New Bern P25
- Thread starter rwelker
- Start date
- Status
troymail
Silent Key
I can't answer you question directly so the best I can do is ensure everything is programmed correctly.
I'm curious what you mean by picking up the control channels. I'm assuming you've checked and can hear what sounds like a CC on on the the known CC frequencies by loading it as a conventional frequency.
Have you loaded the system (from the library and/or manual programming) and talkgroups?
Does the radio lock onto the CC (the radio displays "DAT") and you're just not seeing/hearing any active talkgroups?
Are you running in ID SCAN or ID SEARCH mode?
Have you enabled all of the SERVICE TYPES? I believe Fire Dispatch and Law Dispatch are enabled by default but the Tac service groups are not.
And finally - do you have a radio other than the 436? Can you hear any activity on that radio?
I'm curious what you mean by picking up the control channels. I'm assuming you've checked and can hear what sounds like a CC on on the the known CC frequencies by loading it as a conventional frequency.
Have you loaded the system (from the library and/or manual programming) and talkgroups?
Does the radio lock onto the CC (the radio displays "DAT") and you're just not seeing/hearing any active talkgroups?
Are you running in ID SCAN or ID SEARCH mode?
Have you enabled all of the SERVICE TYPES? I believe Fire Dispatch and Law Dispatch are enabled by default but the Tac service groups are not.
And finally - do you have a radio other than the 436? Can you hear any activity on that radio?
KC4YIN
Member
New Bern is a tough nut to crack. I lived over there until 2007 and had no problems.
Ever since they went to the Harris P25 system I have only been able to get bits and pieces of traffic on their system. When I'm over there which is not very often, I try my luck with different configurations but still having difficulty. I still have a few other setups I'm going to try.
It would help if you can tell us what scanner you are using and how you are programming it, whether by hand or software.
I'm using PSR 500 and 600 with Win500 software.
Ever since they went to the Harris P25 system I have only been able to get bits and pieces of traffic on their system. When I'm over there which is not very often, I try my luck with different configurations but still having difficulty. I still have a few other setups I'm going to try.
It would help if you can tell us what scanner you are using and how you are programming it, whether by hand or software.
I'm using PSR 500 and 600 with Win500 software.
troymail
Silent Key
From the description, it sounds like it could be a digital simulcast problem. However, RR is showing the license as only a single tower so maybe not. Either way, most believe that the x36 radios work pretty well on P25 (and simulcast) systems.
Another question - where are you located? In New Bern? Outside the area?
Another question - where are you located? In New Bern? Outside the area?
The 436 is the only digital scanner I have, so trying a different radio isn't possible.
Programming it via the Sentinel software. Have tried ID scanning, ID search, and the Discovery function on the radio, all to no avail. Also tried a frequency search through the 800 band, also with nothing. All done from within visual range of their tower. Picked up VIPER just fine, and another, what sounded like paging system.
Due to the age of the information in the database I even tried programming using every available trunking option in the Sentinel (P25 X2, P25 One Freq, etc)
The manual claims and indicator of ENC will be shown when it detects an encrypted transmission, none was ever displayed. Only DAT, and on very rare instances LNK. But never any audio.
Tried using the Discovery function to look for new talk groups on VIPER thinking maybe they had switched to it, again nothing, least not from New Bern.
Programming it via the Sentinel software. Have tried ID scanning, ID search, and the Discovery function on the radio, all to no avail. Also tried a frequency search through the 800 band, also with nothing. All done from within visual range of their tower. Picked up VIPER just fine, and another, what sounded like paging system.
Due to the age of the information in the database I even tried programming using every available trunking option in the Sentinel (P25 X2, P25 One Freq, etc)
The manual claims and indicator of ENC will be shown when it detects an encrypted transmission, none was ever displayed. Only DAT, and on very rare instances LNK. But never any audio.
Tried using the Discovery function to look for new talk groups on VIPER thinking maybe they had switched to it, again nothing, least not from New Bern.
KC4YIN
Member
The best luck I've had is with my PSR 600 in my truck. Seems the 500 which is the hand held does not do as well. In a lot of ways this system is very similar as it was when it was analog and a hybrid type 1 Motorola system. They still use that data burst channel they had before along with a separate control channel. There are some rebanded freqs. I've got to go over there to take the boat to get worked on and will take another try at it and will report back. Someone on here who was in New Bern reported getting the system with no problem using a 996XT. Said he entered the rebanding configuration and it worked.
I don't know about the rebanding information, thats above my knowledge level. However in the software, there is a section Band Plan, with banks 0-F. Each list 0.00 for the base and 0.00 for the spacing. If that could be problem then I will require some assistance in figuring what values need to be entered.
KC4YIN
Member
The rebanding is just the newer frequencies that are already in the data base. Not sure how your scanner but on the PSR 500 and 600 software you are given certain options to enter such as "800Mhz reband", "P25" etc.
BTW I have been following other threads on here about Harris systems and the similar problems others are having. Case in point is the Franklin Co. system. There's another one somewhere in Georgia, same situation. I believe it's going to take some manipulation of the advanced settings on these scanners. Like you, New Bern is the only one I have had trouble with and I have been messing with scanners since the early 70's.
BTW I have been following other threads on here about Harris systems and the similar problems others are having. Case in point is the Franklin Co. system. There's another one somewhere in Georgia, same situation. I believe it's going to take some manipulation of the advanced settings on these scanners. Like you, New Bern is the only one I have had trouble with and I have been messing with scanners since the early 70's.
troymail
Silent Key
If it's a P25 system (which is what it's listed as on RR), rebanding and trunking tables should not need any special settings.
Interestingly, looking at fcc.gov, the license is actively being modified (as of last week):
From:
20K0F3E - 5 kHz deviation FM "wideband 25 kHz" analog voice (FM mode in RadioReference.com Database)
To:
5K76G1E - P25 CQPSK voice (typically used for simulcast systems – this is NOT P25 Phase II)
The question is if there's something odd about the system, it's transmitting at lower power than what you need to receive it, the radiation pattern is tuned to limit the coverage area or it's just a problem similar to the digital simulcast issue. This really has me curious but I'm 6 hours away so all I can do is speculate.
Something to try -- figure out which frequency is the active control channel. Program ONLY that frequency into the your scanner for this system. Run in ID SEARCH mode with only this system enabled. And, if possible (option) - try to go close to the tower/site (3600 WINDHILL COURT?) and see if the reception is better near the tower.
Interestingly, looking at fcc.gov, the license is actively being modified (as of last week):
From:
20K0F3E - 5 kHz deviation FM "wideband 25 kHz" analog voice (FM mode in RadioReference.com Database)
To:
5K76G1E - P25 CQPSK voice (typically used for simulcast systems – this is NOT P25 Phase II)
The question is if there's something odd about the system, it's transmitting at lower power than what you need to receive it, the radiation pattern is tuned to limit the coverage area or it's just a problem similar to the digital simulcast issue. This really has me curious but I'm 6 hours away so all I can do is speculate.
Something to try -- figure out which frequency is the active control channel. Program ONLY that frequency into the your scanner for this system. Run in ID SEARCH mode with only this system enabled. And, if possible (option) - try to go close to the tower/site (3600 WINDHILL COURT?) and see if the reception is better near the tower.
KG4KHQ
Member
New Bern
Awhile back, I had about an hour to listen in New Bern using a Uniden 996XT. Doing a custom search with Control Channel Only enabled, I was copying talkgroups while the search was parked on the Control Channel. While scanning the system with the frequencies and talkgroups programmed in, I was not getting anything. If I had to guess, I believe the issue is in the Band Plan settings. Somewhere here in the forums is a discussion about Band Plans on a Harris P25 system and I think something similar might be happening here. My understanding is that the scanner gets the custom settings from the control channel so a band Plan usually does not need to be entered for a P25 system but there might be something about Harris that might be different. Band Plans for rebanding should not apply since it is P25 system. I have to say however, that I don't have any problems scanning the Wayne Co Harris P25 system but since that system is VHF, a different Band Plan would be needed anyway. What I need to do is bring a laptop down there and run Pro96.com on it to see what it.
Awhile back, I had about an hour to listen in New Bern using a Uniden 996XT. Doing a custom search with Control Channel Only enabled, I was copying talkgroups while the search was parked on the Control Channel. While scanning the system with the frequencies and talkgroups programmed in, I was not getting anything. If I had to guess, I believe the issue is in the Band Plan settings. Somewhere here in the forums is a discussion about Band Plans on a Harris P25 system and I think something similar might be happening here. My understanding is that the scanner gets the custom settings from the control channel so a band Plan usually does not need to be entered for a P25 system but there might be something about Harris that might be different. Band Plans for rebanding should not apply since it is P25 system. I have to say however, that I don't have any problems scanning the Wayne Co Harris P25 system but since that system is VHF, a different Band Plan would be needed anyway. What I need to do is bring a laptop down there and run Pro96.com on it to see what it.
jsncrso
Member
Turn your squelch down low to around 2
KC4YIN
Member
Very interesting. I have noticed it does seem to be very weak. I have to get within about 10 miles of the city to be able to receive it well enough to get the scanner to track it. On the other hand, as soon as I leave New Bern, I can start to pick up the Lenoir Co. / Kinston system some 30 miles away. next time I'm over there, which may be as soon as tomorrow, I will check the system again since it looks like they are working on it.
Thanks for the research on that Troymail.
If I have time I will take my laptop and run Unitrunker on it again.
troymail
Silent Key
Another thought -- if it might be a trunking (tracking) issue, try loading the frequencies as conventional and see if you hear anything (lock out the CC of course).
If they're just P25 voice (but not Phase 2) - you should be able to hear it - just not track it very well.
Pro96Com is the right way to get some better answers.
If they're just P25 voice (but not Phase 2) - you should be able to hear it - just not track it very well.
Pro96Com is the right way to get some better answers.
KC4YIN
Member
Had been thinking about just that. Loading the voice channels as conventional and listening. Have tried just about everything else. I also have Pro96 Com just forgot to mention it.
We should have a contest with the first person to crack the system wins a new scanner.
KC4YIN
Member
To the op. Is one of the control channels you have heard on a frequency of 859.2625? It is not listed in the database but that was the frequency they were using last time I was over there.
Out of the blue today, I suddenly picked up traffic coming from New Bern's P25 system. Have made zero changes to my config. though it does seem as if I'm only hearing half the conversation.
Believe someone asked about the scanner getting stuck on DAT, don't know if it 'stuck' but does seem to spend quiet a bit amount of time on DAT. And I have the site set for ID Search, if that makes any difference.
Believe someone asked about the scanner getting stuck on DAT, don't know if it 'stuck' but does seem to spend quiet a bit amount of time on DAT. And I have the site set for ID Search, if that makes any difference.
troymail
Silent Key
I see somone added a new TG to the RR listings so someone is hearing something!
Best option(s) would be to
- determine the active control channel frequency and only use/program that (remove all others for now)
- run in ID SEARCH or wildcard mode as you've mentioned
- get close to the tower/transmitter (for a little while anyway)
Best option(s) would be to
- determine the active control channel frequency and only use/program that (remove all others for now)
- run in ID SEARCH or wildcard mode as you've mentioned
- get close to the tower/transmitter (for a little while anyway)
I live in New Bern and I am not receiving anything at all. The active control channel (as I am typing this) is 856.7375 and it broadcasting system ID 0056H-0101. If I tell it to hold and run ID Search it finds the radio traffic but there is no sound with it. I was listening to radio traffic just fine a few days ago and then it quit and I am lost! Any ideas?? I am using an Uniden BCD996XT.
troymail
Silent Key
Perhaps they are running P25 Phase 2 (or some other mode your scanner can't receive).
Pro96Com!
- Status