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Motorola XPR7550e receiver design Was: What's a good radio?

TassieJay

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Apr 12, 2012
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To me, any radio that’s not a double conversion superhet receiver is an intermod sponge, & to be avoided
Let me know when you sell off your Gen2 Motorola handhelds cheaply, then? Their Rodinia direct conversion receiver IC is used in the XPR7000, XPR3000 & SL7000 ranges, at least. They probably also use them in the APX range, too. I could do with a few new Moto 'intermod sponges' to play with :)
 

N4KVE

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Let me know when you sell off your Gen2 Motorola handhelds cheaply, then? Their Rodinia direct conversion receiver IC is used in the XPR7000, XPR3000 & SL7000 ranges, at least. They probably also use them in the APX range, too. I could do with a few new Moto 'intermod sponges' to play with :)
Before I do, I’d like to see some documentation to prove that.
 

TassieJay

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Before I do, I’d like to see some documentation to prove that.
Certainly. This requires a little bit of effort, the answer can't be handed out on a silver platter because of the way Motorola protect their intellectual property.

Firstly, look up the XPR7550 FCC internal photos they record at: https://fccid.io/ABZ99FT4086/Internal-Photos/INTERNAL-PHOTOS-1692172
Notice the lack of any IF filters. That's clue no.1

Download the pdf of the same document, and process the photos to bump up contrast etc. Observe the RFIC in use is marked "Rodinia 2.3" for the 7550e or "Rodinia 2.2" for the non-e versions.
Same for the VHF: https://fccid.io/ABZ99FT3085/Internal-Photos/Internal-photos-1531867 and https://fccid.io/AZ489FT7066/Internal-Photos/Internal-Photos-2846759
And 800 / 900 MHz too.

You can do the same thing for the XPR3000 series, that uses an identical RF board to the XPR7000, too, and see Rodinia is in use there, too. Ditto for SL300 and SL7000 series.

Now download the Vertex Standard EVX-261 service manual that also uses a Rodinia RFIC, where it's general operation is explained: https://www.radiotronics.co.uk/pdf/vertex-standard/evx-260/vs-evx261-servce-manual-uhf.pdf
In there, you'll clearly see that the RF input goes through a BPF, variable attenuator (another clue right there! SDRs require input signals to be held within tight windows of signal level for optimum reception), preamp, another variable attenuator, and then directly into Rodinia. No mixing, no IF filters.

Conclusion is Rodinia family as used in multiple Motorola & at least one Vertex Standard handheld is a direct conversion receiver device. It also directly generates the RF output signal, too.

Or, if you have access to the Motorola Detailed Service Manual for the XPR7550 (publication number MN002182A01) which will show the same as what has been derived from the above. Of course, I can't share the DSM, that is Motorola proprietary. Lest I risk the ire of Big M's legal eagles.
 

N4KVE

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If this is true, it’s very sad. While Motorola used to be a huge empire, they are withering away to to nothing. To cut costs, they sold their manufacturing facility west of Ft. Lauderdale, as well as the one in Schaumburg. They sold their cell phone business to Google, who sold it to Lenovo. Most of their manufacturing is now done in third world countries, & now they seem to have resorted to direct conversion receivers. Mr. Galvin must be turning in his grave.
 

N4KVE

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I know. I have a 7550, 7550e, & a 7580. I’m still not convinced it’s direct conversion yet. But I know a few guys who work at the Plantation site, & they will ask the right people.
 

TassieJay

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Still need more proof, huh? Tough audience! Here you go. Definitive proof. DSM for entire XPR7500 family is available at repeater-builder - just google XPR7550 detailed service manual and you'll find it. Schematics definitively show no mixer ahead of Rodinia, no IF stage. Ergo, direct conversion receiver. QED.
 

gman1971

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Apr 4, 2020
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Well, for a superhet you do need front end filtering, but that is not necessarily the case for a direct conversion receiver, not when filtering done at DSP level.

Also, looking at schematics without knowing how they works, b/c the entire Rodinia is "not fully known how it works", is not very useful. Have you actually measured the Receiver Effective Sensitivity of any of those Gen2 TRBO radios? Doesn't sound like you have, by the tone of your statements. And by Receiver Effective Sensitivity I don't mean absolute sensitivity, which is a worthless figure.

The XPR5550e Gen2 measured with an ISOTEE has recorded the best Receiver Effectve Sensitivity of any radio I've tested to date, that includes everything ham, lmr, etc. Nothing dual conversion superhet I own, including my XPR4550 (superhet), nor EVX-5400s mobile (superhets), with pretty decent front ends can touch the XPR5550e radio, in the ISOTEE and in real world performance results.

The XPR7550e UHF can hear crystal clear audio almost half a mile further than any other radio on just 1 W I own, that is including the XPR6550, the EVX-539 mobiles, and everything else UHF I own. Same story applies to VHF...

Sounds like you are just looking for excuses to justify buying another POS Baofeng... good for you.

G.
 

gman1971

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I could sell you a Gen2 TRBO radio, just don't expect the price to reflect your misleading opinions believing these Motorolas are intermod sponges... its a great way to get cheap radios... mislead people into believing they are bad. ha.
 

AK9R

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As a reminder, buying or selling in the forums is not allowed per the forum rules. Please take any negotiations to private conversations.
 

gman1971

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Wow, the sale comment was purely sarcastic, I have no plans on selling my Gen2 TRBO radios... let alone at the price this person was hoping to get one for.

Point I was trying to make was as a warning to the misleading claims made about the Gen2 radios being intermod sponges so he could scam someone into selling one for less than its fair value.

G.

As a reminder, buying or selling in the forums is not allowed per the forum rules. Please take any negotiations to private conversations.
 

alcahuete

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Wow, the sale comment was purely sarcastic, I have no plans on selling my Gen2 TRBO radios... let alone at the price this person was hoping to get one for.

Point I was trying to make was as a warning to the misleading claims made about the Gen2 radios being intermod sponges so he could scam someone into selling one for less than its fair value.

G.

LOL!!! He obviously didn't read the entire thread. I think the thread was split anyway. There are a lot of previous posts missing.
 

gman1971

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Alcahuete, that would make sense, then, as these XPR Gen2 radios are not "intermod" sponges as they were referred in the original post.
 

N4KVE

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First of all, there are 2 missing pages, as this was originally a post about a guy looking for a decent CCR. I know, an oxymoron. I simply said I don’t like CCR’s as they have a direct conversion receiver, & while sensitive, dont have a front end. Someone else then piped up that the Gen 2 Moto portable radios are also direct conversion, so I must hate mine. I already own a 7550, 7550e, & a 7580, so I don’t need to buy another. I asked a Moto employee I know who works at Plantation if they were indeed direct conversion. He said he could not confirm, or deny what they are. But he did say if they were direct conversion, they would have extra components that the CCR’s don’t have to prevent desense. But the mods here decided to start another thread, but the first part of the story is missing. So it’s like you walked in “in the middle of the movie”.
 

dietlein

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Now download the Vertex Standard EVX-261 service manual that also uses a Rodinia RFIC, where it's general operation is explained: https://www.radiotronics.co.uk/pdf/vertex-standard/evx-260/vs-evx261-servce-manual-uhf.pdf
In there, you'll clearly see that the RF input goes through a BPF, variable attenuator (another clue right there! SDRs require input signals to be held within tight windows of signal level for optimum reception), preamp, another variable attenuator, and then directly into Rodinia. No mixing, no IF filters.
The EVX-S24 service manual shows more detail about this RFIC's internals:

 
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