Old Frequencies?

[sepura]

Why does the database keep old frequencies in the database and make them as "Deprecated". I understand it's for "reference" purposed but it's confusing also at the same time. Thanks.

 

[GTR8000]

Deprecated – This tag denotes a frequency or talkgroup that is no longer used. This tag should be used only temporarily during transition/migration periods for new radio systems. Frequencies and talkgroups should be deleted when they are truly obsolete.

The frequencies/talkgroups are supposed to be deleted eventually. Sometimes they remain for a long time because either A) they're forgotten about or B) an agency that has moved to a new system (800 trunked from VHF, for example) may still have the physical equipment installed "just in case".

 

[sepura]

awesome, thanks for the explanation!

 

[902]

The frequencies/talkgroups are supposed to be deleted eventually. Sometimes they remain for a long time because either A) they're forgotten about or B) an agency that has moved to a new system (800 trunked from VHF, for example) may still have the physical equipment installed "just in case".

Unfortunately, in many cases, the organization has moved to a new system, sometimes with the agreement that they would cancel their licenses and make their old frequencies available to others in the region, but has reneged on the agreement and continues to keep their old frequencies. In some cases, the base stations and antennas were unbolted, but since they're carried on licenses, they remain obstacles to new systems who might have to ask them for "concurrence" in order to operate. Sometimes that permission is denied, even though the system is not used. This effectively "warehouses" that frequency within the region.

 

[radioman2001]

A major problem in the NY tri-state area, there are nearly 100 vhf frequencies not being used by all kinds of agencies, mainly from what I have found Power and Utilities, and even State Police that have moved off to 800 and 900 mhz trunked systems. The comments by the licensees were that we might need them some day, or in an emergency, and after some investigation I found that they were not even constructed (no antenna's at the site listed on their license) nor did they even have in their possesion any equipment on VHF. This is a main reason why there are a lot of deprecated frequencies in the data base, licensed but not used.

 

[jackj]

As long as an agency holds a valid license for that frequency, it should be listed in the data base. The admin here doesn't have any way to check on usage. Other than what we tell RR. That said, the FCC should require that a license holder actually USE the frequencies they hold license for. If they aren't used then they should be placed back in the pool and re-issued to other users.

 

[nd5y]

the FCC should require that a license holder actually USE the frequencies they hold license for. If they aren't used then they should be placed back in the pool and re-issued to other users.

That is what is supposed to happen already but the FCC has no way to enforce it.

 

[902]

As long as an agency holds a valid license for that frequency, it should be listed in the data base. The admin here doesn't have any way to check on usage. Other than what we tell RR. That said, the FCC should require that a license holder actually USE the frequencies they hold license for. If they aren't used then they should be placed back in the pool and re-issued to other users.

All of that is true. RR's strength is that it has information about what is actually used and how it's used based on observation. You have the ability to judge the frequency's worth and whether or not you want to monitor it (and to provide feedback). That's something ULS can't do. The FCC does require systems to be "built out." The spectrum audit of 2001 pruned a few licenses nationwide, but the only thing that was necessary was to respond. No one is budgeted to do a site-by-site audit of physical plant. It's impractical considering the expenses for travel, lodging, and manpower required. So, looks like we're stuck with the honor system and random inspections. In the meantime, prospective licensees are stuck protecting that piece of paper that may have been active at one time, held for "the big one" (that once-in-a-career call that always seems to happen when you're out of town), or is completely fictitious.

 

[ericcarlson]

As long as an agency holds a valid license for that frequency, it should be listed in the data base. The admin here doesn't have any way to check on usage. Other than what we tell RR.

It will be in the searchable FCC database here, but only frequencies that are confirmed in use (or "usable" if confirmed) will be listed in the main RR database. Generally speaking unused frequencies will be deleted. The "Deprecated" function tag is intended primarily for a temporary marking of old frequencies when an agency has migrated. If you find stale "Deprecated" tags on something that is confirmed dead then please submit an update to the database.

 

[ecps92]

Sadly, this way we loose valid info.

Just because "WE" as Scannists say a channel is no longer in use, many times is not true. Many systems keep older channels licensed for "The Big One" or "Special Events".

I know of one channel where someone said "Wow - it still is around, yet I have heard nothing for 3 yrs"

The Depreciation is good, but removal is a tough call and can result in the DBA's having more work to add them back.

It will be in the searchable FCC database here, but only frequencies that are confirmed in use (or "usable" if confirmed) will be listed in the main RR database. Generally speaking unused frequencies will be deleted. The "Deprecated" function tag is intended primarily for a temporary marking of old frequencies when an agency has migrated. If you find stale "Deprecated" tags on something that is confirmed dead then please submit an update to the database.

 

[MOTOROLANUT]

Why does the database keep old frequencies in the database and make them as "Deprecated". I understand it's for "reference" purposed but it's confusing also at the same time. Thanks.

I agree "Legacy" would be a better description of old freqs. "Depreciated" sounds like a tax write off...LMAO

 

[DaveNF2G]

Deprecated and depreciated are two different things.

 

[MOTOROLANUT]

You are correct Sir...Although neither defination seem to fit very well to describe old radio frequencies.

Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary (1913 + 1828)
ARTFL > Webster's Dictionary > Searching for deprecate:
Displaying 1 result(s) from the 1913 edition:
Deprecate (Page: 394)
Dep"re*cate (?), v. t. [imp. & p. p. Deprecated (?); p. pr. & vb. n. Deprecating (?).] [L. deprecatus, p. p. of deprecari to avert by player, to deprecate; de- + precari to pray. See Pray.] To pray against, as an evil; to seek to avert by player; to desire the removal of; to seek deliverance from; to express deep regret for; to disapprove of strongly.

Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary (1913 + 1828)
ARTFL > Webster's Dictionary > Searching for depreciated:
No results found in the 1913 edition. Please modify your search and try again.
Displaying 1 result(s) from the 1828 edition:
DEPRECIATED, pp. Lessened in value or price; undervalued.

 

[GTR8000]

The term "Depreciated" is no longer used in the RR DB. All instances of "Depreciated" were replaced with "Deprecated". This applies to conventional frequencies, trunked systems, and talkgroups that are no longer current or in use.


In computing parlance, the term "deprecate" refers to a feature that is obsolete or has been superseded. That definition could certainly apply to old radio frequencies, hence the usage on RR. :wink:

Computer Science. To mark (a component of a software standard) as obsolete to warn against its use in the future so that it may be phased out.

deprecate: Definition, Synonyms from Answers.com

 

[MOTOROLANUT]

I never thought of radio frequencies as computer science......But it's your world, I am just living in it....LMAO
With that said I'll quote Snagglepuss, "Exit stage left!"

 

[GTR8000]

It's Lindsay's world, actually lol...and given that he has an extensive background in IT, I think we can guess how the term "deprecated" got applied to radio frequencies!

 

[MOTOROLANUT]

Ha..I hear that..Thanks for the explain..lol