Missing first part of trunked analog transmissions

[dachs494]

Hi,

I have a new BCD325P2 — about a month old — and since getting it and programming in my county's analog Motorola Type II Smartzone system, there has been an issue where I will miss approximately the first 400ms of a transmission which would cause me not to hear short responses such as, "Copy" or "Go ahead" and occasionally unit callsigns. I don't even hear the priority tone when a channel is on emergency traffic, it ends up just being dead air.

This does not happen on conventional analog channels. Sometimes on conventional P25 channels, but not nearly as bad.

Here is what I have tried so far:
Setting a channel to "Analog only"
Setting End Code to "Ignore"
All delay settings
Setting Digital Waiting to 0
Holding on a channel
Turning off all priority settings
Resetting to factory defaults

My firmware version is 1.09.12.
Hope I can get some answers for this. Thanks.

 

[dave3825]

Can you post a link to the system? It might be simulcast distortion.

 

[ka3aaa]

its called processing time allowing the scanner to figure out what it needs to do. Also it depends how many other systems the scanner is processing or listening to.

 

[Whiskey3JMC]

It might be simulcast distortion.

I wouldn't think this would be an issue with an analog SmartZone system...

 

[KevinC]

If all TG’s are analog set your “Digital Wait Time” to zero. Default is 400 ms.

 

[dachs494]

Can you post a link to the system? It might be simulcast distortion.

I don't think that's an issue. There are multiple analog systems around here and I have that issue with all of them — no matter how far or how close I am to a transmitter.

Here is the system in question, though: Snohomish County Public Safety (SERS) Trunking System, Everett, Washington

its called processing time allowing the scanner to figure out what it needs to do. Also it depends how many other systems the scanner is processing or listening to.

I was halfway thinking that but it just seems a bit "abnormal" for it to take that long to open up squelch, especially when nothing else is programmed in to the scanner and I am holding on a channel.

I would think setting "End Code" to ignore would alleviate some of that processing time but it did not seem to make a difference.

If all TG’s are analog set your “Digital Wait Time” to zero. Default is 400 ms.

I have already done that. Thank you for your answer, though.

It does seem a little weird that even though the setting is at 0ms, it's almost as if it's still somehow active and set to the default 400ms. All talkgroups are set to "Analog only."

 

[KevinC]

I don't think that's an issue. There are multiple analog systems around here and I have that issue with all of them — no matter how far or how close I am to a transmitter.

Here is the system in question, though: Snohomish County Public Safety (SERS) Trunking System, Everett, Washington


I was halfway thinking that but it just seems a bit "abnormal" for it to take that long to open up squelch, especially when nothing else is programmed in to the scanner and I am holding on a channel.

I would think setting "End Code" to ignore would alleviate some of that processing time but it did not seem to make a difference.


I have already done that. Thank you for your answer, though.

It does seem a little weird that even though the setting is at 0ms, it's almost as if it's still somehow active and set to the default 400ms. All talkgroups are set to "Analog only."

I would triple check the digital wait time. Just to be sure.

 

[dachs494]

I would triple check the digital wait time. Just to be sure.

I have checked ProScan and the scanner itself for Digital Waiting and shows as 0ms on both, unless there is another Digital Waiting option that I'm missing. I am looking under Program System > System Name > Edit Site > Site Name > Digital Waiting.

 

[KevinC]

I have checked ProScan and the scanner itself for Digital Waiting and shows as 0ms on both, unless there is another Digital Waiting option that I'm missing. I am looking under Program System > System Name > Edit Site > Site Name > Digital Waiting.

That should be it. Maybe try 100 ms and see if that makes a difference. Maybe zero doesn’t actually work and reverts to 400 internally.

 

[dave3825]

I don't think that's an issue.

Your probably right.
I missed the "I will miss approximately the first 400ms of a transmission " part.

 

[tvengr]

Unless the audio type of a talkgroup is marked M for Mixed, I always set it to Analog Only or Digital Only. I do not leave it as Any or Auto. The scanner doesn't need to make a decision and can begin decoding immediately. I see that you have already done that. Are you scanning more than one site on the system? If so, hold on a single site.

 

[ka3aaa]

set the squelch to 2 or 3, perferably 2 and see what that does because digital doesn't use the squelch.

 

[dachs494]

That should be it. Maybe try 100 ms and see if that makes a difference. Maybe zero doesn’t actually work and reverts to 400 internally.

No luck with that solution. I compared audio clips from both ProScan & my SDR in some audio editing software and found that I miss EXACTLY the first 400ms of a transmission. Seems to me like the Digital Waiting option is "broken" and will always stay at the default 400ms. Maybe a firmware issue.

Unless the audio type of a talkgroup is marked M for Mixed, I always set it to Analog Only or Digital Only. I do not leave it as Any or Auto. The scanner doesn't need to make a decision and can begin decoding immediately. I see that you have already done that. Are you scanning more than one site on the system? If so, hold on a single site.

I almost always monitor one site and hold on a single talkgroup.

set the squelch to 2 or 3, perferably 2 and see what that does because digital doesn't use the squelch.

I've had the squelch on 2 ever since I got it.

 

[dave3825]

No luck with that solution. I compared audio clips from both ProScan & my SDR in some audio editing software and found that I miss EXACTLY the first 400ms of a transmission.

You mention Proscan.

Does this problem happen when the scanner is not connected to Proscan?

 

[wtp]

West Simulcast	853.3375c	852.9375c	857.0125c	857.1625c	857.0375	856.3875	856.5875	856.0375
		855.3125	853.300	853.850

East Simulcast	853.925c	853.750c	853.5875c	853.6125c	853.3875	853.3625	852.675	852.9125
		852.9625

it's beginning to look a lot like simulcast.
there is 4 other sites listed, but i don't think he uses them.
Test/Lab I/R
Index IR
Darrington IR
Skykomish IR

 

[tvengr]

Are you listening to the scanner speaker directly? Amplified "green" speakers such as the Uniden BC23A clip the beginning of the audio while the audio amp turns on. There is a mod to leave the amp turned on to eliminate that problem. I had a Radio Shack amplified speaker with the same problem. I didn't hear the beeps when pressing the buttons.

 

[dachs494]

You mention Proscan.

Does this problem happen when the scanner is not connected to Proscan?

Yes, it does.

Are you listening to the scanner speaker directly? Amplified "green" speakers such as the Uniden BC23A clip the beginning of the audio while the audio amp turns on. There is a mod to leave the amp turned on to eliminate that problem. I had a Radio Shack amplified speaker with the same problem. I didn't hear the beeps when pressing the buttons.

I am listening directly through the speaker on the scanner. No external speaker is plugged in.


It's so strange because it seems as if I'm the only one with this issue, unless someone else can confirm the same on an analog system near them? I've done a lot of searching on this forum before creating the thread. Curious if my unit is somehow defective in a way or if it really is a firmware issue.

Nonetheless, I appreciate all of you giving your answers to try and help solve my issue.

 

[ka3aaa]

other people have learned to live with the limitation issues that every scanner on the market has, apparently you cant so maybe its time for you to find a different hobby. your brain cant process any faster than that scanner does, 1/2 of a second is pretty dam fast and you will not tell me you are within ear shot listening to your scanner 24/7/365.

like i already told you its processing and house keeping time.

 

[dachs494]

other people have learned to live with the limitation issues that every scanner on the market has, apparently you cant so maybe its time for you to find a different hobby. your brain cant process any faster than that scanner does, 1/2 of a second is pretty dam fast and you will not tell me you are within ear shot listening to your scanner 24/7/365.

like i already told you its processing and house keeping time.

Yes, I can see now that this is one of the few issues the scanner has — and that's all right. I wanted to make sure this was nothing on my end that I was doing wrong, and was a legitimate issue in the scanner itself. I still enjoy the Uniden BCD325P2 and will continue to use the scanner despite the flaws.

Thank you for your response.

 

[CanesFan95]

This issue sounds awfully similar to the old Uniden BC245XLT hand-held scanners from years ago. There was a 2nd version that had the exact issue as you describe on Motorola systems.

Just our of curiosity. If you put the scanner in search mode to search for TGs, are there times when it quickly flashes a TGID on the screen but doesn't stop on it?