Midland new P25 trunked system
- Thread starter nd5y
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Why temporary authority to work on frequencies?
nd5y
Member
It looks like they are going to use the same frequencies as the EDACS system. I didn't check to see if the sites are in the same locations. I don't know why they got a STA instead of just adding the proper emission designators and locations to the existing license. Maybe it was just so the vendor could make more money.
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Looks like the EDACS system sites are good to 2024, but with different frequencies.
ULS License - PubSafty/SpecEmer/PubSaftyNtlPlan,806-817/851-862MHz,Conv License - WQUE210 - MIDLAND, CITY OF
A member suggested that I put my Bearcat BCD436HP into discovery mode options with my preferences, which I never done before and have a learning curve on this scanner. I have been using the GRE-500 for years.
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They are going to a Harris phase 2 system....
Someone should prepare them for the amount of suck their new system is going to have. The same system up here in Lubbock is horrible. Harris cant get it to work right.
They should have just joined the phase 1 system that is already in place...
Someone should prepare them for the amount of suck their new system is going to have. The same system up here in Lubbock is horrible. Harris cant get it to work right.
They should have just joined the phase 1 system that is already in place...
FireJustin
Member
WELL SAID!
Does anyone know why they didn't want on the (working) system that is already in place (and paid for)?
Manufacturer's support for the legacy EDACS systems is ending soon, so obtaining parts for repairs and maintenance will be problematic.
FireJustin
Member
Totally understand that, it's been coming for a while now. I was referring to the regional system.
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Probably City of Odessa would have to buy a new switch to handle the new additional load and probably have to put another tower or two in Midland County to handle the load.
The City of Odessa is hosting the Regional system on their switch. What I do not understand is that the City of Odessa has a P25 Phase 1 trunk-system for their communications and they are hosting the Regional system on their switch which are two different trunk-systems, but in RR database they are showing both as one system which is not correct.
Yes, the city of Midland would have to buy another switch. (I know someone who used to handle support of the system and that is what he told me.)
The 800mhz system and the VHF system are tied together.
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Tom, how did you find this information? This information did not show up in my FCC Grants or FCC Licenses under my MyRR page.
nd5y
Member
Application Search - Advanced Application Search
Usually every day or so I search for the following
State: Texas
Service Group: Part 90-Land Mobile-Site based
Status: 2-Pending
Purpose: AM-Amendment, MD-Modification, NE-New, RM-Reneweal/Modification
Date Type: Receipt Date, Date Range in the last week (or whatever)
Results Display: 100 matches per page sorted by Receipt Date in Descending order
That returns all new applications, modifications and amendments in Texas which were filed in whatever date range you selected with the latest ones at the top of the page. You can also select counties if you want to narrow it down or don't select the state and use the Geosearch button at the bottom to do a latitude/longitude/radius search.
Note that this is only for applications and not licenses.
To search for licenses you do basically the same thing on License Search - Advanced License Search
The FCC database is updated over night after each business day.
The FCC data on radioreference.com is usually only updated every Monday.
Midland's STA was issued this week (that only took about 3 days). ULS License - PubSafty/SpecEmer/PubSaftyNtlPlan,806-817/851-862MHz,Trunked License - WQVL785 - MIDLAND, CITY OF
Usually every day or so I search for the following
State: Texas
Service Group: Part 90-Land Mobile-Site based
Status: 2-Pending
Purpose: AM-Amendment, MD-Modification, NE-New, RM-Reneweal/Modification
Date Type: Receipt Date, Date Range in the last week (or whatever)
Results Display: 100 matches per page sorted by Receipt Date in Descending order
That returns all new applications, modifications and amendments in Texas which were filed in whatever date range you selected with the latest ones at the top of the page. You can also select counties if you want to narrow it down or don't select the state and use the Geosearch button at the bottom to do a latitude/longitude/radius search.
Note that this is only for applications and not licenses.
To search for licenses you do basically the same thing on License Search - Advanced License Search
The FCC database is updated over night after each business day.
The FCC data on radioreference.com is usually only updated every Monday.
Midland's STA was issued this week (that only took about 3 days). ULS License - PubSafty/SpecEmer/PubSaftyNtlPlan,806-817/851-862MHz,Trunked License - WQVL785 - MIDLAND, CITY OF
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KE5PL
Member
The city of Midland will have to operate under an STA until 2016 because of rebanding. Rather than trying to explain that, see 800 MHz TA: Resources by Wave: Mexico Border Region
You will see a few 800 pairs on the regional system that are also operating under STAs. Those have to be renewed every 6 months.
If you'll read the fine print on the city's original app (not STA), they cannot obtain a regular license because they were wanting to operate P25 Phase II outside of their existing EDACS footprint (WNSS433). Grandfathered, in essence. That app also shows they applied for additional pairs that are still licensed in (as I recall) in Ward county to a wireless carrier. Too close, geographically. I believe their consultant blew that one.
Texscan, I disagree, the Odessa switch (ARC4000) supports 16 sites, VHF and 800. Public Safety users as far away as Sweetwater, Sanderson, Alpine, Van Horn, Denver City, Tahoka, Gail, Snyder can communicate with the city of Odessa via *VHF*. On the primary dispatch channels. The switch doesn't care which band. Keep in mind that you will not hear OPD dispatch 1 in Ackerly on a scanner, VHF, unless there is a user/subscriber affiliated on the site (in this case, Patricia).
The site capacity of the switch was spec'ed at 12, but was tricked out to support 16 sites. The ARC is *officially* at end of life/support.
Many of us involved in the regional project since 2007 were unpleasantly surprised that the city of Midland opted to go their separate way, particularly since they chaired the IRWG (regional working group). That being said, I understand that they (city) have the capability to communicate on both the regional P25 Phase I with the outside world. Midland S.O. can maintain interoperability with the city via the Regional System. As the S.O. has upgraded to the dual band Motorola APX series, we can also communicate via the 8CALL/8TACS maintained by the city. Disparate trunked systems are problematic to the end user, as they can't be scanned. Scanning conventional and trunking simultaneously is not at all efficient.
There are some public safety entities that require communicating with both Midland, city of, and the VHF users on a daily basis, on primary (not interop) channels/TGs. Most visibly, EM and VFD. Despite the regional system, those particular users now (and again) have to maintain two different radios to perform their mission. Interoperability such that it is, has to occur on proprietary channels/TGs. And they (VFDs) are the ones that can least afford to do that. And the grants are drying up!
We are hearing the same thing about the Lubbock, city of, issues. Hear the same about San Angelo, one site rumored to have never worked (EDACS). Note that these were not a Harris/Ericsson/Ma-Com/General Electric *project* per se, but a vendor using Harris, etc, equipment. Same situation for Midland, city of. We won't second guess Midland, city of, on their needs, but as a taxpayer, I have to wonder why the duplication of services. Particularly since Midland, city of, chaired the regional project. If we only knew then what we know now!
That being said, it has been my experience that despite all of this Interop *trunking* capability, it is difficult to get ANY public safety user off of their home channel and onto an interop. So much for ICS! Just sayin'.
The S.O. (Midland) will stay on P25 VHF Conventional well into the future. The thought being 1) the rest of the world (region) uses VHF, 2) there is a single point of failure as opposed to multiple, 3) less infrastructure to maintain. 4) KISS.
FYI, anyone listening to the Odessa/Regional system may still be seeing the outer sites in "Site Trunking". This indicates a loss of the path back to the switch. Some of these use microwave, some use wireline for backhaul/connectivity. I think that may be why the RR/Broadcastify may be down.
Rant off. Usual disclaimers apply.
You will see a few 800 pairs on the regional system that are also operating under STAs. Those have to be renewed every 6 months.
If you'll read the fine print on the city's original app (not STA), they cannot obtain a regular license because they were wanting to operate P25 Phase II outside of their existing EDACS footprint (WNSS433). Grandfathered, in essence. That app also shows they applied for additional pairs that are still licensed in (as I recall) in Ward county to a wireless carrier. Too close, geographically. I believe their consultant blew that one.
Texscan, I disagree, the Odessa switch (ARC4000) supports 16 sites, VHF and 800. Public Safety users as far away as Sweetwater, Sanderson, Alpine, Van Horn, Denver City, Tahoka, Gail, Snyder can communicate with the city of Odessa via *VHF*. On the primary dispatch channels. The switch doesn't care which band. Keep in mind that you will not hear OPD dispatch 1 in Ackerly on a scanner, VHF, unless there is a user/subscriber affiliated on the site (in this case, Patricia).
The site capacity of the switch was spec'ed at 12, but was tricked out to support 16 sites. The ARC is *officially* at end of life/support.
Many of us involved in the regional project since 2007 were unpleasantly surprised that the city of Midland opted to go their separate way, particularly since they chaired the IRWG (regional working group). That being said, I understand that they (city) have the capability to communicate on both the regional P25 Phase I with the outside world. Midland S.O. can maintain interoperability with the city via the Regional System. As the S.O. has upgraded to the dual band Motorola APX series, we can also communicate via the 8CALL/8TACS maintained by the city. Disparate trunked systems are problematic to the end user, as they can't be scanned. Scanning conventional and trunking simultaneously is not at all efficient.
There are some public safety entities that require communicating with both Midland, city of, and the VHF users on a daily basis, on primary (not interop) channels/TGs. Most visibly, EM and VFD. Despite the regional system, those particular users now (and again) have to maintain two different radios to perform their mission. Interoperability such that it is, has to occur on proprietary channels/TGs. And they (VFDs) are the ones that can least afford to do that. And the grants are drying up!
We are hearing the same thing about the Lubbock, city of, issues. Hear the same about San Angelo, one site rumored to have never worked (EDACS). Note that these were not a Harris/Ericsson/Ma-Com/General Electric *project* per se, but a vendor using Harris, etc, equipment. Same situation for Midland, city of. We won't second guess Midland, city of, on their needs, but as a taxpayer, I have to wonder why the duplication of services. Particularly since Midland, city of, chaired the regional project. If we only knew then what we know now!
That being said, it has been my experience that despite all of this Interop *trunking* capability, it is difficult to get ANY public safety user off of their home channel and onto an interop. So much for ICS! Just sayin'.
The S.O. (Midland) will stay on P25 VHF Conventional well into the future. The thought being 1) the rest of the world (region) uses VHF, 2) there is a single point of failure as opposed to multiple, 3) less infrastructure to maintain. 4) KISS.
FYI, anyone listening to the Odessa/Regional system may still be seeing the outer sites in "Site Trunking". This indicates a loss of the path back to the switch. Some of these use microwave, some use wireline for backhaul/connectivity. I think that may be why the RR/Broadcastify may be down.
Rant off. Usual disclaimers apply.
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Thank you for the help and I found more information on the license.
Looks like the license has a call sign WQVL785, the bad news is the license Expiration is 05/31/2015.
ULS License - PubSafty/SpecEmer/PubSaftyNtlPlan,806-817/851-862MHz,Trunked License - WQVL785 - MIDLAND, CITY OF
nd5y
Member
It isn't "bad news". They can keep renewing the STA until the border area rebanding situation is resolved. Read post #13.
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Okay, I was just thinking that May is only a few months away.
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I heard a few comments from the Dallas/Fort Worth area on a Harris P25 800 trunking-system, nothing but trouble.
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This is the 800 Interoperability channels. I do not know why the City of Midland is not connecting to the regional system for interoperability.
Yeah, I was told they just told them to move it to phase 1 because the phase 2 was so crappy.
I set up a phase 2 scanner for a friend and it seems like every 6 or 7 transmissions were messed up....
They need to fix whatever it is before someone gets hurt.
Because politicians make the purchasing decisions based off a sales man and not knowing what they are doing.
They tried several times to get Lubbock on the phase 1 system but they wouldn't ever do it...
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