OC Fire and OC Sheriff squabble over Laguna Beach rescue - Raw Audio

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krazybob

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OC Sheriff Pouching OCFA Rescues

I hope this I hope this is the right form for this. I couldn't find an Orange County only group. I just read this and was wondering if it is fake news or actually is legitimate. It appears that the Orange County Sheriff's department has a new helicopter fully equipped and they're forcing it into service and pushing County Fire Authority out of the way.

The article the article references radio traffic which made me instantly wonder what talk groups they were on since the sheriff is fully encrypted. With the sheriff on OCFA unencrypted system? I do monitor OCFA and I'm wondering if they were on Calcord or some other frequency where this exchange took place. if you know those frequencies I'd love to know them as well.

Air battle being waged between Orange County sheriff, fire helicopters over emergency calls – Orange County Register
 

Markb

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...and just for the sake of accuracy, there is no Sheriff or OCFA system. It's all one big system and depending on the resource, communications can take place anywhere within the system.
Law Enforcement helicopters have access to most fire TG's and communicate on those TG's regularly. I am reasonably certain that the
Fire helicopters can communicate on some LE TG's, as they occasionally assist on SWAT missions and other Law activities.

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krazybob

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Thanks for the TG... and I know that its all one huge system with the difference being that the Sheriff TG's are encrypted except for the RED and a few others. No biggie. Most of the TG's hammer into Running Springs where all I need is a back of scanner whip. Wish I'd heard this live but thanks for the audio!
 

mmckenna

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Wow, that's freaking childish. All done with taxpayer dollars, all for "non-life threatening injuries".
 

allend

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It says in the article that there has been friction for several months. This has been an on-going battle for a few years now. I think OCSD has been intruding on fire rescue calls since they have hoisting ops and a paramedic on-board.

I think OCFA Helicopter I and II have had enough and it all came to terms in the air with these agencies last week and I am glad no body got hurt or killed. I bet at this point OCFA will have first rights to these kinds of incidents and OCSD will have to stand down at this point.
 

Matakovich1

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It should be who ever has the shortest ETA. They should do it the way LAcoFD does. County Fire is up first then LASD Air 5. If Air 5 is at their base in the mountains they are first due to all canyon calls. The Air 5 crews and LacoFD dont fight over calls.
 

PVPD730

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I don't know the history between the two agencies, nor do I care. The radio exchange was unprofessional on both sides. Hopefully they get their differences ironed out at some point.
 

krazybob

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I posted this somewhere and I don't remember now that I'm on tap talk. I live in the San Bernardino Mountains and every weekend when we have good weather up here we end up with rescue calls. Comm Center handles which helicopter gets the call and it's based on several factors that include who has the shortest ETA as well as who may have specialized equipment on the helicopter. Not all helicopters in San Bernardino County are hoist capable. They don't fight over turf and it's not unusual to have two helicopters on one incident. They successfully work together as a team. One helicopter for example may be working on the actual extraction of the immediate patient(s) while a second helicopter may be working on another aspect of the call. The point is that they work together as a team and I can't recall ever hearing this type of exchange over the radio as to which helicopter is going to pull them out. Such was the case last weekend when we had a tragic hang glider crash.

Up here we have what is called Auto Aid. It's like Mutual Aid except when there is an incident ALL available resources respond. They can be and are usually cancelled in route. Over this last winter the blower motor in our central furnace went out and the furnace was pumping 425 degrees of heat up the vents and was actually melting the carpet upstairs. The house was filled with acrid smoke and I dialed 911. Although in the city of Running Springs additional county engines were also in route along with CALFIRE. It was put out as a structure fire call. CALFIRE was first in and became the Incident Commander. The point is as they got here and they didn't fight over it. We shut the heater down and the world lived in harmony once again. It was cold.

For the sake of this thread it doesn't matter what my level of training is but all I can tell you is that a delay at patient care should have been the primary concern. This pissing match needs to come to an immediate stop!
 
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RadioDaze

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I heard the Laguna incident live as it unfolded even before the conflict started, thinking "Uh oh". I was hoping it wouldn't get too much attention drawn to it, afraid it will clinch encryption of the OCFA frequencies (if it's not already a fait accompli.)
 

krazybob

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Rumor has it that San Bernardino County is going to encrypt *everything* including the fire frequencies. As someone that lives in the mountains I think that it's unforgivable. I don't want to get too far off topic here but as a mountain dweller especially we have a right to know if a fire is about to crawl up our butt. I can't think of a single reason including Homeland Security that would cause any county to encrypt fire communications. In reality they can't especially when they're on the VHF patch for interoperability.

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mmckenna

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There is no logical reason to encrypt fire traffic.

However, CalFire isn't encrypted and is on VHF FM. That would be your better source of info.
 

allend

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Encryption has no bearing on bad behavior between OCSD and OCFA. We already know who is fully P25 digital encrypted and that happen 15+ years ago and is going to get the shorter end of this stick.

No need to say anymore. The good thing that should come out of this whole political issue is that nobody died or two helicopters ditched into the ground. This whole encryption debate with agencies have gotten so way out of control that public safety is going to suffer long term.

I can guarantee in time that Encryption will comes to terms like OCFA and OCSD has come too. I can bet the farm on it. It's just a matter of time until encryption causes comm issues and mass amounts of people will die. That's when encryption will be re-evaluated.
 

krazybob

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You are correct that encryption has no direct bearing on on the incident. But as another has stated, he believes that putting the public's spotlight on this incident will/might encourage OCFA to encrypt just as San Bernardino County is in the process of doing as they move to the 700MHz band.
 

Baker845

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If OCFA needs to encrypt there talkgroups to hide, from the public like the sheriff dept does to hide there illegal actions ect on calls, that's not safe for the public. What are the fire talkgroups being used for that need to be Encrypted? In both OCFA and San Bernardino county.
 

Eng74

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In my opinion, the OC Sheriff helicopter pilot should be grounded. They went against the ICS system right from the start. The Sheriff pilot made it political. There has been some who should have hoist rescue responsibility in my county between the SO and Fire. Aviation programs are not cheap, both departments are going to do the most to justify their programs in tight budget times. BOS will look to cut duplication of services when they can to save money and to dump one program is a bunch of money
 
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