Old Nextel PTT Phones

[BIODTL1997]

Not really sure where to put this, so I'm dropping it in here. I have a bin of these old phones (useless for cellular but awesome for simplex digital 2-way, via direct-connect)

My question: Are there any mobile radios that may put out more power to use as a simplex repeater or at least just a base station at say, a campsite?

These things are so cheap, as being basically obsolete, that I'd love to start a project for the summer.

Thanks!

 

[alcahuete]

You are not allowed to use more power on the ISM band. You are limited to 30 dBm, which is around 1w. There are repeaters, but they are also limited to 1w, are pretty expensive (~$1500), and only work with the Motorola DTR radios. They are not compatible with the Direct Connect.

 

[n1das]

The off network PTT simplex mode is Direct Talk, not to be confused with Direct Connect which used the NEXTEL iDEN network. NEXTEL is long gone but these phones can be used in Direct Talk (DT) mode. One gotcha with them is they must have a SIM card that was previously activated on NEXTEL or another iDEN network in order to enter DT mode. This is required because the DT protocol uses 1 plus the area code and phone number that was assigned to the phone to form the 11 digit Private ID used by the DT system. These phones will not enter DT mode without a SIM card that was previously activated on a NEXTEL or other iDEN network.

The DT feature is known generically as MOTOTALK.

MOTO Talk - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The DTR410/550/650 radios, DLR1020/1060 radios, and the new DTR600/700 radios are the modern day implementation of the old MOTOTALK platform. The DTRs and DLRs were coded differently (supposedly on purpose) to be incompatible with the DT feature in NEXTEL phones but they use the same digital FHSS system. The DTRs and DLRs were spinoffs from the the off network DT feature in NEXTEL phones. I suspect the DTRs and DLRs became incompatible with the DT feature in NEXTEL phones when more features were added.

If your bin of old DT-capable NEXTEL phones have SIM cards in them, then you probably can get them working with each other in DT mode. My wife (g/f at the time) and I have owned i355 NEXTEL phones and we used them in DT mode and they worked great. The i355 is a good one to use. Factory fresh new batteries are still available for the i355 because the legacy DTR410/550/650 models use the same hi-capacity battery. I own a small fleet of DTR650 radios and I re-batteried them with factory fresh new batteries a couple of years ago so I know you can still get new batteries for them.

 

[rescuecomm]

Do you have any I365 Nextels in the box?

 

[OpenCarrier]

Hey what about old Verizon VX8300s?? I have two of these can they be done in a similar fashon?? They make good emergency 911 only phones but still i'd hate to waste em...

 

[rescuecomm]

I have three Nextel I355's that are getting a little old. They still work just fine. Since I use prepaid cellphones that don't worry in the Caribbean, I use Direct Talk on cruises.

 

[Cameron314]

Hey what about old Verizon VX8300s?? I have two of these can they be done in a similar fashon?? They make good emergency 911 only phones but still i'd hate to waste em...

No

 

[BIODTL1997]

Do you have any I365 Nextels in the box?

I do. I have about 3 or 4 of them. Also a handful of i576 and i335. Probably about 15 in all. They all perform great. Around town I get around a mile, in the open up to 3 miles. Group talk on ski mountains is really a life saver with large groups where cell service is always a challenge.

 

[BIODTL1997]

The off network PTT simplex mode is Direct Talk, not to be confused with Direct Connect which used the NEXTEL iDEN network. NEXTEL is long gone but these phones can be used in Direct Talk (DT) mode. One gotcha with them is they must have a SIM card that was previously activated on NEXTEL or another iDEN network in order to enter DT mode. This is required because the DT protocol uses 1 plus the area code and phone number that was assigned to the phone to form the 11 digit Private ID used by the DT system. These phones will not enter DT mode without a SIM card that was previously activated on a NEXTEL or other iDEN network.

The DT feature is known generically as MOTOTALK.

MOTO Talk - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The DTR410/550/650 radios, DLR1020/1060 radios, and the new DTR600/700 radios are the modern day implementation of the old MOTOTALK platform. The DTRs and DLRs were coded differently (supposedly on purpose) to be incompatible with the DT feature in NEXTEL phones but they use the same digital FHSS system. The DTRs and DLRs were spinoffs from the the off network DT feature in NEXTEL phones. I suspect the DTRs and DLRs became incompatible with the DT feature in NEXTEL phones when more features were added.

If your bin of old DT-capable NEXTEL phones have SIM cards in them, then you probably can get them working with each other in DT mode. My wife (g/f at the time) and I have owned i355 NEXTEL phones and we used them in DT mode and they worked great. The i355 is a good one to use. Factory fresh new batteries are still available for the i355 because the legacy DTR410/550/650 models use the same hi-capacity battery. I own a small fleet of DTR650 radios and I re-batteried them with factory fresh new batteries a couple of years ago so I know you can still get new batteries for them.

Thanks for the very informative breakdown of these radios for the audience! I mispoke by saying Direct Connect (was thinking back to when my telecom company used the actual Nextel network around our work sites, and NYC metro area, 20+ years ago!)

Yes, you'll need a sim card, but you can get them on ebay in bulk for pennies). They need to be Nextel, Boost Mobile or Sprint)

You can set them up as individual ID's, where you can talk one-to one and also setup groups as a broadcast to all units.

 

[BIODTL1997]

Great info for compatible phones:

Direct Talk Compatible Phones - Matt's Blog

(The actual list is a bit further down the page, if you’d like to skip there.) Please Note: None of this information should be considered authoritative. It was gathered while I researched the feasibility of picking up a few old … Continue reading →

blogs.n1zyy.com

 

[N4KVE]

I use a few old Nextel phones too. They work great.

 

[rescue161]

I have a few i560 phones and my old cradle that had an amp, speaker, hand mic and wiring for external antenna. I think it boosted the power to 3 Watts, but not sure if it boosted the Direct Talk band. I know I used it on Direct Talk while it was in the cradle and it worked good.

 

[BIODTL1997]

Would LOVE to have a base or mobile to work with these. Even if only 1W. All about that antenna!

 

[wwhitby]

I've got a bunch of i355s that my family and I have used in the past. They always worked great for us.

The biggest problem I had was finding new batteries.

 

[n1das]

I've got a bunch of i355s that my family and I have used in the past. They always worked great for us.

The biggest problem I had was finding new batteries.

The i355 uses the same battery as the legacy DTR410/550/650 models of the DTR series. I recently re-batteried my DTR650 fleet with factory fresh new batteries. The legacy DTRs went EOL on November 30, 2018. Motorola support for the legacy DTRs ends on November 30, 2023. I expect batteries for the legacy DTRs (and iDEN phones using the same batteries) will start to become hard to find after 2023.

The battery I used is an aftermarket battery, 2000mAh and made by Artisan Power. This is higher capacity than the OEM high cap battery. $29 on Amazon.

Amazon.com: Artisan Power Replacement Battery for Motorola DTR410, DTR510 and DTR650. 2000 mAh : Electronics

Buy Artisan Power Replacement Battery for Motorola DTR410, DTR510 and DTR650. 2000 mAh: Batteries - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

Don't worry, factory fresh new batteries are still available for the i355.

 

[wwhitby]

The i355 uses the same battery as the legacy DTR410/550/650 models of the DTR series. I recently re-batteried my DTR650 fleet with factory fresh new batteries. The legacy DTRs went EOL on November 30, 2018. Motorola support for the legacy DTRs ends on November 30, 2023. I expect batteries for the legacy DTRs and iDEN phones using the same batteries will start to become hard to find after 2023.

Thanks! The last time I had checked, I could only find used batteries of questionable age. I need to start buying new batteries each month.

Warren

 

[n1das]

Would LOVE to have a base or mobile to work with these. Even if only 1W. All about that antenna!

At some point, you may want to consider upgrading to the DTR and/or the DLR series radios. I know the attraction to the Direct Talk capable iDEN phones is they are so dirt cheap to buy and people have boxes of them laying around. They are getting old and support for them ended long ago so it might be good to have an upgrade plan for the future.

The DTRs and the DLRs were a spinoff from the Direct Talk feature in iDEN phones and use the same 900MHz FHSS system (MOTOTALK platform). The DTRs differ only in software from the DT feature, supposedly done on purpose. I suspect the DTRs became incompatible with the DT feature in iDEN phones when DTR specific features were added to the DTRs. The DTRs and DLRs are the modern day implementation of the MOTOTALK platform. The DTRs and DLRs support private group calling in addition to private 1 to 1 calling. In DT capable iDEN phones, the only way to talk securely is with private 1 to 1 calling. The DTRs and DLRs give you more options for talking securely.

There is a repeater available for the DTRs and DLRs. It is based on a pair of DLR radios with custom firmware and connected together to function as a repeater. It differs from a conventional repeater in that transmit power is still limited to +30 dBm (1W) and has to be carefully located for best performance. The intended application is to extend coverage areas inside a large building and/or to fill in holes in coverage areas. The repeater has to be placed where the existing coverage area and the desired coverage area(s) overlap. I can see this being used inside a large high rise hotel or office building. It is not something you would normally stick on top of a mountain somewhere like with a conventional repeater, but it might be cool to try.

DRX Digital Range Extender for Motorola DLR and DTR Series Radios

The Cane Wireless DRX1020 Digital Range Extender allows you to maximize coverage of your Motorola DLR and DTR Series digital radios and bridge communication gaps across your entire on-site operation.

www.buytwowayradios.com

There is a desktop base radio available for the DLRs and DTRs. It is based on a DLR radio, so no external antenna connection is available. It's a bit pricey for what it is but I can see it being useful because of the convenience.

http://www.canewirelesspro.com/db-100-digital-desktop-radio.html

The only DTR models with a usable external antenna connection are the DTR550 and DTR650. These radios have a recessed male SMA connector. The 3" 1/4 wave and 6 5/8" 1/2 wave antennas available for them are the same antennas used on Motorola's MTX 9000 series commercial radios. My MTX9250 handheld uses the same antennas.

The new DTR600/700 models which replaced the legacy DTR410/550/650 models has a small threaded stud type connector. It is not usable for anything other than the stock 1/2 wave and optional helical stubby antenna.

 

[W5JG]

You can set them up as individual ID's, where you can talk one-to one and also setup groups as a broadcast to all units.

Please tell me how to setup a private group on these phones. I have several i576's. I have tried to figure out how to setup a private group, but failed. I can do private one-to-one calls. And of course, the calls to anyone on the same channel and code (public group) works as expected.

 

[wwhitby]

Please tell me how to setup a private group on these phones. I have several i576's. I have tried to figure out how to setup a private group, but failed. I can do private one-to-one calls. And of course, the calls to anyone on the same channel and code (public group) works as expected.

I'm trying to remember, but I believe Direct Talk mode limits you to all calls (everyone on the same channel and code) and one-to-one private calls. IIRC, you can set up private talkgroups on Direct Connect mode, but that's different than Direct Talk.

 

[n1das]

Please tell me how to setup a private group on these phones. I have several i576's. I have tried to figure out how to setup a private group, but failed. I can do private one-to-one calls. And of course, the calls to anyone on the same channel and code (public group) works as expected.

No Private Groups in Direct Talk mode on these ancient phones. Private Groups started with the DTR550 and DTR650 radios. The old DTR410 was the first of the legacy DTR models (DTR410/550/650) and also has no Private Groups.

If you want Private Groups, you will have to step up to a DTR550 or DTR650 among the legacy DTRs and DTR600 or DTR700 for the newer models. The tiny little DLR1020/1060 models of the DLR series can do Private Groups and is compatible with Private Groups in the DTRs.