NFPA Compliant APX Portable

[mmckenna]

If you suddenly disappear from the RR board, we know a MSI hitman took you out. These kinda ideas are dangerous!

Tempted to start buying up 2 channel VHF HT1000's off e-bay en-mass. Get someone to build custom cases in bright yellow/green and figure out how to get them approved.

But, seriously, this is a place where Icom could break into the fire radio market with a recased model they probably already have on the shelf.

 

[d119]

The whole NFPA is a racket, deep in bed with Motorola. It's all a scam. Just like tow trucks, private ambulances, life in general.

 

[ElroyJetson]

An IC-F7040 built into a case that's half an inch thick and takes a while to melt. Yeah, that's the ticket.

No, not really.

Icom does make a good product but it's like they're being FORCED to make 700/800 products, AND support P25, against their will.

 

[buddrousa]

@mmckenna
The UL testing alone would cost a fortune plus meeting UL standards. But it would be a great radio. It would make more sense to build a radio into the SCBA for use in Fire Ground Operations.

 

[MTS2000des]

An IC-F7040 built into a case that's half an inch thick and takes a while to melt. Yeah, that's the ticket.

No, not really.

Icom does make a good product but it's like they're being FORCED to make 700/800 products, AND support P25, against their will.

I'd never buy an Icom700/800 anything. They refuse to provide us demos, system keys or programming so they will NEVER see the light of day on our system. Every other P25 subscriber vendor has been responsive. I don't think Icom cares about P25 trunking.

 

[KevinC]

The whole NFPA is a racket, deep in bed with Motorola. It's all a scam. Just like tow trucks, private ambulances, life in general.

I guess that explains why Harris had a 1802 compliant radio long before MSI did.

 

[OpSec]

Icom does make a good product but it's like they're being FORCED to make 700/800 products, AND support P25, against their will.

I have experience on this one. I've met with their product developers and engineers from .jp

They tried to get into the P25 public safety market, but it's been uphill and I've heard nothing from them the past 2 or 3 years. the firmware can't quite work correctly and trying to get the mothership to understand that is a struggle. Maybe they finally gave up?

Great analog gear, great P25 conventional gear, great hammy gear...not so great on trunking.

 

[wa8pyr]

I'd never buy an Icom700/800 anything. They refuse to provide us demos, system keys or programming so they will NEVER see the light of day on our system. Every other P25 subscriber vendor has been responsive. I don't think Icom cares about P25 trunking.

I think you're right.

I would have loved to try out the 700/800 P25 version of the 3400 at work. Icom was willing to provide a demo radio and system keys (thanks to our shop which kept on their backs), but what killed Icom for the project was their refusal to add link layer authentication to their radios. Wouldn't even discuss it. So I told them "thanks but no thanks."

With the relatively small size and ruggedness of the 3400, I think they could have made some major sales in Ohio (especially to law enforcement, who are always clamoring for a smaller, lighter radio for plainclothes use), but they just didn't seem to care.

Great analog gear, great P25 conventional gear, great hammy gear...not so great on trunking.

Unless it's NXDN. I've had no trouble in that regard.

 

[mmckenna]

An IC-F7040 built into a case that's half an inch thick and takes a while to melt. Yeah, that's the ticket.

No, not really.

Icom does make a good product but it's like they're being FORCED to make 700/800 products, AND support P25, against their will.

Of course not. Just saying that it wouldn't take much and even Icom could do it. Again single/two channel VHF analog radio. Just enough for fire ground and a dispatch channel.

@mmckenna
The UL testing alone would cost a fortune plus meeting UL standards. But it would be a great radio. It would make more sense to build a radio into the SCBA for use in Fire Ground Operations.

Of course but spread that cost across a few tens of thousands of radios and the price would come down enough that small volly agencies could begin to afford it and it might just work.

 

[d119]

I'd never buy an Icom700/800 anything. They refuse to provide us demos, system keys or programming so they will NEVER see the light of day on our system. Every other P25 subscriber vendor has been responsive. I don't think Icom cares about P25 trunking.

A pimp would never be caught with a commoners radio.

I think Icom is probably well positioned to pick up a lot of the business/commercial slack. Throwaway radios, essentially.

As for your comment, @KevinC regarding Harris having the NFPA radio first, I stand corrected (I'm one of the few people these days that can still do that). Whatever the case may be, it's still a matter of the NFPA being in bed with manufacturers, and the end user departments getting screwed in the end.

Everyone things the NFPA is a regulatory agency. Wrong.

 

[wa8pyr]

I think Icom is probably well positioned to pick up a lot of the business/commercial slack. Throwaway radios, essentially.

Hardly. I use them all the time; they're very rugged and anything but "throwaway" radios. Railroads wouldn't be using them for some very hard service if they were.

Everyone things the NFPA is a regulatory agency. Wrong.

I don't disagree with you there. However, because the legal community has decided that NFPA recommendations are gospel, they spout them in court to juries who don't know the difference. I've gone with the NFPA recommendations when I could afford to do so, but $15k for an individual radio is way beyond affordable for any of the agencies I worked with.

 

[d119]

Railroads wouldn't be using them for some very hard service if they were.

I'm in that business. And we absolutely refuse ICOM based on durability. Every Class 1 conductor/engineer I've spoken with says they are junk, and the Kenwood product is much superior.

Why do the railroads use them? Because they are cheap. Not because they are durable.

 

[wa8pyr]

I'm in that business. And we absolutely refuse ICOM based on durability. Every Class 1 conductor/engineer I've spoken with says they are junk, and the Kenwood product is much superior.

Why do the railroads use them? Because they are cheap. Not because they are durable.

Strange. I have yet to have a problem with my 3161 and it's taken some pretty hard falls, drops and rolls off a moving vehicle.

What are they doing, hammering nails with them?

 

[ElroyJetson]

I've got a bunch of customers who still use Icom F24 radios that are about 15 years old and they're still running strong. Once in a while they need a battery or an antenna but they have been thrown around and dropped numerous times and just keep on working. Some of Icom's radios have proven to be pretty durable.

 

[kayn1n32008]

Icom does make a good product but it's like they're being FORCED to make 700/800 products, AND support P25, against their will.

I mean, nobody I'd holding a gun to their head and forcing them to do anything. However, by not developing and marketing 7/800MHz P25 products, they are losing access to a HUGE market.

Having said that, from what I have seen of their P25 700/800MHz offerings, I'm not overly impressed. Plus Icom is the better part of 2 decades behind every other manufacturer.

I don't think their 7/800 offerings have even been compliance tested on our L3Harris provincial trunking system.

Icom has lost out on a large market, and had they been on it, would have been a welcome competitor to EFWood/Tait/BK and low tier Motorola and Harris.

Icom LMR has always felt unpolished, especially the programming software, they also didnt really feel all that durable. In te analogue conventional market space, I'd put them in the same place as Vertex Standard. Good enough to use in the LMR realm, but not something I'd put in the hands of public safety users.

 

[MTS2000des]

Icom has lost out on a large market, and had they been on it, would have been a welcome competitor to EFWood/Tait/BK and low tier Motorola and Harris.

Icom LMR has always felt unpolished, especially the programming software, they also didnt really feel all that durable. In te analogue conventional market space, I'd put them in the same place as Vertex Standard. Good enough to use in the LMR realm, but not something I'd put in the hands of public safety users.

The big turn off to me is lack of follow up. I met with the P25 rep at APCO2023, exchange contact info. He promised me the world including demos, system keys for our system, etc. Then ghosted. No problem, we have 23 agencies and 8,000 users over 400 talk groups, 15 RF subsites and the largest P25 single zone simulcast system in the state. The other vendors are eager to put products in our and our stakeholders hands and we welcome this. Choice is what keeps prices down, and drives innovation.