yourself that attempt to proclaim policy and direction in our forums only to have it reflect badly on the agency, resulting in misguided leaders in those agencies that start to ask questions? Well, it happens more often than I would like. Regardless of your signature line saying your opinion is your own, you might want to tread very carefully proclaiming you are a system manager and this is what we/them/us are saying with regards to policy.
So your making a veiled threat to public officials on a public forum? Interesting.

Keep up the fine work you're doing to enhance relations with government agencies. Your doing an outstanding job demonstrating incredible tact and prowess when negotiating your cause. Let us all know how that works out for you in the future.
 

blantonl

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So you are saying that you are in contact with the agency? What does this mean exactly? you've sent some emails back and forth. Who hasn't done that. "Nothing formally agreed upon"=nothing doing. Life will go on.
So now we want to explore the original post a little further on your terms? Well, all I need to tell you is they contacted me first. Any other communications we've had you won't be privy to - you'll just have to take my word for it. I don't owe anything else other than that to you.

Thanks, I already took a promotion.
Check out the big brain on Brad!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hrm-rPSCIBw

No, I've always been a supporter of the radio HOBBY, which is how I got started in this business. That is the only reason I choose to participate in the forums, which I was doing long before you blew in and took over ScanAmerica.
No you haven't. You've been an arrogant, antagonistic, know it all in the hobby, who parlayed some experience into a radio technician job with your local county. Congratulations. Living the dream.

But unlike you, I am not blind to the fact that what is occurring with the unauthorized third party streaming for profit is a thorn in the side to many. Like it or not, it is a fact. And you can take cheap shots at me or anyone else all day long, it only makes you and the company you represent look like a bottom feeder. Keep up the good work!
Sorry, we'll agree to disagree. But, if a dog comes into my house and continuously pisses on the carpet, eventually the dog is going to be put outside.

blantonl said:
Finally, and let me make this clear, this is not a threat, but a piece of advice.
So your making a veiled threat to public officials on a public forum? Interesting.
What is interesting is your lack of ability to read what I posted, so I re-emphasized it above so you can see what you conveniently skipped over to write yet another narrative that is your own.

Keep up the fine work you're doing to enhance relations with government agencies. Your doing an outstanding job demonstrating incredible tact and prowess when negotiating your cause. Let us all know how that works out for you in the future.
Well, so far sir, the results speak for themselves. I've always been one known to passionately defend my family and businesses, so if you want to come in and piss on the carpet in my home, except to be dealt with incredible tact and prowess - only the best tact and prowess.

Now, with all that said, you need to move on from directly antagonizing us in our own place of business. You have been warned. That is a threat. Just stop.
 

princessthelus

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I think I'll close out this thread with my own editorial. It's starting to sound like the era of the tradition scanner is fading. With new technology that the police are using it is time to start catching up to the new technology available. The new way would be SDR. Someone is bound to find the holy grail of decryption in a form of a program. DES was already proven to be able to be broken, brute force along time ago. The fact if you really wanted to, for the money you spend on a TRX series, you could spend on a system that could begin the process of AES decryption. Right now, no court ruling has been made about decryption of public saftey radio, only two rules that applies to this is military under the espionage act and using a scanner/radio in the commission of a crime. If scanner companies want to stay alive they have to compete with a hackrf or two $20 dongles and a host of freeware and if the police have a problem with a hobbiest listening in, they should remember I helped pay for that system.
 

crazyboy

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I think I'll close out this thread with my own editorial. It's starting to sound like the era of the tradition scanner is fading. With new technology that the police are using it is time to start catching up to the new technology available. The new way would be SDR. Someone is bound to find the holy grail of decryption in a form of a program. DES was already proven to be able to be broken, brute force along time ago. The fact if you really wanted to, for the money you spend on a TRX series, you could spend on a system that could begin the process of AES decryption. Right now, no court ruling has been made about decryption of public saftey radio, only two rules that applies to this is military under the espionage act and using a scanner/radio in the commission of a crime. If scanner companies want to stay alive they have to compete with a hackrf or two $20 dongles and a host of freeware and if the police have a problem with a hobbiest listening in, they should remember I helped pay for that system.

You need a court ruling to know you can't decrypt something that was not meant for you legally and that it would result in you being a criminal? Good luck brute forcing AES.

Oh by the way, you paid for the cop cars too, go take them for a spin. You paid for the gas, go fill up your car. You paid for the guns, go grab one and carry it around...
 

princessthelus

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This will always be a heated discussion. This is the same situation as using a wiretap law to prevent people from recording video of peace officers. People used to get arrested and beaten for that. It's not a matter of legality but of constitutionality. Does the public have the right to public safety communication, as long as it physically does not interfere with their job?
 

mule1075

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This will always be a heated discussion. This is the same situation as using a wiretap law to prevent people from recording video of peace officers. People used to get arrested and beaten for that. It's not a matter of legality but of constitutionality. Does the public have the right to public safety communication, as long as it physically does not interfere with their job?
Um no but keep thinking that.Have Xtra tinfoil if you are interested.

Sent from my SM-S907VL using Tapatalk
 

slicerwizard

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The fact if you really wanted to, for the money you spend on a TRX series, you could spend on a system that could begin the process of AES decryption.
I think you have no clue, in which case, why are you posting this?

If you think you do have a clue, enlighten us on how one would crack AES. Decryption is already doable - just buy a radio and enter the correct key. So about that "process" - explain away...
 

cellphone

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I think you have no clue, in which case, why are you posting this?

If you think you do have a clue, enlighten us on how one would crack AES. Decryption is already doable - just buy a radio and enter the correct key. So about that "process" - explain away...


I was thinking the same thing! I have said this before, and I will say it again:

If you can crack AES, I encourage you to publish your findings as you will probably be in the running for a Nobel prize.
 
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