Outagamie-Winnebago County System - new TG?

[BrightAntenna]

Greetings from a new member.

First off, I'm monitoring a Uniden SDS200 along with a number of analog-only scanners. I've been lurking for a few months mainly reading and getting up to speed learning ins and outs of the SDS200 and digital scanning in general.

I was monitoring the Outagamie-Winnebago County P25P1 Trunk system a week or two back on a particularly busy morning. The dispatcher reached Fireground 7 for assignment and I noticed that the action seemed to pop up on Unknown TG45111 instead of the Fireground 7 TG45107 as the database indicates.

Has anyone else noticed/confirmed this? Might it have already been reported to the database admin for update?
If confirmed, has a new use for TG45107 been identified?
And finally, has Fireground 8 also been assigned a new TG and old TG45108 also reassigned for some other purpose?

I've looked at the county wikis and didn't see any reference to TG45111 nor was it listed under unknown TGs.

I might have recordings with metadata for evidence, I would have to review what I saved from that monitoring session.

Thanks in advance,
Dan

 

[reedmschultz]

Hi Dan,

I'm a longtime listener of the Outagamie-Winnebago County system. Some of the fire departments have a local talk group which they utilize for training/events outside of the standard Fireground 2-8 channels which are used for active emergency scenes. Often times, you can look at the UID description if enabled on your SDS200 display, to identify which units are talking on the channel. Most of the Wiki pages have a "unit numbering" scheme which will display in the UID field on the scanner to align to the agency. Based on what I have programmed in my scanners (BCD436 & SDS100), I'm showing most traffic on TG45111 as being from the Little Chute Fire Department. LCFD UID's begin with 45836xx. Comms would reference for example 3601 (LCDF Chief), calling 3621 (LCFD Engine 1) or calling 3641 (LCFD Ladder 1). These local talk groups don't have constant activity but you'll see them used during busier times or events, like Halloween, parades, or coordinating initial response for example. Not every dept seems to have a local talk group as some will share a channel with 2-3 departments from listening as well.

Hope that helps share some guidance.

 

[BrightAntenna]

Thanks Reed, this could very well explain what I heard. I'm pretty sure I saved the recordings from that morning and I'm gonna listen again to that Fireground 7 assignment. I am familiar with UIDs but I haven't mapped names into my favorites lists yet. But I'll pay closer attention to who was assigned Fireground 7 and who was using 45111. Even if they are the same, I agree now it doesn't mean the Fireground 7 TGID has changed.

 

[BrightAntenna]

Some of the fire departments have a local talk group which they utilize for training/events outside of the standard Fireground 2-8 channels which are used for active emergency scenes. Often times, you can look at the UID description if enabled on your SDS200 display, to identify which units are talking on the channel.

I had a few moments to review the recordings of TGID 45111. This was all on 2/24/2026 and sounds like a response to a car accident primarily setting up road closure to isolate the accident scene. The UIDs involved were:
4504202
4584222
4504207
4524271
4514222
I'm out of time for the moment to look up these UIDs but I'll come back to it. I also want to review the dispatch comms to these units prior to switching to/activating this frequency.

 

[BrightAntenna]

Continuing from above post:

The UIDs appear to correspond to Town of Vanden Broek/Town of Kaukauna Fire Depts.

On 2/24 at 5:13pm on Outagamie Fire Main TGID 45101 I hear "4201" (4584271) tells "4202" (4504202) to switch to Fireground 7. Forty seconds later "4202" activates TGID 45111 for the first time (that my scanner caught it) during this day.

The channel named "Fireground 7" in the RRDB was not caught by my scanner at any time during this day.

It is very possible that, due to the very heavy traffic that day, my scanner was tied up on other hits and missed any activity on Fireground 7. It is also possible in those 40 seconds, perhaps "4202" did switch to Fireground 7 (and I didn't catch it) and was assigned to do something about shutting down traffic and decided to coordinate that effort on this "Unknown" TGID 45111.

I'm gonna review it again one more time from first dispatch to the close of call.

 

[BrightAntenna]

Either the traffic overwhelmed the scanner and I completely missed Fireground 7 traffic, or my scanner is somehow skipping that channel. While I was listening to the incident assigned to Fireground 7, the dispatcher also assigned Fireground 8. I did not hear any traffic on Fireground 8 either. I only heard traffic on Fire Main, Fireground 2 and Fireground 6 before & during this incident. Nothing is "avoided" and there is no obvious difference in how the channels are defined (all Fire-Tac and other parameters equal to channels 2,6). Possibly a discussion for the Uniden SDS Forum if I conclude I'm consistently missing traffic on some Fireground channels.

 

[BrightAntenna]

On the contrary!! I just checked the most recent Uniden database update and it now has TGID 45111/Fireground 7 and TGID 45112/Fireground 8. So, now we have to wonder, what happens with 45107 and 45108? They don't appear to be defined in the system for this database release.

 

[tvengr]

The Outagamie County Simulcast site shows a Site NAC of N4E2. I suspect it should be 4E2. That is obviously incorrect. Also, the Winnebago County Simulcast site shows only one control channel capable frequency.

 

[box23]

Likely submitted verbatim from what someone saw on their scanner display and entered into the database as is.

Just shorthand for indicating it is a NAC. "$4E2" is another, more common, method. Of course there is the general 0x4E2 for indicating a hexadecimal number.

 

[wx9kvh]

I just looked in a codeplug from a department issued radio that was updated late last year, FG 7 is 45111, and FG 8 is 45112. They did in fact used to be 45107 and 45108. Why they changed it is beyond me. But the current database information is correct.

 

[BrightAntenna]

Thanks! The database was updated within the past several weeks, sometime after I initially posted my observation. I suspect it was coincidence that the update went through around the same time.

 

[wx9kvh]

On the contrary!! I just checked the most recent Uniden database update and it now has TGID 45111/Fireground 7 and TGID 45112/Fireground 8. So, now we have to wonder, what happens with 45107 and 45108? They don't appear to be defined in the system for this database release.

I have a private instance of trunk-recorder running on a server in my basement and just went in and reprogrammed it to reflect the TG change for FG7 & FG8, and added 45107 and 45108 into the list of TG's to record to see if they start being used for anything. Will report back here if I hear anything on them as well as what type of traffic I am hearing.

 

[BrightAntenna]

That's great, I also kept the old TGs active as "old FG7" and "old FG8" to see if they are used for a new purpose. Likewise, if I catch any activity on either, I'll be sure to report it here.

 

[BrightAntenna]

The Outagamie County Simulcast site shows a Site NAC of N4E2. I suspect it should be 4E2.

After updating my SDS200 programming to confirm 4E2 works properly, I submitted a correction request for this. I don't have enough knowledge of the Winnebago County Simulcast site yet to provide info on which additional frequencies have control channel capability.

Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

 

[BrightAntenna]

The Outagamie County Simulcast site shows a Site NAC of N4E2. I suspect it should be 4E2. That is obviously incorrect. Also, the Winnebago County Simulcast site shows only one control channel capable frequency.

I received confirmation from database admin that the Outagamie County Simulcast site NAC has been corrected.