Not stopping on active channel

[N8IYR]

I have just purchased a new BCD536 Scanner, I have it set up for location scanning via GPS. All is great and it follows my travels well.

One major issue that has me stumped is on MPSCS system in Michigan, Kalamazoo County Sheriff is not encrypted but scanner will not stop on any of there channels when active. Now, I can manually go to and lock the channel in and I can hear them fine. The ERR is as good as 1 and 2, but it will not stop on it when scanning. ( all other departments seem fine on MPSCS)

I have tried both from full database with GPS, and from Fav. List with just Kalamazoo area in it.

Excuse my terms, when I say channel, I mean on the KCSD Talk Group for Main Dispatch, as well as LEIN and Car to Car. I can hear if in manual locked on, but not when scanning??

Does anyone have some ideas for me to try? This is one of the main departments I want to monitor.

Thanks for you help in advance

 

[phask]

How current is your DB? I found some location errors in MaComb county that have been corrected. Maybe something similar.

Do you have all the Law service types on?

 

[N8IYR]

The database is the most current. I literally just got it a week ago, updated everything with Sentinel and set up 1 Fav list for just a few local departments.

What is strange is I can listen to them if I lock it on the channel, but it just doesn't stop on it when scanning, so I would assume the channel info is correct. I thought about the Threshold level, but when receiving it in manual it is a 1 or 2, so I guess I will not try adjusting the default auto mode it came with. Signal strength is good to. I can actually pick departments much further away, the KCSD is only a few miles from me and 2 tower sights are within 10 miles, 1 is 3 miles tops.

I traveled to the East side this week and followed me all the way, works great, except this issue,

 

[N8IYR]

Sorry, I have all the Law, EMS and Fire services active, all others are not

 

[marksmith]

What you describe is usually caused by not having the service type enabled. You set it manually and you hear but the scan excludes it. I know you sound like you have it enabled, but just wanted to point out it is exactly what happens with excluded service type.

Mark
WS1095/536/436/996P2/HP1e/HP2e/996XT/325P2/396XT/PRO668/PSR800/PRO652

 

[SCPD]

try also

Not all the time with the service types,sometimes I had to set the 536 with a longer delay say of 2 to get it to stop on a big system,remember there are many talkgroups to that system....So you want it to look longer.Might not make sense to some,but this was my experience with the 536HP.

 

[ofd8001]

Any chance it could be a range issue? You might try increasing the range to 50.0 and see if that helps. Just a shot, however.

 

[SCPD]

on a uniden?

Any chance it could be a range issue? You might try increasing the range to 50.0 and see if that helps. Just a shot, however.

On a uniden Hp series?
I set any uniden HP series to 10 miles and I get 100+ miles.Here in New Jersey that is.
I am in North New Jersey and with factory set 10 miles I get NYC,PA and Conneticut (keep in mind its pretty far to those borders) Way too many frequencies for 10 miles....
I doubt thats the issue unless its too high,Mine is set to 1 mile so I get 8 miles if I use location settings.

 

[N8IYR]

What you describe is usually caused by not having the service type enabled. You set it manually and you hear but the scan excludes it. I know you sound like you have it enabled, but just wanted to point out it is exactly what happens with excluded service type.

Mark
WS1095/536/436/996P2/HP1e/HP2e/996XT/325P2/396XT/PRO668/PSR800/PRO652

I thought all are on for Law, but perhaps they stuck it under multi dispatch, or one of the multis, which I have off. Thanks for that, I will look at it later today to see if it works. I cant get to it right now, my Wife has my car!!

 

[N8IYR]

Not all the time with the service types,sometimes I had to set the 536 with a longer delay say of 2 to get it to stop on a big system,remember there are many talkgroups to that system....So you want it to look longer.Might not make sense to some,but this was my experience with the 536HP.

Which delay are you referring too?

I assume not scan delay as it has to hit it to delay on it. Is there a sample rate? please let me know where to find it, I will give it a try.
Thanks for the reply and suggestion

 

[N8IYR]

Any chance it could be a range issue? You might try increasing the range to 50.0 and see if that helps. Just a shot, however.

Thanks, but I dont think in this case. Both the Department and the tower sight are less then 3 miles from my location when testing. Also I pick up tower sights in the next county and there traffic. I have my range at 5 which really could be 0 and work for what I am trying to hear.

Thanks again though, good thought

 

[phask]

I thought all are on for Law, but perhaps they stuck it under multi dispatch, or one of the multis, which I have off. Thanks for that, I will look at it later today to see if it works. I cant get to it right now, my Wife has my car!!

Looks like Law Talk and Dispatch - several also are listed as Enc. Maybe more actually are.

Michigan's Public Safety Communications System (MPSCS) Trunking System, Statewide, Multi-State - Scanner Frequencies

You say your are up to date - but many have said that and never wrote to the radio

Also - using GPS you will probably load 4, maybe 6 sites or even more - that's going to slow it down - if you have your range at 50 - even more so. You need to look at what sites are loaded.

FWIW - if NOT mobile a favorite list is MUCH more precise and better at a fixed location.

 

[N8IYR]

Looks like Law Talk and Dispatch - several also are listed as Enc. Maybe more actually are.

Michigan's Public Safety Communications System (MPSCS) Trunking System, Statewide, Multi-State - Scanner Frequencies

You say your are up to date - but many have said that and never wrote to the radio

Also - using GPS you will probably load 4, maybe 6 sites or even more - that's going to slow it down - if you have your range at 50 - even more so. You need to look at what sites are loaded.

FWIW - if NOT mobile a favorite list is MUCH more precise and better at a fixed location.

I did check, all groups enabled, but added Multi just in case. As for range, I have it at 5, not 50, so should be good there, I had it at 0 but changed it to see if that made a difference. KCSD is the only one not encrypted, and of course I wouldn't be able to hear it in manual if it were. I will give the Multi group a chance, I am heading out now to test. And also, its always mobile.
I hope this works!!

 

[N8IYR]

Looks like Law Talk and Dispatch - several also are listed as Enc. Maybe more actually are.

Michigan's Public Safety Communications System (MPSCS) Trunking System, Statewide, Multi-State - Scanner Frequencies

You say your are up to date - but many have said that and never wrote to the radio

Also - using GPS you will probably load 4, maybe 6 sites or even more - that's going to slow it down - if you have your range at 50 - even more so. You need to look at what sites are loaded.

FWIW - if NOT mobile a favorite list is MUCH more precise and better at a fixed location.

Well, my range is back at 0, I re-did my Fav List to just a few TGs, but of course KCSD (Kal. Sheriff) was included. I set my Fav. for non location based, and my full data base set to GPS (Not sure if Favs list is not using as the GPS letters are still on the screen) doesn't stop for KCSD on either scenario.
Was thinking maybe the GPS had something to do with it.

I would almost be willing to bet they too have gone encrypted, but I can hear them when locked on to it.

So I am back to square one, this really has me baffled, why can I hear them when locked in but doesn't stop when scanning. It even stopped on KDPS which is normally encrypted, but must have been in the clear tonight. But no Sheriffs dept.

This is mounted in my car and is always mobile, but I have been sitting in the drive way with my lap top trying to adjust using sentinel and knowing I am in the clear for signal from the Sheriffs dept.

It looks like everything is set, its not avoided, I cleared all of my avoids to be sure.
Not sure if it would work, but have thought about using priority scan and set the KCSD as the priority, not sure if it would work then, but not sure how to do that one yet.

Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

[pingdew]

Hi,

Just got a new BCD436hp and I'm pretty sure I can hear the TGs you are referring to. Could you please respond with the 3 TG #s (I use decimal) that you are referring to and I will check them for you. It may take until Monday though.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[N8IYR]

Hi,

Just got a new BCD436hp and I'm pretty sure I can hear the TGs you are referring to. Could you please respond with the 3 TG #s (I use decimal) that you are referring to and I will check them for you. It may take until Monday though.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That would be great, thanks
Talk groups are
3236 Kalamazoo County Sheriffs Dept Dispatch
3440 KCSD LEIN
3460 KCSD Car to Car

Strange, I get all other departments, State Police, even get the encrypted Departments when they go in the clear, just not Kalamazoo County Sheriffs Dept.

Please let me know when you get to check it out.
Thanks again

 

[N8IYR]

Not all the time with the service types,sometimes I had to set the 536 with a longer delay say of 2 to get it to stop on a big system,remember there are many talkgroups to that system....So you want it to look longer.Might not make sense to some,but this was my experience with the 536HP.

Can you tell me what delay? I have the delay after transmission set at default, which I believe is 3 sec, but since it doesnt stop on it, I dont know what good this one would do. Is there a decode length delay?

Also would the threshold have anything to do with it? It is also default 8 Auto

 

[pingdew]

Ok. First of all, I'm brand new to this.
3236 I'm 99% certain I get while I scan and 99% certain it always comes through on the Paw Paw site. That's why I remember it because it seems weird to me that even while I'm in Kzoo I get it through the Paw Paw site instead of the Kalamazoo City site. Also, I don't believe I've ever gotten a hit on the other two talk groups you listed. I'll have to learn how to manually lock into a single talkgroup. I hope to get a chance tonight to confirm I am remember my TG#s correctly. I'll update if I do.

Also, I'm curious to see what others say about threshold because I don't get very good reception on this TG in comparison to others and I don't understand what the threshold value does.

One difference is that I don't use a GPS. I use a favorite list. Perhaps the GPS isn't using the Paw Paw site? Try creating a small favorite list with those TGs in them and then scan with GPS off and see if you pick them up. Also, I'm not sure if you can avoid a single talk group? But if you can, maybe it would work if you manually listen it to it but avoid it if scanned and you accidentally have it avoided?

 

[N8IYR]

Ok. First of all, I'm brand new to this.
3236 I'm 99% certain I get while I scan and 99% certain it always comes through on the Paw Paw site. That's why I remember it because it seems weird to me that even while I'm in Kzoo I get it through the Paw Paw site instead of the Kalamazoo City site. Also, I don't believe I've ever gotten a hit on the other two talk groups you listed. I'll have to learn how to manually lock into a single talkgroup. I hope to get a chance tonight to confirm I am remember my TG#s correctly. I'll update if I do.

Also, I'm curious to see what others say about threshold because I don't get very good reception on this TG in comparison to others and I don't understand what the threshold value does.

One difference is that I don't use a GPS. I use a favorite list. Perhaps the GPS isn't using the Paw Paw site? Try creating a small favorite list with those TGs in them and then scan with GPS off and see if you pick them up. Also, I'm not sure if you can avoid a single talk group? But if you can, maybe it would work if you manually listen it to it but avoid it if scanned and you accidentally have it avoided?

Thanks. actually, that is what I did, I have a small Fav. list that also was not picking them up, so yesterday I turned off location control for that Fav list. I was out about 3am this morning (not much traffic at that time) and the KCSD Dispatch TG did stop and I could listen while in scan mode. So the issue may have something to do with how the location for this TG is set in the Database here on RR. Not sure how to check a TG by itself, I only see tower location info.

I had already unavoided everything earlier yesterday to see if that was the issue, but no luck, but good thought!

I too have not heard traffic on the other TGs for them, just dispatch now that I think about it, wonder why?? They also dont seem to have much traffic, back in the VHF days, they were hooping. I know they have data terminals now, maybe they use them for most traffic??

And yes, more info on the Threshold would be great, maybe UPMAN will give us his take on it.

The GPS does include the Paw Paw tower when on full data base location scanning

 

[ofd8001]

Location and Range may be one of the most difficult things for a new user to grasp.

See How it Works: Location, Location, Location

It isn't merely a case of where you are with respect to a site or Department/jurisdiction. Department locations and ranges also come into play, depending how they are "coded" in the database.

When Location Control is used, then your Range value circle has to overlap the circle established by the site location and its range (radius of circle). Also and just as important, the Department's circle established by its center point and range have to overlap. (Smaller communities probably have smaller ranges, bigger communities and statewide departments are larger.)

You have observed this with toggling Location Control On and Off. If you do not receive something with Location Control On, but do with Location Control Off, then the only explanation is Range settings.

There are two ways of dealing with this. One is the Range value for your scanner using the keypad. The other is using Sentinel to increase the range values for Sites and Departments for the Favorites Lists. You will not degrade scanner performance by increasing Department range values on a trunked system.

Questions about the technicalities of P25 Threshold Mode and P25 Threshold Value have been asked before. A real good explanation has not been given. Even if it was, at the end of the day, you'll just have to experiment with different settings to see which combination works best for you.