New to scanning, some transmission cutting issues

[rdkeeney]

Hello,

Please excuse my "ineptness" as im new to radio. I got my WS1065 to scan the TOPAZ system in Arizona. Programmed using PSREdit. I made my first scanlist with just my local PD and FD in Mesa. I'm using multisite with two sites and included the primary and secondary CCs and added the talkgroups i wanted. I seem to recieve FD pretty clear. However the PD seems to cutout and the speech is interrupted. I'm confused as to why talkgroups in the same system would be receiving differently. I've fiddled around with delay, and turned off priority to no success. I also receive DPS highway patrol on conventional clearly as well. Please help a noob out!!

Ryan

 

[W8RMH]

Could be a Simulcast Distortion issue.

 

[jonwienke]

Not if it only happens to certain talkgroups in a system. Simulcast affects reception of all talkgroups in a system equally.

 

[bailly2]

yes it is simulcast distortion from multiple towers transmitting on the same frequency at the same time. ..there is a system near me that has it ..what worked the best for this is putting the rubber antenna my scanner came with inside an empty paint can near the bottom. very clear sounding with this because it blocks out all the towers except for one direction ..or maybe surround the antenna with carboard and alumimum foil except in one direction

 

[W8RMH]

Ignored

 

[mule1075]

yes it is simulcast distortion from multiple towers transmitting on the same frequency at the same time. ..there is a system near me that has it ..what worked the best for this is putting the rubber antenna my scanner came with inside an empty paint can near the bottom. very clear sounding with this because it blocks out all the towers except for one direction ..or maybe surround the antenna with carboard and alumimum foil except in one direction

Do you really need to post this reply endlessly in almost every thread?

 

[jonwienke]

It's an obsession with him. It's his cure for every recption problem, even if it isn't actually a simulcast issue. It's not an effective design for a directional antenna, or a way to adjustably attenuate the signal, so it's a pretty useless recommendation in general. I've explained this to him several times now, but he continues to wear the paint off CRTL-V.

Only one site in the TOPAZ system is simulcast, and the OP indicated that the issue only affects some talkgroups, not all, so simulcast is probably not the issue.

 

[rdkeeney]

I may try changing sites on the TOPAZ. Not use the Mesa (Simulcast) and use another that it looks like im still in range of.

Thanks guys

 

[a29zuk]

Not if it only happens to certain talkgroups in a system. Simulcast affects reception of all talkgroups in a system equally.

Not necessarily true. On my local simulcast the EMS dispatch channel often breaks up while North, South PD dispatch and Fire dispatch are in the clear. Don't know if it is a console issue but there is a distinct difference. It's pretty frustrating but it happens on both the 396T and 325P2.
I haven't tried the paint can method though
Jim

 

[rdkeeney]

So I was thinking getting about getting a 800MHz yagi to mitigate the multipath issues on listening to the simulcast. Will this completely prevent me for hearing any of the 700MHz bands that are also used on the system? Also I listen to AZ DPS on 400MHz conventional, will that not pickup either? If not what are some solutions? Splitter switch with the two antenna? thanks all

 

[slicerwizard]

A Yagi will hear other bands, but not optimally. If the signals aren't too weak, you'll hear them.

 

[rdkeeney]

Here's my location and the towers in the simulcast. What do you all think optimal yagi direction? Im thinking A and B are too inline?

 

[jonwienke]

D, with E as a second choice.

 

[rdkeeney]

Thanks everyone! Truly a very friendly and helpful community. I'll let y'all know how it goes.

Thanks

 

[troymail]

I'd try them all and find the one that is best (right now). There are many factors that go into which might be better than the others and only you can determine that based on trial and error. Additionally, given the things that impact reception, you can probably expect it to change over time.

These "work-arounds" are like using "duck tape"... they are work-arounds and won't work forever.

 

[rdkeeney]

Also, I think I just confirmed it being a multipath issue. Before when I was receiving FD talkgroups but no PD, turns out I was including another site that was not simulcast (Shaw Butte), so they were in the clear from that site and the PD was distorted on the multicast. Because no I imported the system again using on the simulcast only and the FD talkgroups are distorted same as the PD.

 

[I_am_Alpha1]

Also, I think I just confirmed it being a multipath issue. Before when I was receiving FD talkgroups but no PD, turns out I was including another site that was not simulcast (Shaw Butte), so they were in the clear from that site and the PD was distorted on the multicast. Because no I imported the system again using on the simulcast only and the FD talkgroups are distorted same as the PD.

You are doing great...don't get frustrated, it's a marathon. With simulcast there is no cure-all fix--otherwise we wouldn't be discussing it over and over. Each system is different despite using the same equipment, so what works for one may not work for you. Try one thing at a time, then try multiple things together. Some suggestions would be relocating the scanner. Try to get more building between the scanner and towers. I had some luck putting a scanner by a window that faced one tower while the majority of the house blocked the other 9 towers. Change your antenna, but not necessarily to a better one. My best result came from using a VHF rubber duck sideways on a BCD536HP--basically dumb it down so it will only receive one tower. Your mileage with a yagi may vary but it didn't work for me. Antennas have a fairly broad reception capabilities with narrow transmit capability. I took a 2-meter yagi and turned it 90 degrees away from a repeater and still had great reception, but poor transmit capability back to the repeater. Doesn't hurt anything but the wallet to try. Double and triple check your programming...the small things will mess you up so often. When you get to the point of standing on one foot while rubbing your tummy and patting your head and it still won't work, consider your options and finances. You could choose to live with what you have or get a used Motorola XTS5000 on E-Bay if you are serious about scanning and can't get anything else to work.

I used to live in a county that went with a Cassidian 10-site P25/1 system and it basically killed all scanners. I had some luck while others had better and worse luck. In the north part of the county, it was a dead zone with zero reception regardless of the model scanner and antenna. I bought the XTS5000 and love it--bought a second one. The local ham store couldn't keep them on the shelf...one guy up north bought 3. They are much, much harder to program and you are limited to scanning 15 TGs at a time.

Good luck and stick with it.

One last thought...if you test a yagi, try it in all directions, not just pointed to a specific tower and see what is better...could be tower A or D or pointed north or to Gilbert--don't know if you don't try.