MARCS-IP ("New MARCS") Site and Talkgroup Discussion
FCC App for a Bowling Green site (looks to be on or near a Bowling Green water tower off Sand Ridge/Mitchell Rds in Plain Twp.
853.925
853.6125
... and probably some 700 mhz freqs or existing 800 freqs from elsewhere
Another new pending license for same location -- all 700 mhz freqs:
773.71875
773.24375
773.98125
773.70625
773.23125
One license lists 13980 Mitchell Rd, and other lists 975 S Mitchell Rd -- lat/long on both licenses is the same though.
Mike
Did anyone else read the most recent MARCS minutes posted earlier in this thread? There is a sentence in there referencing an "effort to encrypt the radio traffic on Freeway Service Patrol units".
Perhaps I am missing something, but does anyone have any insight as to what the reason would be to encrypt these talkgroups? The FSP units generally assist stranded motorists, remove debris from highways, and occasionally assist with accident scenes. It also makes me wonder if all ODOT traffic will eventually be encrypted. I'm not going to derail the thread and discuss the negative aspects of encryption, but this does seem like a shady move, unless I am missing something.
Perhaps I am missing something, but does anyone have any insight as to what the reason would be to encrypt these talkgroups? The FSP units generally assist stranded motorists, remove debris from highways, and occasionally assist with accident scenes. It also makes me wonder if all ODOT traffic will eventually be encrypted. I'm not going to derail the thread and discuss the negative aspects of encryption, but this does seem like a shady move, unless I am missing something.
I noticed I was apparently not hearing the freeway patrols for Summit County as of recent. I agree, this makes zero sense. I don’t think those trucks are in danger from the “bad guys” .
a388sig2
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This was heard last September, “Disclaimer time, unfortunately, we had an incident this morning involving one of our operators and FSP, if we ever handle incidents, this goes for all FSP. If we were handling a critical incident or one of loss of life. We are to push you guys over to FSP Tactical, when anything's going on. And we were informed of making the remark that we are, which I didn't even know, working off of non-encrypted channels. So I guess if someone wants to listen to us, they can.”
Looks like it’s time to start a statewide ballot initiative or lobby the General Assembly for legislation and clear language of what channels can and can’t be encrypted on state tax payer funded MARCS, and a review committee for justification of when agencies do go E.
Out of control bureaucracy with loose oversight, expensive operating costs and now lack of transparency for even the most mundane and routine traffic is not acceptable.
Are these the the "State Farm" safety patrol guys we are talking about? Even with a loss of life incident, I see no reason to encrypt for setting up a lane closure zone. In fact, those guys should only ever be talking about location and any traffic adjustments needed, and the arrival/departure of Fire/EMS/Police. There should be zero discussion of the incident.
west-pac
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If the FSP -is- the State Farm guys, they assist disabled motorists, which means private towing companies and private roadside service companies can overhear this radio traffic and be "Johnny-on-the-spot" for financial gain. It could also notify bad-actors of the location of distraught, disheveled, disoriented motorists who would then become sitting targets.
a388sig2
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“Bad actors” can look at OHGO cameras, Waze, or just circle Ohio roadways. FSP in the clear reports help news media, first responders and the public.
west-pac
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I've been in and around public safety and highway agencies for nearly 30 years. I can tell you without a doubt that news media agencies and first responders never listen to DOT/TMC TGs. There's way too much irrelevant chatter for the one piece of information that matters; and that ONE piece of important information will be heard when police, fire, and EMS are dispatched.
OSP Medina and ODOT are heard back and forth on each other's TG's all the time.
west-pac
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That's a terrible idea. The last thing OSP needs is some ODOT employee accidentally keying up on an OSP TG and saying "did you see THAT seat cover go by in that red car?" In Indiana you won't find anyone on ISP TGs, other than ISP.... not even county or city PD officers are permitted to transmit on ISP TGs. That's what regional mutual aid TGs are for.
For real. DOT crews all over seem to have some of the foulest mouths, and talk about the most senseless things. Not that I mind the vulgarities myself.
They've done this since ODOT went to MARCS, typically it's only Supervisor-Supervisor. Supervisor-Dispatch. Rarely ever grunt-grunt.
west-pac
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That's better than all of the grunts having access to OSP TGs. The reason why I think it's a terrible idea is because public SERVICE personnel and public SAFETY personnel have different mindsets, and different priorities. A situation that rattles a DOT employee is probably going to be rather mundane compared to a public safety employee. A DOT employee may get worked-up or excited about vehicles driving thru fresh, unfinished pavement, and may switch to an OSP TG and start yelling for assistance; meanwhile at the same time OSP may be in a real emergency, such as a pursuit, standoff, B&E, etc.. Both groups just have a different scope of duties.
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Anyway, a change of subject, I'm hearing Darke Co responding to a medical call at their fairgrounds. Disp traffic can be heard on 8Tac93; are using the 8Tac Interop channels common in Ohio? I've heard very little traffic on those channels in Indiana.
A "terrible idea" that's become the entire selling point of the whole system, the whole idea of spending $20-25/per radio per month, and $50-100/per month per console is so that public service & public safety are able to communicate with each other in times of disaster and not pick up a telephone. Otherwise it's a mish-mosh of terrible ideas with different radio systems amongst public service and public safety agencies. The one thing that continues to get lost is the training and coordination of how to communicate between agencies so it doesn't become a disaster with different priorities.
west-pac
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The entire selling point of the radio system is interoperability, NOT sharing agency-specific TGs. 🙄
A terrible idea is sharing agency-specific TGs with outside agencies.
The great idea was sharing the same radio system statewide.
A better idea would be training radio users how to communicate with other agencies, using countywide Ops TGs, regional Ops or mutual aid TGs, and statewide Ops or mutual aid TGs.
This is NOT a new concept. In the analog days, and still today, if one county had a question for another county the first county did not switch over to the other county's primary dispatch channel. They called the 2nd county on Point-to-Point (155.370Mhz). Mobile units that needed to communicate with outside agencies used LEEN (155.475Mhz). In the fire service multiple fire depts at a scene would use Mutual Aid (154.280Mhz).
Mutual aid and Ops channels are used so that every dept doesn't have to have every other dept's primary and secondary channels programmed in their radios.
Why do you think each county agency in route to the same call is given the same Ops channel assignment? That is so they can communicate and coordinate with each other, without switching to each agency's primary dispatch channel.
Also, FWIW, in Indiana, there are no 'user fees' for any agencies or radios. The state paid for all of the original infrastructure; and the counties just have to buy their own radios. After the original infrastructure was in place, if a county wanted to add additional voice channels to their county's site (due to busy signals) or if they wanted to turn their site into a simulcast cell, then the county would have to fund that. Indiana started the process of their statewide P25 radio system in the late 90s; and if you were involved in public safety shortly after 9/11/2001 you would know federal public safety money started flowing faster than a fire hose. The counties in Indiana didn't have a burden to fund their radio or console purchases, or site upgrades, it was mostly all funded by federal grant money after 9/11.
MARCS mutual aid channel training is so pathetic and rarely drilled that it's whittled down to just being easier to have ODOT hop on the OSHP talk group instead of having an OSHP dispatcher who could be dispatching multiple patrol posts attempt to patch a mutual aid channel, then good luck for those that have to find the zone and channel to get to it in a timely manner.
Ohio's been planning MARCS since 1987, many local agencies saw grants with promises of interoperability in the post 9/11 world and jumped on them. The reality is over 20 years later many agencies didn't become interoperable. They took the federal, state and local funding, with no actual goal, or perhaps a minimal goal, of talking to anyone else. Some original 9/11 grant recipients are unable to fund the replacement of that original grant equipment today.
Ohio's been planning MARCS since 1987, many local agencies saw grants with promises of interoperability in the post 9/11 world and jumped on them. The reality is over 20 years later many agencies didn't become interoperable. They took the federal, state and local funding, with no actual goal, or perhaps a minimal goal, of talking to anyone else. Some original 9/11 grant recipients are unable to fund the replacement of that original grant equipment today.
Great point. I would wager that 90% of MARCS users (especially public safety personnel) have no clue how to even change zones on their radios.