Monitoring Halton Region with Unitrunker v2

[falldownphil]

Hey all,
Figured I'd post something here before going to the Unitrunker group.

Trying to monitor Halton Region with Unitrunker 2. It seems to be going ok, but I haven't heard any audio.
Obviously HRPS is encrypted, so no surprise there. But, I've seen some traffic over Burlington & Milton/Halton Hills Fire and haven't heard any audio at all despite having seemingly pretty good reception.

IIRC: Unitrunker v2 cant decode P25 P2 audio however RR lists it as a P25 P1 system.
I do see a couple mentions to P25 radio upgrades in HRPS PR material over the years but nothing decisive. Additionally, if I'm not mistaken I seem to be getting conflicting information on this point in Unitrunker itself.

When I look under system groups it doesn't show any TDMA groups but does indicate FDMA (If I'm not mistaken: would indicate P25 P1)


However the bandplan is as follows: (which ... If I'm not mistaken: would indicate P25 P2)


Regarding channels, it seems that voice channels show up as secure. If there is any encrypted traffic over them (when viewed individually filtering out HRPS calls, there are no secure calls shown in history) would it be foolish to assume that unencrypted traffic sharing the voice channels would come through fine despite this?



Am I missing something?
Is this something like whats discussed here?(I've been around a good number of HRPS, Burl/Milt/Oak Fire and never seen them with anything other then APX)
Then again, Its the middle of the night and I may very well hear something during the more active morning hours(I've never been out in my truck early enough to hear the morning Fire test broadcasts, maybe this will be the day)

 

[ATCTech]

It's running absolutely fine here (current version 2.1.0.95). I've never seen or logged any Phase 2 radios on the system, so I don't consider that as a reason you're not getting audio.
Are you using Unitrunker for any other P25 Phase 1 systems successfully? Remember too that UT does the D/A audio conversion internally, so you should be getting audio directly from it so long as you've set the audio output in the "Voice" VFO configuration to be your speakers.

My "Control" VFO settings:


My "Voice" VFO settings:

 

[falldownphil]

It's running absolutely fine here (current version 2.1.0.95). I've never seen or logged any Phase 2 radios on the system, so I don't consider that as a reason you're not getting audio.
Are you using Unitrunker for any other P25 Phase 1 systems successfully? Remember too that UT does the D/A audio conversion internally, so you should be getting audio directly from it so long as you've set the audio output in the "Voice" VFO configuration to be your speakers.

My "Control" VFO settings: View attachment 121600


My "Voice" VFO settings: View attachment 121601

I've only ever used unitrunker to monitor fleetnet, which worked fine.
My settings are similar to yours but I still have no audio.
I'm currently running v 2.1.0.86, perhaps I'll update or do a fresh install.

 

[falldownphil]

Update:
Updated to 2.1.0.96 but still no luck with audio.
VFO settings are as follows
Control:


Voice:

 

[VA3JPX]

Updated to 2.1.0.96 but still no luck with audio.

I am noticing your window value is -31. On VFO1 change your warp to 0.5 and see if that gets your window close to zero. Once its at zero or even within 0 to 10 you should start decoding audio.

If 0.5 doesnt get it to zero, try 0.6 .. etc

I assume you are using only one RTL device?

 

[falldownphil]

I am noticing your window value is -31. On VFO1 change your warp to 0.5 and see if that gets your window close to zero. Once its at zero or even within 0 to 10 you should start decoding audio.

If 0.5 doesnt get it to zero, try 0.6 .. etc

I assume you are using only one RTL device?

Adjusted warp and was able to get window pretty close to 0. Still no luck with audio.

I am only using one device.


Pictured: VFOs and active calls, which if it had worked I should have been decoding audio on talk group 801(I believe)
VFO1:


VFO2


Calls:

 

[VA3JPX]

Are you running this in a VM?

 

[falldownphil]

Are you running this in a VM?

Not a VM, but it is Windows running on a Mac via Bootcamp. I have had issues before that I attributed to the setup, but they were all related to virtual audio channels when trying to send audio elsewhere. With Unitrunker itself, I am able to pickup FleetNet no problem, for instance

 

[VA3JPX]

Its looking like either the TGs are encrypted OR the system is Phase 2 which UT doesn't support. That's my take.

 

[falldownphil]

Its looking like either the TGs are encrypted OR the system is Phase 2 which UT doesn't support. That's my take.

Majority of traffic is encrypted Police comms. What leads you to beleive system is Phase 2?
I had wondered if that was indicated by the band plan from my first post, but user ATCTech apparently monitors the system without issue

 

[VA3JPX]

What leads you to belive system is Phase 2?

Because I have no other reason as to why it's not working. Do you have access to a PC running Windows?

Perhaps you can test it on a PC and not a Mac running Windows.

 

[Forts]

Fire up DSD+ quick... that'll tell you if there is any P2 traffic (which, by the way, I'm pretty certain there isn't).

 

[falldownphil]

Fire up DSD+ quick... that'll tell you if there is any P2 traffic (which, by the way, I'm pretty certain there isn't).

Unfortunately the aforementioned issues my setup has with Virtual AudioCchannels means I don't believe I can use DSD+ unless I find a work around.

For what its worth, I decided to see what happens when I try to listen to the neighboring Peel system (which is listed as P2).
Unitrunker follows channels just fine on this system and even decodes audio (sounds like transit)

So whatever issue I'm having seems limited to the Halton system.

 

[VA3JPX]

Unfortunately the aforementioned issues my setup has with Virtual AudioCchannels means I don't believe I can use DSD+ unless I find a work around.

For what its worth, I decided to see what happens when I try to listen to the neighboring Peel system (which is listed as P2).
Unitrunker follows channels just fine on this system and even decodes audio (sounds like transit)

So whatever issue I'm having seems limited to the Halton system.

If you want to get this issue solved, you have to use Unitrunker in an environment it was developed for. Right now you are not using Unitrunker in an environment that it was developed for.

 

[ATCTech]

There is NO P2 traffic on the Halton system. Stop bringing that up please. The only encryption I have ever seen will be between T/G 100 and about T/G 499, the HRPD groups. ALL other users are P25 in the clear and FDMA Phase 1.

I have a suspicion your problem may be related to the simulcasting in Halton. It can be a bear to receive depending on your location. Try the north zone CC and see if works any better. (857.0375) From my location I do better with the south system, and I'm a north of Burlington and Oakville. And I fully concur that the Peel (and Toronto) systems are much cleaner for me as well.

 

[VA3JPX]

I have a suspicion your problem may be related to the simulcasting in Halton. It can be a bear to receive depending on your location. Try the north zone CC and see if works any better. (857.0375) From my location I do better with the south system, and I'm a north of Burlington and Oakville. And I fully concur that the Peel (and Toronto) systems are much cleaner for me as well.

Good point. However, he would hear "something" on a simulcast system.

 

[ATCTech]

HOLD IT! A single RTL dongle for both roles? RTL sticks are only about 2 MHz wide while the Halton system frequencies span over 5 MHz from top to bottom.

I've never tried it, but did you set up 2 VFO's on a single RTL and expect the dongle to simultaneously "hear" a CC at 857 MHz AND a VC at 862 MHz?? The RTL stick can't do that. I do use an Airspy for both roles on UT, but it's of course about 10 MHz wide. The Peel system is using a MUCH narrower slice of spectrum so it could work there, yes.

 

[falldownphil]

I have a suspicion your problem may be related to the simulcasting in Halton. It can be a bear to receive depending on your location. Try the north zone CC and see if works any better. (857.0375) From my location I do better with the south system, and I'm a north of Burlington and Oakville. And I fully concur that the Peel (and Toronto) systems are much cleaner for me as well.

So far I haven't been able to get a strong enough signal from 857.0375 to see any traffic. I'm pretty much on the south end of the border between Oakville and Mississauga and have always found even FleetNet reception tricky in the area.

....Well, I feel dumb. I'm just realizing that my problem might just be due to an oversight on my part.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but when monitoring the South cc 857.2625 Unitrunker sets that as the the centre frequency.
The nearest voice channel, 860.5125, is 3.25 MHz away.... putting it well outside the usable bandwidth of my cheap SDR.

I forgot to even take that into consideration for the Halton system. I only realized when comparing the Peel frequencies.

 

[ATCTech]

Don't feel dumb, it took me twice looking at your setup screenshots to realize "hey, this is the Halton system, it'll never work". A big DUH to me, too!

 

[VA3JPX]

@falldownphil is the issue resolved?