MURS operators who think frequencies belong to them

[Scannerhead1983]

I would just set a PL on the frequency or a DPL and call it good. MURS is used for private low power communications and is license free. Obviously there is no reason why they should be charged for using a modern age "citizens band" frequency. Police frequencies are used for police operations... Why this agency is so concirned about a murs frequency is beyond me (even if at one time they were licensed to the frequency) Sounds to me like the agency is just trying to play radio police.

 

[JoeyC]

HA, This is a license-free frequency and the burough hasn't done there homework.

I would #1- ignore their threats, and #2- just for kicks send them a simple letter stating that their threats of charges are baseless and perhaps they should contact the bouroughs attorney in the future before making embaressing claims as they have, and then #3- forget about it.

 

[datainmotion]

I would just set a PL on the frequency or a DPL and call it good.

Thank you.
Too bad it took 22 posts for someone to say this.

Furthermore - this may be of some interest to this discussion - RR database Nationwide Search 151.820

 

[K9WG]

You need to go back to the first messages and RE-READ them.

The discussion is about MURS not FCC allocated Police Frequencies.

If the Police want to use [and many have for Covert/Surv Ops] business band, FRS, GMRS and MURS they have no-more protection and/or authority than another legal user of the channel would.

I was responding to the statement.

BTW, the FCC has been known to step into cases like this. (The local government is usurping the FCC's authority. Using a frequency you're not legally allowed to can't violate local or state law, since the federal government has reserved the right to enforce federal law. Since their demand that you stop using it is, in itself, illegal, the best they can do is get any such charge thrown out of court. If some local attorney-masquerading-as-a-judge finds you guilty, the appeal will keep him sleeping standing up for years. And flipping burgers for a living.)

I am not debating the the OPs right to use the frequency, or the local authority's error. Just the statement that state/local can't enforce a restriction on transmitting on assigned frequencies. In my example Indiana can and has enforced restrictions.

 

[Scannerhead1983]

Datainmotion,

I am actually rather surprised that no one else has. I would have just set a coded squelch so I didn't have to hear anyone else. Let them complain it's only going to look worse on the agencies part. That would be like someone taking over a CB channel and saying that they are a police agency and the channel is now under their control. Wal-marts all over the US use murs frequencies, so does Menards and a tun of other places. They are public frequencies and it's just that... Public, License free communications just like FRS. That's why radio manufactures make all the squelch codes.... so multiple users can use the same frequencies without much interferance. If it becomes that much of a problem just move to one of the other MURS frequencies and set a coded squelch on that one too.

 

[slcgyro]

murs

Need to check 95.1317

 

[rescue161]

I would just set a PL on the frequency or a DPL and call it good. MURS is used for private low power communications and is license free. Obviously there is no reason why they should be charged for using a modern age "citizens band" frequency. Police frequencies are used for police operations... Why this agency is so concirned about a murs frequency is beyond me (even if at one time they were licensed to the frequency) Sounds to me like the agency is just trying to play radio police.

http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-02-139A1.pdf

e. Continuous carrier mode

30. Under Part 90, continuous carrier mode was permissible on four of the five VHF frequencies and the rules adopted in the Report and Order carried this provision over to the Part 95 MURS rules without discussion. Family Security indicates that the duration of use of MURS frequencies could become a detriment to their proposed low-cost electronic tracking system. Family Security suggests that all voice and data traffic on MURS frequencies be time limited and that transmission intervals be time restricted. In his comments, Verdecia states that MURS has so few available frequencies that the continuous carrier mode would cause an unacceptable loss of service in a given area. We agree. As discussed above, users operating on a channel for an extended period would do so at the expense of existing push-to-talk voice operations, as well as other users of these shared channels. Therefore, because MURS channels are shared, we will prohibit MURS users from operating in the continuous carrier mode and require MURS operators to monitor the transmitting frequency for communications in progress before transmitting. Former Part 90 licensees authorized to operate in the continuous carrier mode prior to the creation of MURS, however, will continue to be allowed to do so in conformance with their last Part 90 authorization and any waiver grants.

This also includes:

(d) MURS users shall take reasonable precautions to avoid causing harmful interference. This includes monitoring the transmitting frequency for communications in progress and such other measures as may be necessary to minimize the potential for causing interference.

 

[talkpair]

§ 95.1317 Grandfathered MURS Stations.
Stations that were licensed under
Part 90 of the Commission’s Rules to
operate on MURS frequencies as of November
13, 2000, are granted a license
by rule that authorizes continued operations
under the terms of such nullified
part 90 authorizations, including any
rule waivers.

The way i read this...if the borough can still produce a license that expired on or after November 13, 2000, they can use whatever equipment is printed on that license.....So it's possible you could find nullified licensees using repeaters, wide band equipment, and power over 2 watts.
As far as I know, these nullified authorizations won't be in the database, since they would have all expired by now anyway.

While it's possible for a public safety agency to license on a (former) business frequency, I can't think of a reason why.

With or without a license, I can see no reason why a public service agency cannot use MURS. It's in the personal radio service, but, as the name implies 'multi use'

In either case however, they aren't granted exclusive use.

§ 95.1309 Channel use policy.
(a) The channels authorized to MURS
systems by this part are available on a
shared basis only and will not be assigned
for the exclusive use of any entity.

 

[LiberaFan08]

MURS problems in Central Ohio

The Fairfield County Ohio sheriff is using 151.820 with high power to link to their UHF repeater on 453.825, check it out. You can hear them really good in the Pataskala area. And of course Walmart has all but taken over 154.570 and 154.600 MHz.

 

[talkpair]

The Fairfield County Ohio sheriff is using 151.820 ......

I wonder how scanner laws are enforced in these areas ? (the ones that have them)

 

[KD8DVR]

The Fairfield County Ohio sheriff is using 151.820 with high power to link to their UHF repeater on 453.825, check it out. You can hear them really good in the Pataskala area. And of course Walmart has all but taken over 154.570 and 154.600 MHz.

I can hear them too sometimes in the Polaris area.... They do have a PL,

 

[kruser]

The way i read this...if the borough can still produce a license that expired on or after November 13, 2000, they can use whatever equipment is printed on that license.....So it's possible you could find nullified licensees using repeaters, wide band equipment, and power over 2 watts.
As far as I know, these nullified authorizations won't be in the database, since they would have all expired by now anyway.

The above is true. We were licensed on three MURS frequencies after the above date. We inquired the FCC about continued use and they verified the above and that we could continue operating as is with the same equipment.
We no longer use them today and only inquried as we were in the process of installing VHF and UHF repeater systems at the time this was all taking place.
I recall something they said that once a certain change was made, you then lost your grandfathered status. I don't recall what that change was but we did lose our grandfathered status I think when we notified the FCC that construction was complete on the vhf repeater. I could be wrong as that was some time back! I remember we got in trouble also as we did not notify the FCC that construction was complete. They let us off with a warning.
I may still have the letter that stated our authority to operate on the newly created MURS frequencies was now was no longer valid using our existing radios. We did not use repeaters but the radios exceeded 2 watts and some other new rule that did not allow the old radios.

 

[N4DES]

I would call the FCC directly or forward them the letter via their email. Like HOA's and cities violating the OTAR Rules, they will act accordingly as this agency has not been granted enforment reserved for the FCC.

Home | FCC.gov

 

[w4wxp]

So you are saying that Indiana law (and maybe the OP's state law) is not enforceable?

IC 35-44-3-12
Unlawful use of a police radio; exemptions; "police radio" defined
Sec. 12. (a) A person who knowingly or intentionally:
(1) possesses a police radio;
(2) transmits over a frequency assigned for police emergency purposes; or
(3) possesses or uses a police radio:
(A) while committing a crime;
(B) to further the commission of a crime; or
(C) to avoid detection by a law enforcement agency;
commits unlawful use of a police radio, a Class B misdemeanor.

I sure don't want you as my lawyer

Are you trying to say that the FCC regs don't override some local town rule? If so, you'd better look up your court cases.... From what I've heard, when you go running on the FCC's territory (and undermining their authority over anything radio wave related), it doesn't matter if you're a city govt, a electrical company or a cable provider, they'll be sending those black vans out to pay you a visit with guys who make the KGB look friendly, and if you ARE undermining their authority, you'll get your equipment confiscated or pay a nice big $50,000 fine.

 

[gewecke]

Are you trying to say that the FCC regs don't override some local town rule? If so, you'd better look up your court cases.... From what I've heard, when you go running on the FCC's territory (and undermining their authority over anything radio wave related), it doesn't matter if you're a city govt, a electrical company or a cable provider, they'll be sending those black vans out to pay you a visit with guys who make the KGB look friendly, and if you ARE undermining their authority, you'll get your equipment confiscated or pay a nice big $50,000 fine.

Fyi - They can't afford the vans anymore since our government is broke.
Now they drive dodge neons and yotas. :lol:

73,
n9zas

 

[Shawnlin20]

There are tons of agencies in the East TN area that use MURS and FRS/GMRS freqs for ops. They also use several business band freqs both VHF and UHF.

 

[roadranger]

It's my understanding that you cannot cross-band repeat to, or from MURS channels.

 

[kb0nly]

Correct... No-Crossbanding. Repeaters aren't even allowed unless of course you have grandfathered status.