Need TX DPS radio help (restoration of 90’s equipment)

[TXDPSCJ]

Hi All,

New here, nice site! I’m not new to forums etc. I am on quite a few automotive forums (some as long as over 25yrs now) and came across this site while trying to search out information I need for a restoration project I’m working on. I was not sure if this would be better posted in the Motorola sub-forum on here, or this Texas sub-forum. So I posted here because my quest is “Texas” related and thought this audience may have better insight. I’m restoring a DPS patrol car to period correct as it was in-service. I need help with the Motorola Syntor system if anyone knows about what they used back in the 90’s or can assist with pointing me in the right direction. I’m also a member over on elightbars, but there is not a lot of activity there.

I had sent an email to TX Fleet Services but didn’t get much help since they don’t have any records left from the period due to record retention policies.

Here is what I know:
- in the 90’s TX used the Motorola Syntor system; it was the VHF version
- front Motorola control head (A9 or W9?) controlled the siren and was also the “radio”
- in the trunk there was the Motorola radio “brick” and the siren brick

What I need help with is I need to find the period correct:
- Motorola Syntor radio brick
- Motorola Siren brick
- correct cables for control head, radio brick, and siren brick

I know these components are on eBay and other sites, but I don’t want to just buy blindly (and end goal is to get the equipment to function). I’ve tried going through the info on “repeater-builder” site and even looking through old Motorola pdf manuals. The problem is, I really do not know exactly what bricks go with each other or how to tie them all together because there are so many varying Part #’s and types out there…. There also seems to be varying names of the system over the years such as Motorola Systems 9000, Motorola Syntor, Motorola Spectra, Motorola Spectra/Astro and Motorola Astro (product labeling is what I’m seeing on the components).

I also cannot seem to find images of or any info on mapping and connecting everything:
- How does the Motorola Siren brick get integrated or connected with the Control head and the Syntor radio brick??
- Is there another module that is to go between the Syntor Radio brick and the Siren brick?

Can anyone please help and maybe provide some pics, or a diagram of how the units all go together or even some Motorola part numbers as to what I need for the components and cabling?

Thanks for taking the time to read and any support/guidance.

 

[Project25_MASTR]

What year is the cruiser you are restoring and what operational period are you wanting to show?

The 90's would've had the Syntor or Spectra in use using the System 9000's A9 control head. Mid 90's would have even seen the switch to the Astro Spectra with the W9 head which DPS would continue to use until the early 2010's.

 

[rattlerbb01]

I actually had one many years ago, brick, control head and all, VHF analog only. It was in my truck when I was a volunteer. That thing could bump our repeater in Navasota from Galveston.

 

[Project25_MASTR]

I actually talked with someone at DPS earlier today. They made the jump from the X9000 to the Astro Spectra (skipping the Spectra) in the late 90's and then to the XTL5000 in the mid-2000's. All with the A9/W9 head though.

 

[Unitrunker2]

I think the hard part is finding a programming cable - possibly a RIB box - and software - and a host PC slow / old enough to run it.

Another issue is RF exposure. Assuming your vehicle is a sedan, the safest place is roof mounted. A rear trunk mounted anntenna will blast the occupants with RF through the back window - which might exceed modern mandated limits. For part 97, there's a form you are supposed to fill out and have available showing your estimate of the exposure.

That said, cool project! Let us know how it goes.

 

[Jimbnks]

I would love to see photo's of the project.

 

[TXDPSCJ]

Hi all,

Just getting back here to read responses.

Wow, appreciate the responses - thanks in advance!

Ok, it’s a 1993 Mustang patrol unit. It was a Trooper vehicle and from what I know, it was assigned to Region 6, Limestone County area with its duty station being Mexia.

The car is being restored back to how it was in-service in 1993. Currently it’s configured like the 87-90 “slicktops” which is was the prior owner did, but my goal is the 93 in-service look since it’s a 93. It has all of the correct functional front/rear red/blue lights, functional switch box to activate the lights. It originally had the S80 MPH radar system when I received it, but that is incorrect for 93, so I sold off that system and procured the correct Decatur radar system used in 93 which is functional too. Research shows BEE radar units or Decatur for 93, but one historical in-service image I’m using as my reference has a definite Decatur system in it.

I also procured the correct NOS roof top Code 3 (10-head) ArrowStik and matching NOS Code 3 controller for it. I’m still looking for the correct 1993 Jetsonic.loghtbar. Once I have the Jetsonic, the 87-90 red/blue lights will be removed.

So my quest is also to get the period correct Motorola pieces. When I got the car the prior owner just threw in a Motorola control head (it’s the brown unit and I think an A9 head). However its front button configuration is incorrect. There was also the Motorola mic. Those were installed under the switch box at the dash (and improperly) and aren’t functional at all. So I’ve since gathered the correct brackets to reinstall the switch box and a Motorola head correctly, etc.

So here I am seeking the help with the Motorola radio parts.

This image attached is the style of control head (A9?) I’ve seen in images for the TX units back then. But from there to the radio brick and siren brick - that’s where I’m lost…

Oh, I also procured the correct NOS Decibel Products DB702 VHF whip antenna w/cable too that they used in 1993, so I have that piece too.

So I’m ready and listening for you guidance.

 

[northstarfire0693]

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[KevinC]

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[TXDPSCJ]

I actually talked with someone at DPS earlier today. They made the jump from the X9000 to the Astro Spectra (skipping the Spectra) in the late 90's and then to the XTL5000 in the mid-2000's. All with the A9/W9 head though.

@Project25_MASTR

Thanks for your reply. Here’s where I am stuck…

Would this be the proper period correct radio brick:

Motorola Spectra 2 Way Mobile Radio Remote Base Unit TA9FW+078W | eBay

Condition: USED - Key not included.

www.ebay.com

or would it be this type:

Motorola Syntor XX9000 Two Way Radio Base Unit T99KX+07W | eBay

Does not include any accessories, cords or cables not shown in pictures.

www.ebay.com

Also, the Motorola siren “bricks”, they all look exactly the same visually and physically…however, they have different part numbers with the last 1 or 2 digits being the only digit that changes. Are all of these sirens the same, but just had slight internal board revisions over the years? This is what I’m referencing:

Motorola Spectra Astro Radio HLN1439G Systems Siren + Cable Spectra HKN4363C | eBay

Motorola Spectra Astro Radio HLN1439G Systems Siren + Cable Spectra HKN4363C

www.ebay.com

I also see some of those siren bricks that have either “Systems 9000” or the “Astro/Spectra” labeling on the front of the unit. Does it matter from a functional perspective or not, or did Motorola just change the labeling? This is why I was asking the above question about the siren part numbers.

As everyone can imagine, this is why I’m having such a difficult time trying to find the right period correct modules and I’m not versed in what goes together or what is compatible or not. I just don’t want to purchase the incorrect parts.

For my restoration I need the system that TX was using during the 1990-1993 period and definitely want it to be exact or as close to exact for period correctness.

Thanks again to everyone for your knowledge, guidance, tips, and support, appreciate it!!

 

[Project25_MASTR]

For 100% correct you will want the System's 9000 radio and siren module. The Spectra labled one I'm not sure will work with the X9000 but the Astro one will only work with Astro Spectra and XTL (I use the Astro module on a POV with an XTL5000).

 

[Unitrunker2]

I have a Syntor X9000 "suitcase" radio. No head, siren box, or cables. Model is T72KEJ7J04AK (believd to be 150-174 MHz 50-100 watt 32 channel). No idea which Texas agency had it originally. I have no idea if it works - and no way to test. If you read through this, you'll know as much as I do.

Motorola Syntor, Syntor X, Syntor X9000, MCX and Mostar Introductory Information

Syntor X9000

Mike Blenderman's website "onfreq" (everyone links to his site) is offline but you can view it through archive.org.

Motorola SYNTOR, SYNTOR X, SYNTOR X 9000, SYNTOR X 9000E and SPECTRA Mobile Radio Information

This deep rabbit hole runs deep.

As you probably have found, cables are the hardest to come by, followed by siren box and control heads. The base units are relatively easy to find.

 

[TXDPSCJ]

For 100% correct you will want the System's 9000 radio and siren module. The Spectra labled one I'm not sure will work with the X9000 but the Astro one will only work with Astro Spectra and XTL (I use the Astro module on a POV with an XTL5000).

Thank you for the reply.

Ok, got it on the radio brick, thanks for confirming.

As for the siren brick…. Ok, got it you’re saying “Systems 9000”. Is that in reference to the front Motorola label on the unit, or what is seen on the bottom of some? For instance, I see some on eBay where the front label may say “Systems 9000” and on the bottom it will also have an additional label stating “Systems 9000”. On some other siren units, I’m also seeing “Astro Spectra” on the front label, but on the bottom of the unit it will still say ”Systems 9000”. Is that 2nd example still compatible with the Systems 9000 (Syntor) radio brick?

 

[TXDPSCJ]

I have a Syntor X9000 "suitcase" radio. No head, siren box, or cables. Model is T72KEJ7J04AK (believd to be 150-174 MHz 50-100 watt 32 channel). No idea which Texas agency had it originally. I have no idea if it works - and no way to test. If you read through this, you'll know as much as I do.

Motorola Syntor, Syntor X, Syntor X9000, MCX and Mostar Introductory Information

Syntor X9000

Mike Blenderman's website "onfreq" (everyone links to his site) is offline but you can view it through archive.org.

Motorola SYNTOR, SYNTOR X, SYNTOR X 9000, SYNTOR X 9000E and SPECTRA Mobile Radio Information

This deep rabbit hole runs deep.

As you probably have found, cables are the hardest to come by, followed by siren box and control heads. The base units are relatively easy to find.

Thank you for your reply.

So you have a TX Syntor 9000 radio brick? Nice! Does it have the TX asset label still on it?

Thank you for the link to Mike B’s site “onfreq”! While hitting links on the repeater-builder site I did see his site was referenced and linked to quite often, but of course all links are broken as you stated because the original site is offline. I did not know there was a way to get to the onfreq archived site.

Yea, I’ve been hitting up the repeater-builder site you linked but like I said, I’m getting hung up on how the units are or are not compatible with each other as it seems there are quite a few versions of the systems out there.

The cables -
I’ve seen a lot of them on eBay that are the cables that go between the radio and siren bricks and radio control head too. I have not compared cables to cables yet or researched deeper only because I’m trying to focus on getting the correct radio brick and siren brick first. I also have seen where programming cables are needed and also read where to program these older units the user needs an old PC like a 386 to do any type of programming. I’m not even “there” yet but at some stage I’ll have to learn how to do it. I think there were (3) programming cables needed.

 

[KevinC]

I was debating whether or not to post this as I didn’t want to be one of those old timers that always posts about “ back when” but here goes…

In 92 or 93 a small agency with way too much money got 5 brand new Mustangs and brought them to our shop to have everything installed. They wanted them just like DPS Mustangs. Only problem was they didn’t have the same radio or lights or siren or switch box. I did the best I could.

In less than a year they had totaled all of them in pursuits.

 

[Unitrunker2]

I’ve seen a lot of them on eBay that are the cables that go between the radio and siren bricks and radio control head too. I have not compared cables to cables yet or researched deeper only because I’m trying to focus on getting the correct radio brick and siren brick first. I also have seen where programming cables are needed and also read where to program these older units the user needs an old PC like a 386 to do any type of programming. I’m not even “there” yet but at some stage I’ll have to learn how to do it. I think there were (3) programming cables needed.

If you can, pick a complete radio + cable + head. off ebay. Either it works and you keep it or it doesn't and you sent it back. You will likely lose the cost of return shipping. Buying piecemeal is risky because - until you have at least brick, power cable, remote head, and remote head cable - you can't really tell if it works. And if it does not work - which component(s) are to blame?

Have your test plan set out in advance of taking posession of the radio so you can quickly determine if it is good. Power it up and see if if transmits through a watt meter into a dummy load. Whatever transmit frequenies you find become clues as to what receive frequencies are likely programmed into the radio. To test receive, you'll need a signal generator. In a pinch, you can program a handheld to the appropriate frequency, mode the dummy load to the handhand, and transmit. At very small distances, there's enough RF leakage to test recieve on your Syntor. I'm assuming you won't have a license to transmit. If you can, get the programmed frequencies from the seller (many have no clue). That will help with your testing.

I prefer the XTL models for part 97 use (APX are still too expensive). I ended up with the Syntor and some suitcase style Spectras when buying a surplus XTL (console unit in the beige plastic case with a smoked power supply). Eventually I'd like to get one of the Spectra's working but I have working radios now so it's a low priority goal.

 

[Unitrunker2]

So you have a TX Syntor 9000 radio brick? Nice! Does it have the TX asset label still on it?

I like how you think in terms of authenticity. This unit has a stencil painted letter / number and a white paper glue-on label with a list of options. There is residue from a sticker that had been placed on top the Motorola foil sticker with the model and serial number. That likely was the asset tag - which was removed so the model and serial could be seen.

For programming, first try running the software on modern windows under DosBox. If that does not work, look for an old laptop with a real serial port. You might find an old Toughbook that runs DOS / Windows 3.11 / '95 / '98.

I forgot to add, you'll want the little brass key that unlocks the handle. I think it's a 2135.

I would like to hear from someone that actually uses a Syntor (plain or X9000).

 

[tvengr]

Our news department used UHF Syntor X9000's. It was quite a hookup with the RIB and cables to be able to program them. I had an ancient computer on a roll-around rack along with, I believe, a Motorola R-2410 service monitor. The software was on 5-1/4" floppies. I still have the old keys for Motorola, General Electric, and RCA radios.

 

[kk6rq]

The software is all over the internet. If you're just programming LMR (ie. NON-ham) freqs, just look for the final (v.8.x) version. Remember, separate programs for the radio/brick and control head. I've heard people claim they got it working with DOSBox but I was never able to. Natively, you're going to need a 386 or slow 486 with both cache and turbo disabled. And, to warn you ahead of time, it's among the stupidest programming software Moto ever created, in terms of the layout of which keys were chosen for various functions in the software (instead of <Enter> to continue, it's the letter <N>...)