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Narrowbanding on Vertex damaging radios?

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mancow

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What's the deal with the Compander menu? It shows that it's capable but I could never get it to actually work?

I'm referring to the VX4000.

I've narrowbanded a 1 VX4000, 4 VX424's,1 VX354, 2 VX550's, 16 VX824's, and 1 VX3200, and have had no issues from any of them.
 

m-gerty

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Update #2.. Reprogrammed from narrow to wide band and the radio still doesn't pick up anything unless I'm holding it . I can key up and hit the repeater 10 miles away, makes me think the antenna is ok..
 

m-gerty

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Finally heard back from Vertex. The radio is 6 months out of warranty and they want a flat fee of $100 to repair it. Since like the radio and the features, I told them to go ahead and fix it.. My local dealer tried to get Vertex to sell me a new radio, minus antenna, battery and charger,( since I already had all of that) and they said they don't do that anymore.
As to what happened to my original radio, they just reported it as "inoperative ".
 

jim202

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Finally heard back from Vertex. The radio is 6 months out of warranty and they want a flat fee of $100 to repair it. Since like the radio and the features, I told them to go ahead and fix it.. My local dealer tried to get Vertex to sell me a new radio, minus antenna, battery and charger,( since I already had all of that) and they said they don't do that anymore.
As to what happened to my original radio, they just reported it as "inoperative ".

Well how do you like the new management style now that Motorola is holding the steering wheel at Vertex?

Now you are getting to see how many of Motorola customers are treated. The migration has started to go to other vendor products because of treatments like this. Even large public safety customers have had enough and going to the competition.
 

m-gerty

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Well how do you like the new management style now that Motorola is holding the steering wheel at Vertex?

Now you are getting to see how many of Motorola customers are treated. The migration has started to go to other vendor products because of treatments like this. Even large public safety customers have had enough and going to the competition.
I know exactly what you mean. Even the software will be different from my "old" radio to the "new" one, even though they are going to be the same model (354). I've been told that the newer ones have a window that states "this radio must be programmed for narrow band" and the old software doesn't have a way to get past this window.
I' ve handled a few Wouxuns, Boefung (sp?) and TYTs and I believe if the big /\/\ doesn't get their ducks in a row and become more user friendly they're gonna feel the crunch.
I don't think they treat their customers very well, and it's not uncommon to hear that someone has "bricked " their radio. Why would any business make software that would do that?
//Rant off
 

PACNWDude

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Vertex radios not working after narrow banding.

There is a Vertex Standard "Technical Bulletin" # 201206-04 that discusses this.
Taken from a copy of this bulletin:

"Model Number
VX-160, VX-231, VX-351/354, VX-2100/2200
Symptom
Poor receive sensitivity
Description
The problem occurred when the below listed batch of filters was exposed to humid environments for an extended period of time. Phosphorus and Silver buildups would occur and cause insufficient isolation. The problem seemed to be far more exacerbated in Latin America than in North America.
The ceramic filter failure issue has been exhibited in serial number date codes from June 2006 and lasted through June, 2009. This is represented in serial numbers that begin with 6H through those that begin with 9H. It was the belief of Tokyo engineering QA teams that they can confirm the elimination of the issue by July 2009, or serial numbers beginning with 9I. VX-231 did not start until 8H, so they are limited in the number of failures that occurred."

I have also seen problems with the Vertex VX-4200 series of radios that is caused by this as well.

The fix is to replace (in the VX-4200's) CF1001 and CF1002 with new filters LTM450EW and LTM450GW respectively.
I have had lots of problems with customer service from the Big ^^ as well since they took over Vertex. My solution, buy from Harris.
 

VK4FNAA

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if filters

The if filters are failing due to poor quality control methods of the if filter makers .These were used in not only vertex but other radios as well.Motorola are replacing the if filters if they are under warranty .We have sent in the last year ,5-10 radios back to have them repaired due to poor reception ..If they are outside then it was around 100-150 to get them replaced and i havent seen any of the repairs back for service so they must do a good job.My radios and the customers have both programmed with narrow and wide and from what i have found out they replace both filters when they come in to be repaired.thanks ian http://s.radioreference.com/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif
 

03msc

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There is a Vertex Standard "Technical Bulletin" # 201206-04 that discusses this.
Taken from a copy of this bulletin:

"Model Number
VX-160, VX-231, VX-351/354, VX-2100/2200
Symptom
Poor receive sensitivity
Description
The problem occurred when the below listed batch of filters was exposed to humid environments for an extended period of time. Phosphorus and Silver buildups would occur and cause insufficient isolation. The problem seemed to be far more exacerbated in Latin America than in North America.
The ceramic filter failure issue has been exhibited in serial number date codes from June 2006 and lasted through June, 2009. This is represented in serial numbers that begin with 6H through those that begin with 9H. It was the belief of Tokyo engineering QA teams that they can confirm the elimination of the issue by July 2009, or serial numbers beginning with 9I. VX-231 did not start until 8H, so they are limited in the number of failures that occurred."

I have also seen problems with the Vertex VX-4200 series of radios that is caused by this as well.

The fix is to replace (in the VX-4200's) CF1001 and CF1002 with new filters LTM450EW and LTM450GW respectively.
I have had lots of problems with customer service from the Big ^^ as well since they took over Vertex. My solution, buy from Harris.
The if filters are failing due to poor quality control methods of the if filter makers .These were used in not only vertex but other radios as well.Motorola are replacing the if filters if they are under warranty .We have sent in the last year ,5-10 radios back to have them repaired due to poor reception ..If they are outside then it was around 100-150 to get them replaced and i havent seen any of the repairs back for service so they must do a good job.My radios and the customers have both programmed with narrow and wide and from what i have found out they replace both filters when they come in to be repaired.thanks ian http://s.radioreference.com/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif
My VX-354-AG8B-5 has a serial of 1GXXXXXX so what year does that mean it was made? If 6H and 9H are 2006 and 2009...mine wasn't 2001 so 2011? Or does that even correlate?

All that to say I guess that means mine isn't covered under the TB correct?

At least VS decided to do the repairs for free for those radios affected - that says something good about the company, at least in my opinion.
 

PACNWDude

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Vertex filter failure bulletin.

Vertex may be mad at me for posting this, but here it is. I do not know how the date codes are for your radio. And they have not admitted to VX-4200's failing. But replacing these filters fixes the VX-4200's that we have with the same problem.

Vertex/Motorola are losing my dollar every time something like this happens. So I am voting with my and companies money on Harris. Only buying Motorola for patching over our Telex consoles for interoperability.
 

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Eric89

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Burrillville, Rhode Island
my vx230 (vhf) will work on some repeaters but not all of them, i have 4 duplex freq set up in it, it can hit 2 of them but have noticed that the other 2 that i had in them just stopped working alltogether. (which they worked in the past) I have even checked on my scanner and i am not even hitting the tower whatsoever.
 

cmdrwill

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So Cali
Many other brand mobile radios use much the same IF filters, and the same problems with filter failure are common.
 

jeatock

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Reviving an old thread

I'm bringing this common problem back up since I had ANOTHER 7-year-old radio on my bench this week that would work dandy in wide but became deaf as a post in narrow.

Switching from wide to narrow sends signals down a different internal path, where is encounters a failed component and dies. The component may have failed years ago but no one noticed because it wasn't in use. Or in the case I worked on this week, the radio worked dandy for a few years then failed. Easy way to tell without opening the case is to reprogram in wide and see if the problem goes away.

VX is not the only company with this issue.
 

12dbsinad

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I'm bringing this common problem back up since I had ANOTHER 7-year-old radio on my bench this week that would work dandy in wide but became deaf as a post in narrow.

Switching from wide to narrow sends signals down a different internal path, where is encounters a failed component and dies. The component may have failed years ago but no one noticed because it wasn't in use. Or in the case I worked on this week, the radio worked dandy for a few years then failed. Easy way to tell without opening the case is to reprogram in wide and see if the problem goes away.

VX is not the only company with this issue.
Yep, I've seen boat loads of these failures from numerous brands. Makes you wonder how many radios are trashed because they are "dead" , and all along it's just this cheap oh-so-common filter.

Then again, most shops around me don't do any component repair or troubleshooting whatsoever. Nobody knows how to do that anymore, send to the depot it is.
 

m-gerty

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Miiddle TN
I'm bringing this common problem back up since I had ANOTHER 7-year-old radio on my bench this week that would work dandy in wide but became deaf as a post in narrow.

Switching from wide to narrow sends signals down a different internal path, where is encounters a failed component and dies. The component may have failed years ago but no one noticed because it wasn't in use. Or in the case I worked on this week, the radio worked dandy for a few years then failed. Easy way to tell without opening the case is to reprogram in wide and see if the problem goes away.

VX is not the only company with this issue.
I have a VX3200 now that I removed from service 2-3 years ago. Tried what you said about changing back to wide band and it works...
What's involved in repairing this? Where can I get parts, is it a kit of several filters?
I'm a electronics tech, not a radio tech so I can change (hopefully ) parts out ..just don't know which ones..
 
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