Need help PRO-164 will not trunk

[StoliRaz]

I have a PRO-164 and a GRE PSR-300. They're identical radios and use the same programming software (ARC300) I've noticed whenever I use my 300 I get the MA state police flawlessly. However, whenever I use the PRO-164 I never get a single transmission from it. So I tried to clone my 300's info into my 164, with ARC300 being the middle man. For some reason, the 164 is not recognizing the control channels. They have the exact same frequencies and settings, however the 164 isn't trunking. Come to think of it, I haven't seen the little "T" in the top line of the display in a long, long time on the 164.

They're sitting side by side right now, in manual mode on the same active control channel for the MA state police. The PSR saying MOT: Control 99% on the bottom line. The 164 says MOT: none. Sometimes a random number such as 26986 or something pops up for a second, but I'm getting nothing on this system.

I figured with the same program file on both radios they'd work exactly the same like they're suppose to. What gives? I'm boggled.

 

[kf5qgf]

Is the pro 164 attentuated and the psr isn't? Is the bank set to MOT?

 

[StoliRaz]

Yes, the bank is set to MOT

Neither scanner is attenuated.

The 300 works fine, but the 164 doesn't recognize the control channel. Not sure why it is doing this. The 300 works all day long. I can't even get 1 hit on the 164. I've tried wiping it clean and reloading too. Didn't work. I'm really bashing my head on the wall with this one.

 

[kf5qgf]

Only one trunking system in your selected bank?

 

[StoliRaz]

Only one trunking system in your selected bank?

Yes, it's the only thing programmed in the entire bank. I just updated my firmware a moment ago, doesn't seem to have fixed anything unfortunately It's a regular old Motorola system, conventional frequencies only. All the same channels work fine in the 300.

EDIT- if I turn down the squelch I do get the trunking "machine gun" sound, but it doesn't read "CONTROL 99%" it just says "MOT:none"

I don't get the little "T" at the top of the screen either when scanning. Not really sure what to make of this.

It does get conventional frequencies just fine though.

EDIT #2-

This looks a little more promising! Not sure why but I did a manual search to see if I picked up any "control channel sounding" frequencies around the 860. area. I picked one up and put it in my MA state police bank. Sure enough, it's trunking and picking up conversations.The trunking "T" is lit up now too as I scan. It sounds a million miles away so it's probably Worcester or Cape Cod or something but at least it works...I'm starting to think this may be a rebanding issue or some other issue with their system? Not really sure what's going on but at least I picked SOMETHING up...

 

[kf5qgf]

Hmm I would still think it would display the control settings? I'm fortunate that we haven't rebanded in my county, but i've updated to firmware 1.10 in preparation... keep me posted, i wish i was on that side of the country and i'd try lol. this however is why i haven't bought a home patrol, it's the puzzle of it all i like the most, the listening is fun, but i like the puzzle more

 

[hiegtx]

Yes, it's the only thing programmed in the entire bank. I just updated my firmware a moment ago, doesn't seem to have fixed anything unfortunately It's a regular old Motorola system, conventional frequencies only. All the same channels work fine in the 300.

EDIT- if I turn down the squelch I do get the trunking "machine gun" sound, but it doesn't read "CONTROL 99%" it just says "MOT:none"

I don't get the little "T" at the top of the screen either when scanning. Not really sure what to make of this.

It does get conventional frequencies just fine though.

EDIT #2-

This looks a little more promising! Not sure why but I did a manual search to see if I picked up any "control channel sounding" frequencies around the 860. area. I picked one up and put it in my MA state police bank. Sure enough, it's trunking and picking up conversations.The trunking "T" is lit up now too as I scan. It sounds a million miles away so it's probably Worcester or Cape Cod or something but at least it works...I'm starting to think this may be a rebanding issue or some other issue with their system? Not really sure what's going on but at least I picked SOMETHING up...

StoliRaz,

Which site are you trying to monitor? It's this system, am I correct? And by "conventional frequencies only", you really mean that it's not a digital system, right?

One possibility is that if the site you are trying to monitor has been rebanded, your Pro-164 might have needed the firmware update in order to monitor that site. The PSR-300, depending on when it was manufactured, or whether it has been updated, might already have the correct firmware for a rebanded system. The most current firmware for the 164 is 1.08. To verify the current firmware version of your scanner, turn on the radio. When viewing the welcome screen press 3.

Since you have just now updated the firmware, try reloading the programming, either from the software, or by cloning, If you loaded it (or cloned it) before the firmware update, then the scanner did not use or save the custom tables needed for rebanding.

 

[DickH]

If the system has been re-banded and there are any 851 to 854 MHz freqs. that have a zero in the 4th decimal place (like 851.0250), then you need to enter custom band plans. That has to be done using a software program.

 

[StoliRaz]

Thanks!

StoliRaz,

Which site are you trying to monitor? It's this system, am I correct? And by "conventional frequencies only", you really mean that it's not a digital system, right?

One possibility is that if the site you are trying to monitor has been rebanded, your Pro-164 might have needed the firmware update in order to monitor that site. The PSR-300, depending on when it was manufactured, or whether it has been updated, might already have the correct firmware for a rebanded system. The most current firmware for the 164 is 1.08. To verify the current firmware version of your scanner, turn on the radio. When viewing the welcome screen press 3.

Since you have just now updated the firmware, try reloading the programming, either from the software, or by cloning, If you loaded it (or cloned it) before the firmware update, then the scanner did not use or save the custom tables needed for rebanding.

Yes, that's the system and yes, analog frequencies not digital that's correct.

I updated to firmware version 1.10 today from Radioshack's website. Next time I get a chance I'll try to wipe it and reinstall once again. I didn't think of doing that. Thanks for the reply, I'll let you know how it goes.

The MA state police system has had "some" rebanding done. What has been rebanded, I have no clue, I can't tell by looking at it. I'm mainly intrested in the Boston (suffolk), Bristol and Plymouth county areas of the system.

 

[StoliRaz]

If the system has been re-banded and there are any 851 to 854 MHz freqs. that have a zero in the 4th decimal place (like 851.0250), then you need to enter custom band plans. That has to be done using a software program.

All the freqs (the ones I have programmed, anyway) seem to be in the 856. - 868. range. Lots around 859 and 860.. Not sure if they would be affected?

 

[DickH]

All the freqs (the ones I have programmed, anyway) seem to be in the 856. - 868. range. Lots around 859 and 860.. Not sure if they would be affected?

You only need the control channels programmed. There are a maximum of 4 per site.
Re-banding means any freqs. in the 866 to 868 range must be changed to the 851-853 range.
When those are changed if any of them have a zero in the 4th decimal place your scanner will not follow them. I explained this before.

 

[StoliRaz]

The control channel I'm trying to tune into is 860.9875 (Boston simulcast) on the MA state police trunk. It comes in clear on my PSR-300 yet at the same time doesn't register as a control channel on the 164. This actually can't be a rebanding issue if that's the case, right? Still confuzzled..thank you all for your help thus far, I really appreciate it!

 

[DickH]

The control channel I'm trying to tune into is 860.9875 (Boston simulcast) on the MA state police trunk. It comes in clear on my PSR-300 yet at the same time doesn't register as a control channel on the 164. This actually can't be a rebanding issue if that's the case, right? Still confuzzled..thank you all for your help thus far, I really appreciate it!

You don't "tune into" a control channel. A control channel sends a stream of data, so you only hear a strong buss. You need to enter ALL the control channels for the site you want. The Boston Simulcast site has only 2 control channels listed in the database, 860.9625 and 860.9875.

 

[StoliRaz]

You don't "tune into" a control channel. A control channel sends a stream of data, so you only hear a strong buss. You need to enter ALL the control channels for the site you want. The Boston Simulcast site has only 2 control channels listed in the database, 860.9625 and 860.9875.

My apologies, I do have both control channels entered as listed, and all control channels (primary and alternate) as listed in the database. I was only listing the active control channels by the "machine gun" noise that I'm getting. I should have been clear in my original post.

I've been using scanners for 15 or 17 years, I've never had a problem like this before. Starting to worry that something isn't working right in my 164. Figures too since it's out of warranty.

 

[StoliRaz]

Well I think I've come to the conclusion that my PRO-164 is fried. Something inside of it won't let it scan trunked systems. My PSR-300, PSR-400 base and even my ancient PRO-433 base (which isn't rebanding friendly, btw) all still receive MSP without a problem. At this point I've wiped it 4-5 times, manually entered in the freqs for MSP AND a different trunk system in another bank. Neither bank will trunk normally if at all. It has to be out of warranty, too. Ugh.

On the plus side....this thing really pulls in the aircraft and weather bands! LOL I can still get conventional frequencies fine, and there are tons of those in my area. If I remember right I bought this scanner from RS at a Christmas or Black Friday sale in where it was only around $85. That's less than a lot of non-trunking scanners sell for so I'm still ahead of the game there, and have other scanners that trunk perfectly. I suppose I could always sell it on Ebay as is and get most of my money back too.

Anyways, thanks for the help to everyone who replied. I'm glad to have a place where people who are into scanning offer free advice.

 

[KF7OQQ]

I have a friend that the same thing happen too. He has 2 164 one quit trunking and the other works fine. Haven't been able to get the one working even after cloning it. By the way we are rebanded here in Utah and the 164 works great even with 0 in the 4 position. The Pro 97 don't work here anymore.

EDIT sorry reread the post and relized my bad. didn't read it all the way yes you have to use custom band plans on the 164. If you don't have a 0 in the 4 spot i have heard you can get a 97 to work on reband if you have a program.

 

[DickH]

... i have heard you can get a 97 to work on reband if you have a program.

You heard incorrectly. A PRO-97 will work perfectly if all the freqs. in a site have a 5 in the 4th decimal place. No program needed.
And, if there are 10 freqs. and one of them has a zero in the 4th decimal place, it will still work, but you will get only 90% of the traffic - theoretically.

 

[StoliRaz]

I have a friend that the same thing happen too. He has 2 164 one quit trunking and the other works fine. Haven't been able to get the one working even after cloning it. By the way we are rebanded here in Utah and the 164 works great even with 0 in the 4 position. The Pro 97 don't work here anymore.

EDIT sorry reread the post and relized my bad. didn't read it all the way yes you have to use custom band plans on the 164. If you don't have a 0 in the 4 spot i have heard you can get a 97 to work on reband if you have a program.

Yeah, the more I've researched my problem the more I keep seeing other people who have had the same problem and ended up returning it or having to live with it. I remember when I got it, it worked flawlessly and I was thinking great, I can keep some wear and tear off my PSR-300 by using the RS when I'm out and about. A nice cheap alternative. It's really a shame the build quality of the 300 was lost in the translation to the RS model. I've always felt that the buttons on the RS model needed a firmer push to get them to work than on the 300 as well. The static when adjusting the volume during a transmission is much more notable, too. For the price though, it was worth it.

I guess I'll keep trying to play with it and see what happens. I might try to wait until all of this rebanding crap is done (who knows when that'll be) and play with it some more or if I can figure out what custom table setup will work. If it works, great. If it doesn't, oh well. I'm just glad there's a whole lot of analog conventional activity in my area to play with, and it still does a great job with that. I liken it to my BC95XLT at this point, which doesn't trunk but is a great little scanner.