• Effective immediately we will be deleting, without notice, any negative threads or posts that deal with the use of encryption and streaming of scanner audio.

    We've noticed a huge increase in rants and negative posts that revolve around agencies going to encryption due to the broadcasting of scanner audio on the internet. It's now worn out and continues to be the same recycled rants. These rants hijack the threads and derail the conversation. They no longer have a place anywhere on this forum other than in the designated threads in the Rants forum in the Tavern.

    If you violate these guidelines your post will be deleted without notice and an infraction will be issued. We are not against discussion of this issue. You just need to do it in the right place. For example:
    https://forums.radioreference.com/rants/224104-official-thread-live-audio-feeds-scanners-wait-encryption.html

Loss of our "Freedom", Just a thought.

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ka5lqj

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Messages
427
Location
Near Lakeview, LA (Caddo Parish)
The F.C.C. has mandated that, in the near future, ALL Public servce radios - Fire, Police, Sheriff, etc. 800 mhz Trunked frequencies will be forced to moved down to the 700 mhz band. This is SUPPOSEDLY to help solve their 'interference' with cell telephone transmissions. (Hogwash!) Currently, there are not many commercially made radio scanners that are capable of receiving the new 700 mhz band.

I'm afraid, because of the "Homeland Security issue", (IMHO), manufacturer's will be legally banned from conceiving, designing, or building any electronic device capable of receiving, decoding, converting, or logging the new 700 mhz band transmissions, for future sales. Police and Sheriff's departments have become 'secretive' about new 10-code, frequency or district changes already. This will effectively shut out anyone not connected in any way, other than Public Service or Homeland security forces to be able to 'listen in'. Our scanners wiil make good 'doorstops' then

Don't get me wrong, this is not a political post. It is merely my 'thoughts' as to what might happen in the near future. I hope this never comes about, as I thoroughly enjoy listening, from my home the "goings-on" in and about my area.

Respectfully submitted,
73,
"Buck"
 
N

N_Jay

Guest
K5MKE said:
The F.C.C. has mandated that, in the near future, ALL Public servce radios - Fire, Police, Sheriff, etc. 800 mhz Trunked frequencies will be forced to moved down to the 700 mhz band.
Where did you get this information.

It sounds like you are talking about "rebanding" but have mixed it up with 700 MHz
The the 800 moves are staying in the current 800 band.
K5MKE said:
This is SUPPOSEDLY to help solve their 'interference' with cell telephone transmissions. (Hogwash!)
It is Nextel interference, and please explain why you think this is "hogwash".
K5MKE said:
Currently, there are not many commercially made radio scanners that are capable of receiving the new 700 mhz band.
Being as teh band is just opening up now, are you surprised.
K5MKE said:
I'm afraid, because of the "Homeland Security issue", (IMHO), manufacturer's will be legally banned from conceiving, designing, or building any electronic device capable of receiving, decoding, converting, or logging the new 700 mhz band transmissions, for future sales.
You are worrying about something that no one is talking about happening and is very unlikely to occur.
Besides it is based on a faulty assumption about the move to 700 MHz in the first place.
K5MKE said:
Police and Sheriff's departments have become 'secretive' about new 10-code, frequency or district changes already. This will effectively shut out anyone not connected in any way, other than Public Service or Homeland security forces to be able to 'listen in'. Our scanners will make good 'doorstops' then
Actually they are mostly getting rid of 10 codes.
Their security about frequencies is just misplaced paranoia. Nothing at the national level has requested this.
K5MKE said:
Don't get me wrong, this is not a political post. It is merely my 'thoughts' as to what might happen in the near future. I hope this never comes about, as I thoroughly enjoy listening, from my home the "goings-on" in and about my area.

Respectfully submitted,
73,
"Buck"
 

n4voxgill

Silent Key
Joined
Dec 15, 2000
Messages
2,579
Location
New Braunfels, TX
The F.C.C. has mandated that, in the near future, ALL Public servce radios - Fire, Police, Sheriff, etc. 800 mhz Trunked frequencies will be forced to moved down to the 700 mhz band. This is SUPPOSEDLY to help solve their 'interference' with cell telephone transmissions. (Hogwash!) Currently, there are not many commercially made radio scanners that are capable of receiving the new 700 mhz band.

All of these statements are incorrect. First, the FCC has not mandated that anyone move to 700 MHz. The FCC has mandated rebanding that only effects 800 MHz. Licensees between 851 to 855 MHz are being moved up to make way for all licensees in 866 to 869 MHz to move down 15 MHz to 851-854.

Second, there are over 600,000 public safety radios in use that will receive the 700 MHz spectrum. Most of these radios cover both 700 and 800 MHz. The 700 MHz public safety frequencies are being taken away from television stations. Most metrolpolitan areas of the nation are out of old frequencies in all bands, so 24 MHz of 700 was made available. NO agency is required to use it.

In the future there is going to less to lilsten to as encryption has become less expensive and no longer impacts coverage. There will more use of mobile data systems that wiill reduce the amount of voice traffic. For many years to come there will some things to listen to, but you are right that scanners will pick up less and less.
 

JerryNone

Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2003
Messages
843
Location
Ohio
Makes it kinda difficult to type and drive. That is as bad or worse then talking on a cell phone and driving. Voice is the best way to go. On need only encrypt things like S.W.A.T.. That is plain paranoia.
 

JerryNone

Member
Joined
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Messages
843
Location
Ohio
Makes it kinda difficult to type and drive. That is as bad or worse then talking on a cell phone and driving. Voice is the best way to go. On need only encrypt things like S.W.A.T.. To encrypt everything is plain paranoia.
 

JnglMassiv

Member
Joined
Mar 2, 2004
Messages
853
Location
Chicago / 016
My worries are more along the lines of cheap and easy to implement encryption. Mark my words: Police and EMS wil go 98% crypto sooner than later.

It's only a matter of time.
 

NeFire242

Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
1,528
Location
Nebraska
Thirty years ago you didn't see triple trunking digital scanners either. What makes you think no one will build them?

Several departments and counties use 700MHz, and they're not moving everyone off of 800MHz just so cell phone providers can have the entire segment.
 

jmp883

Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2005
Messages
590
Location
Northern NJ
I don't think this issue will affect the scanning hobby to the point of our scanners becoming doorstops.

Many people thought that APCO-25 would put a serious dent in, if not stop altogether, the scanning hobby. Well there are several APCO-25 capable scanners on the market. Granted they aren't cheap.....yet.

The only issue I might worry about is encryption. If APCO-25 is the only system used then I don't see a problem with scanning. If more than one system is developed then you may have issues. Scanner manufacturers will probably not develop and market different scanners to handle different encryption systems. However I don't see too many different systems outside of APCO-25 being developed. I say this based on the debacle of AM-Stereo. AM-Stereo was approved by the FCC back in the late 70's or early 80's. It was done partly as an attempt to make AM sound better for the few music stations that were left on AM. It could have worked except for one little mistake. The FCC, in an effort to create competition among the radio manufacturers, allowed 2 different systems to be developed. Ok, so far so good. The problem came when the 2 systems were finally operational. You couldn't receive the signal from one system on a receiver designed for the other system. So radio stations and radio manufacturers had to pick one system and stay with it. If you were in an area that had stations with your system you could enjoy AM-Stereo. If not you were S.O.L. No wonder AM-Stereo died a quiet death.........

Of course the most obvious point is that not every agency will go encrypted or digital, if for no other reason than cost of upgrading. The agency I dispatch for full-time is looking to do a complete communications overhaul in the next few years. We are looking at either a trunked, non-encrypted system or the APCO-25 system. My part-time dispatch job is also upgrading as well. We are going from VHF-Lo to UHF, non-trunked/non-encrypted, simply because of cost. It's a small town with limited resources.

There will still be plenty to listen to via scanners. You many not be able to monitor your favorite services but there will still be things to listen to. Everyone seems to jump on the negative side of where the hobby might be going. Remember, even though the radio manufacturers may come up with 'un-monitorable' systems the scanner companies have responded successfully so far.

Just my thoughts.......:D
 
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JoeyC

Senior Member
Joined
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Messages
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Location
San Diego, CA
Scanner manufacturers are not going to develop and market any scanners to handle ANY encryption system.

This is just another "my liberties are being stripped" threads. Alot of hot air, with little basis.
 

JerryNone

Member
Joined
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Messages
843
Location
Ohio
JoeyC said:
Scanner manufacturers are not going to develop and market any scanners to handle ANY encryption system.

This is just another "my liberties are being stripped" threads. Alot of hot air, with little basis.
Secret Government = Bad

Too much paranoia. Your tax dollars @ work - encryption. NOT your wishes just your money. Goverment serves the people and like the press scanner owners are the watchdogs. Didn't we seperate from England cause of that?
 

JoeyC

Senior Member
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Scanner owners are the watchdogs of the government??? LOL. Thats the silliest thing I've heard on here yet!.
 
N

N_Jay

Guest
JoeyC said:
Scanner owners are the watchdogs of the government??? LOL. Thats the silliest thing I've heard on here yet!.

No, the silliest thing is when they start trying to defend that position!:twisted: :lol: :twisted:
 

poltergeisty

Truth is a force of nature
Joined
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Messages
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RLG, Fly heading 053, intercept 315 DVV
Watchdog incorrect.

Guard dog correct. :lol:

I think the FCC has yet made another mistake with the 800 MHz band in regards to "re banding" I think it should have moved all to 700 MHz. That would not go very well with the contract holders though. :roll: 800 MHZ has been packaged slapped with a seal of approval and sold to the highest bidders. FCC can't manage jack crap! There is interference in the 800 MHZ band and in the bureaucracy band as well and no one can sing worth a damn. ♪ ♪♫ ♪♫♪♪ :lol:
 

N1508J

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Messages
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Not allowed...infraction.
When public safety agencies say they will not go encrypted or will not do so any time soon, then tomorrow morning you will hearing squeek, chirp, gurgle twee, dweedle on your scanner!
 

jeffrey420

Member
Joined
May 30, 2006
Messages
357
What next?

Are they going to scramble cspan next? Sounds mostly like paranoia big destroya.
 
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