multi-site programming advice

[KC9NTX]

Hello--I am new to Harris and RPM. I just took over responsibility for programming my agency's radios with basically no training or documentation from my predecessor.

I am learning as I'm going here, but I have one question that is stumping me at the moment: for trunked systems with multiple sites, what is the best way to program these? I don't see anything under the SYSTEM object itself in RPM for adding multiple sites. Do I need to create a new "system" for each site? Is there a way to ensure that we're failing over based on which site's signal is the strongest?

To head off the obvious question: I don't have a current working mission plan that I can work from. Our existing mission plans are all conventional, but I am tasked with adding on configuration for the new-ish statewide trunked system.

Thanks in advance!

PS: Does Harris have any kind of KB or programming documentation that I should be referencing?

 

[sbk1982]

That's a loaded question up front. Depends on the system and how you want the radio to behave. Some build individual systems in the radios that help limit where talk groups can be dragged. Ex: an East TG can't be carried over to the West Sites.

If you want a radio to always take the strongest signal no matter where you are in the system then you probably only need one system in the radio. But the roaming characteristics you set that system to probably depend on the system you're connecting to. In my experience I use Enhanced CC Roaming for all P25 Trunking Systems I build in radios.

Having something to work from already always helps. Are there other user radios already configured for the system you're trying to build in your user radios? Reference their stuff to get an idea of what you need to do.

 

[KC9NTX]

Are there other user radios already configured for the system you're trying to build in your user radios? Reference their stuff to get an idea of what you need to do.

Unfortunately other agencies aren't super "sharey" when it comes to this kind of thing, so getting my hands on an already-programmed radio is going to be tough. And I also believe most of the others in my area are on Motorola, which I don't have software for in any case.

If you want a radio to always take the strongest signal no matter where you are in the system then you probably only need one system in the radio.

If I were to take this approach, would I just stack up all the control channels toward the top of the trunked set? Would that cause any issues with site IDs and whatnot?

The direction I'm testing out at the moment is putting a system for each site and then using Fixed ProScan with the neighbor systems in the scan list. Will drive around tomorrow and see if that works how I expect.

 

[sbk1982]

If I were to take this approach, would I just stack up all the control channels toward the top of the trunked set? Would that cause any issues with site IDs and whatnot?

Just add all channels to one system list. It will identify the site ID's and whatnot when affiliating in Enhanced CC mode.

 

[KC9NTX]

Ah ok, I’ll give this a go and see how it works out. There were a couple of options when enabling Enhanced CC mode that I didn’t understand.

Are you aware of any official documentation? Is that something I’d have to contact Harris for?

 

[KC9NTX]

There were a couple of options when enabling Enhanced CC mode that I didn’t understand.

To clarify, I'm not 100% sure on the "Band Hunt" settings. I will note that the Enhanced CC seems to be working at a basic level (the radio I'm testing with is switching between sites as expected), but I'm not sure that it's configured correctly in any case as I appear to be hearing only one side of the traffic on the talkgroup I'm monitoring. On the other mission plan with one system per site, I am not having any issue hearing both sides of the traffic.

 

[merlin]

For P25, what helped me the most was reading up on P25 and its hierarchy.
One point of this is its connecting to different systems (regardless of sites) that it should do from a control channel.
This allows interop between agencies and systems
You will need to affiliate other sites and that should handle the channels.
I have found RPM complicated in this if you compare to CPS but that context help does help.
That enhanced CC sounds right if it is switching sites, maybe not affiliating the TG channels correctly.

 

[KC9NTX]

Turns out I had the IDEN set wrong, but it has been corrected and everything is working fine.

I was still not entirely sure about the band hunt options for Enhanced CC, but I haven’t had any issues with it yet.

Now it’s time to move on to CPS and hopefully get the Motorola’s working.

 

[IFRIED91]

In RPM I did come across something regarding the building an IDEN table….. my newbie-like question is given the info off off a control frequency table and other data from RR, how do you go about putting an IDEN table together? Here’s an example of a Harris system I wanted to monitor.

 

[K2NEC]

In RPM I did come across something regarding the building an IDEN table….. my newbie-like question is given the info off off a control frequency table and other data from RR, how do you go about putting an IDEN table together? Here’s an example of a Harris system I wanted to monitor.

You need a scanner to get the IDEN info, or maybe try using the default 800 IDEN data will work.

 

[IFRIED91]

You need a scanner to get the IDEN info, or maybe try using the default 800 IDEN data will work.

Default 800 meaning what? I’ve never set up IDEN tables manually… every system I’ve worked on before did everything OTAP which is the easy way haha… IDEN data appears to be a calculated formula that shouldn’t change unless site frequencies change

 

[K2NEC]

I'll have to check later to see what it is. IIRC its 12.5, 45mhz positive shift, 806.00625
Hopefully someone can fix that because I'm not sure its 100% right

 

[K2NEC]

I knew it was wrong,
6.25 spacing, 45 negative offset, 851.00625 base frequency

 

[sbk1982]

To clarify, I'm not 100% sure on the "Band Hunt" settings. I will note that the Enhanced CC seems to be working at a basic level (the radio I'm testing with is switching between sites as expected), but I'm not sure that it's configured correctly in any case as I appear to be hearing only one side of the traffic on the talkgroup I'm monitoring. On the other mission plan with one system per site, I am not having any issue hearing both sides of the traffic.

Turns out I had the IDEN set wrong, but it has been corrected and everything is working fine.

I was going to point you to the IDEN set for that issue. Seen it before.

As far as "Band Hunt" it depends on the system you're connecting to. Set a broad range that includes everything the radio should be looking for.

 

[wa8pyr]

Turns out I had the IDEN set wrong, but it has been corrected and everything is working fine.

I was still not entirely sure about the band hunt options for Enhanced CC, but I haven’t had any issues with it yet.

For 700/800 MHz (assuming it's a standard system), use:

Enhanced CC
Start 768.00000
End 861.00000
Spacing 6.25

Check with your local system administrator about the ProScan settings (sensitivity, switch delta, etc). These can vary depending on whose system you're using (Harris, Moneyrola, etc) and may need to be tweaked for optimum performance.

As far as sites and site preferences, you can put all the sites in one list; ditto the trunked frequency set and P25 group set. I would recommend putting the control channels for your local area sites at the top of the frequency set so the radio finds them immediately upon power up instead of maybe having to go through the whole list.

If you have any site preferences (Never, Least, No Preference, Prefer, Always Prefer) for special purposes, once you create your base system, you can duplicate it and populate each duplicate with specific site preferences. You can also set it to Fixed ProScan and specify a site number and NAC, which will force the radio to that site only whenever a channel using that system is selected.