My Expedition (MANY PICS-CAUTION) Part 2

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okccsi

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I have been "semi" done for a while now, and the pictures have been up on photobucket for a while. I have been slow and lazy. So here they are.










 

kirka127

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I have been waiting for the pics of the install. Glad to finally see them. Nice Job.
 

okccsi

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I own a security agency that operates mainly on the northwest side of OKC. Housing additions, apartment complexes, and some other stuff.

OKC CSI
 

W9WSS

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okccsi said:
I own a security agency that operates mainly on the northwest side of OKC. Housing additions, apartment complexes, and some other stuff. OKC CSI
Nice setup; Some of the public service agencies should be looking at your pics to improve their installs.

Do you have a seperate power switch to operate / kill 12VDC to the radios & emergency lighting equipment?

You can never have "too many" pictures; Everyone enjoys viewing them I'm certain as much as you do taking them and posting on this forum.
 

vawildbill

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Nice install, but I would really consider scraping the Glock sticker from the back window. From a liability and professional viewpoint it does nothing to help your image.

Bill
 

CommShrek

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vawildbill said:
Nice install, but I would really consider scraping the Glock sticker from the back window. From a liability and professional viewpoint it does nothing to help your image.

Bill
I too thought the same thing. Different strokes for different folks though.
 

okccsi

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K9WSS said:
Nice setup; Some of the public service agencies should be looking at your pics to improve their installs.

Do you have a seperate power switch to operate / kill 12VDC to the radios & emergency lighting equipment?

You can never have "too many" pictures; Everyone enjoys viewing them I'm certain as much as you do taking them and posting on this forum.

In the future, I might run a completely seperate switch box so that each individual item is on its own switch. For right now though, I turn each item on and off with the normal on/off knobs etc. At the time, I did have two switch boxes, but one was acting up and needed to be rebuilt. Obviously the lighting is on its own switch box.

OKC CSI
 

kjfswkr

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very nice

vawildbill said:
Nice install, but I would really consider scraping the Glock sticker from the back window. From a liability and professional viewpoint it does nothing to help your image.

Bill
but i second Bill's comments. get rid of the Glock sticker.

Kevin
 

CommShrek

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intrepid97 said:
Why does he have to get rid of the sticker? Are you guys the "Sticker Cops" ??? lol
I don't think it's got anything at all to do with that.

1: It's not very professional looking.
2: It's advertising to the criminal element "Gun Inside, break glass here"
3: God forbid he's an armed security person and he ever gets into a shoot. That Glock sticker sure isn't going to help him any in court.
4: Very unprofessional. Oh yeah, I said that already. :)
 

okccsi

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CommShrek said:
I don't think it's got anything at all to do with that.

1: It's not very professional looking.
2: It's advertising to the criminal element "Gun Inside, break glass here"
3: God forbid he's an armed security person and he ever gets into a shoot. That Glock sticker sure isn't going to help him any in court.
4: Very unprofessional. Oh yeah, I said that already. :)

1: It does look professional. Very straight, not crooked at all. Plus, there are no air bubbles or bumps underneath it. I did a good job I think.
2: The only time the gun is inside is while I am driving it. So, if said criminal wants to break into while I am driving, so be it. I don't leave my guns in the car for people to steal and go commit crimes with.
3: I forgot, brand recognition or favortism nails you in court everytime. What will the court systems say about my tattoo that say's "Protecting so that others may live in peace"? Or what will they say about the Glock hat on my back seat? Or the Glock Perfection polo hanging up in the car? While were at it, will they have a problem with the Glock I carry?
4: Don't ever look in my office then.
 

flyingwolf

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I think what they are refering to okccsi.
Is that if you ever do have to shoot some one in your line of duty, then the police and media are going to be al lover the fact that your a "gun lover" or as they wil probably say "a gun toting liberal'.
In other words, it can make you seem a bit more predestined to fire your weapon then say someone who doesnt have what sounds to a crush on glocks.
 

CommShrek

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okccsi said:
1: It does look professional. Very straight, not crooked at all. Plus, there are no air bubbles or bumps underneath it. I did a good job I think.
2: The only time the gun is inside is while I am driving it. So, if said criminal wants to break into while I am driving, so be it. I don't leave my guns in the car for people to steal and go commit crimes with.
3: I forgot, brand recognition or favortism nails you in court everytime. What will the court systems say about my tattoo that say's "Protecting so that others may live in peace"? Or what will they say about the Glock hat on my back seat? Or the Glock Perfection polo hanging up in the car? While were at it, will they have a problem with the Glock I carry?
4: Don't ever look in my office then.
I'm not here for the big argument security man. By unprofessional, I wasn't talking about the application of your sticker. The sticker in and of itself looks just fine.

What I was talking about is the "gun" sticker on a security car. How many security cars do you see with gun stickers on them? How many police cars do you see with gun stickers on them? Why not? Surely you understand what I'm talking about.

Also, the bad guys are not known for being the smartest crowd out there. They aren't going to know that there is no Glock in that car. They do know however that the chances of a gun being in that car are greater than say, another car that didn't have a "gun" type sticker on it. Do you understand what I'm talking about now?

I think you really missed the point on that last post I made. Your install looks fine, your sticker application looks fine, but it just doesn't make good sense to put a gun sticker on a security car. I hope that makes sense to you.

That's all I was trying to say before.
 

okccsi

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Ok. This is getting to be a huge drag. I am not here for an argument. My reply to your post was pure sarcasm. How you missed that, I don't know.

As for the sticker and why you don't see them on large departments or other security companies: Large departments don't want their officers doing that because then someone else puts a different type of sticker on it. Then the next guy and so on. Next thing you know, nobody looks the same. Case in point would be the Springlake division of OCPD having Lot Lizard symbols on there cars with the red circle and the line through it. They made seven officers take them off.

Security companies aren't going to let employees put stickers on company cars.

I own my own company, the vehicle is owned by me, so I am not hampered by the same constraints. Having a Glock sticker on a car is not the problem. Having anything on a car is the problem. At least for police and security. A couple of years ago a Oklahoma County Deputy was forced to remove a bumper sticker from his vehicle. It said "In case of rapture, this vehicle will be unmanned". Don't have to worry about gun-toting liberals on this one huh? He still had to remove it. It was not inline with the departments views on religious freedom and could be construed as offensive to someone who believed in a religion other than Christianity. That was the official response. The unofficial was, your car looks different than the others. I had a guy working for me that had a K&N sticker and Rokford Fosgate stickers on his vehicle. Had I a blanket police in place, I should not have hired him. Should he be made to take them off. Those type of stickers might lead a criminal to thikn that high end equipment is in this vehicle. Maybe while he is out of the car someone breaks into and steal some of my company equipment. We could go on and on. What about people with the fish emblem on their car. Should they be labeled bible-thumpers or crooks?

I understand that you view it as unprofessional, and that is the beauty of opinions. I like it, and I have spoken with others who like it...including LEO's. It will remain.

You calling me "security man" is probably the only thing I have missed the point on. At this point, I have it in my head that you are talking down to me...over a damn sticker. I am sure others will see it that way, and still others won't.

Please note: No sarcasm was included in THIS post.

OKC CSI
 

okccsi

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flyingwolf said:
I think what they are refering to okccsi.
Is that if you ever do have to shoot some one in your line of duty, then the police and media are going to be al lover the fact that your a "gun lover" or as they wil probably say "a gun toting liberal'.
In other words, it can make you seem a bit more predestined to fire your weapon then say someone who doesnt have what sounds to a crush on glocks.

Can easily be rebuffed by pointing out that in 10 years, I have not fired my weapon. However, I know at several officers (security), that have fired their weapons 2 or 3 times in the the same amount of years. I do understand the whole liberal issue, and what CAN be construed from the sticker, but I am okay with that.

OKC CSI
 

vawildbill

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I am sorry you took the post suggesting you take the sticker off the wrong way. It was in no way intended to be a a shot against you. Just something to think about. If you were to be involved in an incident where you used force against anyone justified or not, you will more than likely be sued in civil court. The lawyers will use anything they can to make you look like a gun loving manic who was just ready to come unhinged. Also take into account that most juries are not filled the brightest people around either. I am also licensed to carry, and would never wear anything with with a gun company logo or organization on it when doing so. I sure am not going to do anything to make a lawyers job easier. I guess with me it come down to CYA.

Bill
 

okccsi

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vawildbill said:
I am sorry you took the post suggesting you take the sticker off the wrong way. It was in no way intended to be a a shot against you. Just something to think about. If you were to be involved in an incident where you used force against anyone justified or not, you will more than likely be sued in civil court. The lawyers will use anything they can to make you look like a gun loving manic who was just ready to come unhinged. Also take into account that most juries are not filled the brightest people around either. I am also licensed to carry, and would never wear anything with with a gun company logo or organization on it when doing so. I sure am not going to do anything to make a lawyers job easier. I guess with me it come down to CYA.

Bill
Once again, I can understand that point. Let me explain why I don't care.

I had an officer sitting at a property doing his reports and his job. He hears some screams and looks to the north through the parking lot and sees headlights and a woman being hit by a truck. He approaches, lemergency lights on, in full uniform with a marked vehicle. During this time, the driver of the truck hits the woman two more times. My officer attempted to stop the driver by turning off the ignition of the truck. At not time did he try and drag him out. the driver got out and immediately started hitting my officer. his mace was knocked away in the scuffle and the guy would not retreat. He drew his weapon, and ordered him to backoff 6 different times. The guy just laughed and continued to come out him kicking and throwing punches. He was told repeatedly, but did not care. my officer pulled the trigger but at the very last second pointed the gun down. We could debate the merits of that, but that is what he did.

The police officer that showed up is NOT in anyway friendly to security. he leaves lineup everynight looking for the next one to put in jail. he has been transferred from divisions before because of his actions against security officers. In front of several witnesses, the person driving the truck was allowed to carry his girlfriend up the stairs, because she could not walk. he then arrested my employee and took him to jail for assault & battery and illegal discharge of a firearm within city limits.

One month later I get sued in civil court for mental anguish, deflamation of character, and assault. One year later and about $10k less the attorney for the plaintiff withdrew as counsel of record because their star witness totally destroyed her in depositions.

Oh yeah, less than one week later, the D.A. declined to file charges, because they could find nothing wrong and C.L.E.E.T. says it never happened as far as they are concerned.

Yeah, there is a bunch of other stuff in there that would make you laugh and make you wonder how someone people could be allowed to reproduce. But that is the short version and it would take several hours of typing to get it all on here.

My point in regards to your post is this: No Glock sticker was involved in this incident, stupid people will be stupid people. As long as I have been in this business, I already know better. A sticker is not going to mean crap. People out there sue for anything.

Instead of using those annoying warning stickers on vehicle's we once used windshield markers like the dealerships use. The guy brought a lawsuit against the company because he had to use a razor blade to get it off and it scratched his windshield. No sticker involved here.

My ex-partner arrested a guy that was intoxicated and swimming nude in one of our complex pools. On top of this he was trespassing. He decided to fight and ended up getting sprayed. Guess what, he sued...or tried too.

My ex-partner and I tried to stop a guy that was beating his wife and had already dropped their baby on a sidewalk. The guy got his hands on my gun and was starting to get it out when his ass kicking started. And he got it kicked good. He tried suing as well.

I could go on and on with these incidents. Not a single one of them involved a sticker on my vehicle. This is a sue happy f*%#ing state. It is almost enough to make you NOT want to get into this business. I am not telling anyone here that they don't know what they are talking about because several in here have given me insight on a lot of issues I deal with daily. However, I do feel as if attitudes would change if YOU were on the receiving end of all this **** that I get hit with as a business owner. You would realize that having 10 different stickers about how gun control means hitting you target would not make a difference.

When you talk about CYA, you have to go on the pro-active side. Not having a sticker to maybe keep someone from thinking you are a gun-toting liberal is not pro-active. That is defensive.

Having received accredited training in weapons retention, low-light shooting techniques, advanced shooting techniques, Use of Force certification (handcuffs, baton, spray, tazer), interviews & interrogations, workplace violence, hate crime recognition, gang recognition, etc... is what CYA is about. I know roughly two hundred security officers here in OKC and the surrounding areas. I know almost ALL of the agency owners as well. I also know the regional supervisors for the biggest company out there. I can ensure you that what gets there ass in court more than anything else is lack of training. There officers receive the state minimum and then go to work with no clue about any of this other stuff. They do something that makes someone want to sue them and they look like a fool in court because they don't know what the Use of Force Continuim is. The lawyer tears them apart in court because they shot their client at 3 in the morning in low light conditions yet they received their training on a bright shooting range. Believe me when I tell you that knowledge is power in this business and that if someone takes me to court I am prepared. I make my employees get the same training that I have. They pay upfront, but after a pre-determined amount of time with my company, they get reimbursed. I have seen countless security officers get destroyed because they shot a guy that was shooting other people or the guy pointed a gun at them. Or they got sprayed or handcuffed wrong and ended up with nerve damage. It drives me crazy listening to how people get screwed everyday. Oklahoma is 5th in the nation for quality of security officer training, yet it needs to be more. CLEET finally made it mandatory for continuing education to keep your license. I have had to do it for a while now because I have the P.I. license as well.

I am sorry. I need to stop because I am going to extremely pissed at people that sue all the time and stupid *******s out walking the street, and the lack of training companies give their employees. Not mad at anyone here though. This place is about learning, and I hope someone walks away from this thread with an understanding of how hard it is out there with or WITHOUT a sticker promoting a certain type of gun. I do everything I can to beg CLEET to add certain training into the state program, but it is the legislators that I have to deal with. I am working on that end of it now.

To everyone here, I understand completely what you have said about the sticker. I also understand that not one single person can post pictures of their setup without a negative comment about something they should do being thrown in. I want everyone to know that I don't care about the sticker because it is not what is ultimately going to be my downfall in court. This I know to be very true.

Thank you

OKC CSI
 
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